Post-Game Talk: It's true Jets lose 4-2

[LowLefty]

One thing that has really struck me the last two games is how poor our close puck support has been. They are playing so far off of one another, they’ve lost so many pucks in both ends because the puck carrier has lacked support in closer proximity.

Good point -
That was one of the areas that we had addressed a few games back - there was a noticeable improvement in how they managed the short passing game, especially on zone exits -
And then it was gone.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

You know your defense is bad when people want to immediately insert a 34 year old / 270+ lbs. player that hasn't touched any ice in the last 6 months.

 

[Adam da bomb]

How was Helly? How many of 4 goals were soft?

 

[Adam da bomb]

JoMo - Poolman
Dahlstrom - Pionk
Heinola - Kulikov

On the D.

Poor Perrault and Roslovic.

 

[googleIsMyFriend]

How was Helly? How many of 4 goals were soft?

None.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think this is correct. Wheeler is too much of a passenger on that line currently and doesn't add enough defense to make it functional with anyone but Ehlers. Laine - Scheif offense is too good to ignore.

Unfortunately I think it would also be problematic to have both Connor and Wheeler on the same line as some are suggesting.

It might be better to do something like:

Perreault - Little - Wheeler
Connor - Roslovic - Appleton (or Copp)

Don't disagree. Thought about C&W on the same line. But at least 2nd line gets easier matchups and the C might help enough with the defensive game, whether it is Little or Copp, or even Roslovic.

MP is good on the forecheck, not so much in the D zone. Copp on LW would help with D but lacks offense. I don't think we have an ideal 2 way 2nd line winger to plug in there other than Ehlers, and he is needed with Scheif and Laine. I think the solution might be to get Connor to better develop that side of his game.

 

[LowLefty]

Poor Perrault and Roslovic.

I like Ros with these 2 -
Last game, Lowry had a couple of golden opportunities to score but he can't finish - my lab has better hands
Both Lowry and Copp can dig out pucks - Ros shouldn't have to spend as much time on the boards and that might open him up for some scoring chances -
This could be a good line

 

[Ducky10]

I have to chuckle to myself at all the vitriol Myers and Chariot get in these forums, when it's obvious that they're so much better than what took their place. Meanwhile, we knew we got (blanked) by the Trouba trade. Yeah, Pionk is quick, skates well and can move the puck... but he is also useless at defending the front of the net, which opposition teams are now using as a tactic.

I have to chuckle that you think anyone believes Bitetto or Dahlstrom or even Poolman is better than Myers or even Chiarot for that matter. The point which seems to escape the people championing them now is how the hell the Jets were supposed to afford them given the cap. Would I like Myers and Chiarot back right now, as opposed to the other three I mentioned? Yep. Would I want then for a combined 10 million aav and the term?...……………….LOL, NO f***ING WAY!!!!

I find the lack of physical presence in front of the net thing pretty convenient though. The Jets got hosed last year from that area as well, especially with Chiarot on the ice. When I get the time I'll put a highlight package together illustrating how many times the Jets were burned in tight with both Chia and Myers looking around for the plot. They might have been big, they weren't much better though. It just supports the narrative is all.

 

[NorCalhockey]

It’s hilarious how short our window of opportunity was open for lol

Yeah, I asked this question in all seriousness a little while ago: Has any other team in the NHL have their "window" close as quickly as Winnipeg's?!
It's scary how much has changed in just two freakin' seasons!!!

 

[Board Bard]

I think what we are seeing is similar to what happened to our PP last year. Once one team figured it out, the word got around and every team knew how to defend it. This year, the word has got around that our D can't defend against an aggressive forecheck and is vulnerable to an aggressive backcheck, so now everyone is exploiting our weakness.

I'd add that other teams seem to feel they can rush right around the Jets D to get good opportunities from the close slot. There's not a lot speed or push-back to prevent it. It's happened several times already and I expect the frequency to rise as word spreads.

