Prospect Info: Isles Prospect Talk 2019-20 | Part II

[xECK29x]

I keep forgetting Ishakov exists, until someone posted his name on this page.

He was once a second round pick. What's the general consensus on him on this board? Effectively written off?

Still too early to tell, he has flashes of unbelievable skill though and some scouts really love him, will he be an NHL player at his size and without incredible speed? Hard to say until he plays in the minors.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

I keep forgetting Ishakov exists, until someone posted his name on this page.

He was once a second round pick. What's the general consensus on him on this board? Effectively written off?

Anything but.

However, the odds have been against him since day 1.

He had a fine freshman year in college hockey, but the second year looked a bit more like stagnation.

We're going to have to wait this one out.

He'll only be mentioned around these parts if he does something special or starts experiencing some prolonged success.

 

[MJF]

Anything but.

However, the odds have been against him since day 1.

He had a fine freshman year in college hockey, but the second year looked a bit more like stagnation.

We're going to have to wait this one out.

He'll only be mentioned around these parts if he does something special or starts experiencing some prolonged success.

The fact that he keeps getting banged up worries me more than anything else. He's small and he can't seem to be able to avoid the board rattlers that keep getting him hurt.

 

[The Real JT]

The fact that he keeps getting banged up worries me more than anything else. He's small and he can't seem to be able to avoid the board rattlers that keep getting him hurt.

The hit he took early on into his freshman year still bothers me. It was a clean hit and one wonders if it's the end of his career if that happens again. Granted he could've avoided some of the trauma if he kept his head up but it's still a red flag.

Since he doesn't appear to be the feisty small guy type that sometimes has success in the NHL, he'll need to get by with high end skill +/- elusiveness. Those who have seen him play in person can comment better on whether his play can reach that high level, but I have to wonder.

He's still a prospect of course but I think it's fair to say he's less than a second round value at this point in time.

 

[MJF]

The hit he took early on into his freshman year still bothers me. It was a clean hit and one wonders if it's the end of his career if that happens again. Granted he could've avoided some of the trauma if he kept his head up but it's still a red flag.

Since he doesn't appear to be the feisty small guy type that sometimes has success in the NHL, he'll need to get by with high end skill +/- elusiveness. Those who have seen him play in person can comment better on whether his play can reach that high level, but I have to wonder.

Ge's still a prospect of course but I think it's fair to say he's less than a second round value at this point in time.

I have doubts about whether Ishkakov can protect himself on the ice.

 

[PWJunior]

I have doubts about whether Ishkakov can protect himself on the ice.

I'm more concerned about his ability to create time and space for himself. He is ridiculously skilled and can be elusive, but is it enough to play his game at the NHL level?

I get he was a swing for the fences with Wahlstrom already in tow in that draft, but it's not looking pretty to me at this point. He's going to need conditions to be perfect to succeed - specific types of linemates, specific role, etc.

 

[SI]

I'm more concerned about his ability to create time and space for himself. He is ridiculously skilled and can be elusive, but is it enough to play his game at the NHL level?

I get he was a swing for the fences with Wahlstrom already in tow in that draft, but it's not looking pretty to me at this point. He's going to need conditions to be perfect to succeed - specific types of linemates, specific role, etc.

I hated this pick SO much!

So many more worthwhile options on the board at that time.

 

[MJF]

I'm more concerned about his ability to create time and space for himself. He is ridiculously skilled and can be elusive, but is it enough to play his game at the NHL level?

I get he was a swing for the fences with Wahlstrom already in tow in that draft, but it's not looking pretty to me at this point. He's going to need conditions to be perfect to succeed - specific types of linemates, specific role, etc.

I think your point and mine kind of go hand in hand. He's not elusive enough and he's too small. Goes to skating and situational awareness.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

I hated this pick SO much!

So many more worthwhile options on the board at that time.

When that pick was made, all I could think about was our lack of depth up the middle and the fact that Akil Thomas, Benoit-Olivier Groulx, Filip Hallander, and David Gustafsson were still on the board...

It made me cringe.

Heck, even if the team wanted to go the Russian route, I couldn't understand taking him ahead of Marchenko and Morozov.

We just have to really hope he beats the odds.

 

[danteipp]

Unless something clicks next season and he starts to think on the ice faster, has a late growth spurt or magically becomes a better skater, I don't think this pick is going to work out.

It seems like after the Wahlstrom, Dobson and Wilde picks were made, they went for the boom/bust pick, when there were still some very solid players on the board that would have been safer and more projectable.

I hope he has a huge season next