 

[rkp]

People are aware that neither Maurice or Chevy are on the ice, right.
Many of the teams forwards are lackadaisical with their defensive responsibilities and when we are down a goal or 2 think they can do it on their own by busting through the 5 guys from the other team and scoring.

I'd like to see if someone can find a team that was minus 4 D starters from one season to the next, including the entire right side and see what that teams record was.

If you want to rag on a coach in this city pick MOS who is incompetent and quite literally does not change or adapt , just stands on the sidelines with that idiotic balloon filled with jam face of his while his D.C. calls plays thst lose us games.

We couldn't and shouldn't have paid any of the players we lost in UFA what they got, 1 player wasn't ever going to sign and one player gave the team the big eff ewe the day training camp opened.

2 RFA's held out till the eve of the season, which is their right but those of you saying Chevy did nothing are even stupider than you look.

I've seen so many if Maurice wasn't so useless posts this is the lineup he'd put out there and some of those combos have been tried and if not and were tried and failed it would still be Maurice's fault.

Tanev is making more than we would pay him in Pittsburgh and for longer but our PK is suffering in part because we lost him.

And you want to rag on Copp. I don't really think he was ever meant to be or going to be a scorer and he's played more wing than C previously, no?

If you want to rag on a C how about Scheifele who can't seem to win a FO to save his life.

The point is this is a game of 20 players. We have a severely undermanned D corpse not because of management's fault because the it hands were pretty much tied as signing any one major or making a trade where salary might be comingin is difficult when you have no real idea what the outlay will be on players you need to sign, who had they been traded regardless of the return would have had the experts on here sharpening their knives.

Also Morrissey was the drizzling sh*ts last night and has been for a few games really. Must be Bitetto's, Letestu's and Maurices fault.

How about they are not buying into PoMo's line useage and system...Maybe PomO has lost the dressing room????

 

[Ducky10]

I like Ros with these 2 -
Last game, Lowry had a couple of golden opportunities to score but he can't finish - my lab has better hands
Both Lowry and Copp can dig out pucks - Ros shouldn't have to spend as much time on the boards and that might open him up for some scoring changes -
This could be a good line

Agreed, CLR is last year's CLT with some scoring talent. I wanted to see this line countless times last season when Rosie was glued to the 4th line and Tanev played ahead of him.

 

[NorCalhockey]

Posters on here were always complaining about Myers, and Chiarot --they didn't know a good thing when we had them. Tough to replace guys like that --especially with Buff and Trouba gone as well. I don't think we should expect much more than 500 hockey this year.

Good news is that the offense looks very explosive and fast --we just need rebuilding on the back end.

Raising my hand...I was one of those who thought Myers/Chiarot were meh to blech. Like you said, you don't know a good thing until it's gone....

 

[Board Bard]

Should flip Poolman and Kulikov, Kuli isn't a solution there but has looked better than Poolman against the harder comps so far.

Poolman is looking like he thinks his shift is a success if he manages to lug the puck to the red line for a dump in. And it probably is, given what the alternative is.

 

[DannyGallivan]

I find the lack of physical presence in front of the net thing pretty convenient though. The Jets got hosed last year from that area as well, especially with Chiarot on the ice. When I get the time I'll put a highlight package together illustrating how many times the Jets were burned in tight with both Chia and Myers looking around for the plot. They might have been big, they weren't much better though. It just supports the narrative is all.

The Jets were just as bad last year as this year? I don't think so.

 

[DannyGallivan]

Poolman is looking like he thinks his shift is a success if he manages to lug the puck to the red line for a dump in. And it probably is, given what the alternative is.

He's always been extremely limited in the skills department.

 

[DannyGallivan]

How was Helly? How many of 4 goals were soft?

His rebound control still needs work.

 

[ecolad]

Mo didn't switch with Copp - he almost ran him over trying to get to the puck carrier -
I agree with the bold - chaos will ensue with this type of D coverage.

The type of defensive zone coverage taught by Maurice/Huddy has been discussed a bit here over the years - as there has always been noticeable breakdowns. Some still believe that we use a basic man2man , while many (including myself) believe it is a hybrid. This means the D and C play man2man below the dots, with the forwards playing a loose zone between the dots and the blueline. If it is a hybrid, the D should not chase their man above the dots but rather release him to the forward. So in my mind , this was a breakdown by Morrissey, as you suggest.

If the coaches are in fact teaching a basic man2man, with all the rotation necessary as identified by Surixon, I could see two fundamental problems, Firstly, high danger scoring chances-against would go up as the rotation would lead directly to mismatches (ie the forward rotating down to netfront and having to box out or tie up the stick of an attacker-something that he has probably never done ). And secondly, after we regained puck possession, a structured quick breakout and transition would be seriously hindered ( our players starting from something quite different than their normal positions).

It is noteworthy that problems occured with our previous roster and continue with our current weakened roster - so I conclude the root cause rests with the coaching itself and not so much the players.

 

[mondo3]

I'm a bit surprised that I haven't seen more people wearing the newest style of jersey. Is it because people have "jersey fatigue", or perhaps just don't care for the new design?

 

[Duke749]

I’d rather a guy tie someone’s stick up instead of trying to push them around. Players can still score if you ignore their stick. If the stick is locked up, you can’t score unless the puck bounces off of you.

 

[rkp]

Someone wanted vets to be part of this team structure this season - likely after watching several walk away.
How stupid would you be, as a coach, not to play the players your boss signs (or signed)?
The young guys are the known quantity - it's the vets who were picked up later in the process- why?

How do you PoMO didn't ask Chevy to sign those players?

 

[rkp]

Its not all Maurice fault.

The team need a change up.

Hardest thing to do for me , is to fire people you like. But you have to do what you have to do, Chevy....

and what is that exactly, trade away our first round draft picks like what was done at the TDL the last couple of years, or one of our talented forwards? not going something in return worth what has or would be offered....MP has been bandied about as trade bait and yet no offers worth considering!!

 

[Ducky10]

The Jets were just as bad last year as this year? I don't think so.

Many nights they were just as bad, don't kid yourself. In some similar ways and in some different ways. I still think the physicality issue is a convenient narrative, it's recency bias at it's best. The Jets didn't keep teams away from the front of their net last season to any great effect. Chiarot and Myers being physical in that dept didn't help them win games in any meaningful way, same for Buff. I've lost count of how many times over the years I've seen Buff put one hand on top of the net and try to play the puck instead of taking his guy in front, he's famous for it.

The teams issue, much the same as last year, is defensive breakdowns and positioning. Which goals last night were due to the D getting bullied in front? It's not like Arizona had their way with the Jets in the slot all night, far from it.

1st goal, Scheif loses the puck in the corner, gets caught puck watching as his man goes to the net and tips in a point shot. Kuli tying his man up in front.

2nd goal, PP, Lowry gets yanked way out of position out wide, puck comes to the middle and Copp has to step up, puck goes to Kessel and Pionk has to step up, rebound comes into the middle and Lowry lets the guy slip in low. Pionk needs to do a better job of getting in Kessel's shooting lane.

3rd goal, Jets PK being the Jets PK, guy walks right in uncontested and scores. Kuli and Bitetto, two of the "larger" D the Jets actually have, with no clue and don't even try to move the guy setting up the screen. Saw Chiarot do the same thing last season more times than I can count.

4th goal, at least 3 guys lost the plot, nothing to do with a lack of net front.

The Jets aren't getting outmuscled on the back end, they're getting outskilled. The last two games the whole team has had way too many breakdowns and have been largely outworked.

 

[robertocarlos]

When the Jets start seeing many back-up goalies then you'll know the Jets are bad.

 

[AKAChip]

Raising my hand...I was one of those who thought Myers/Chiarot were meh to blech. Like you said, you don't know a good thing until it's gone....

Replacing bad players with other bad or worse players doesn’t make the original players good.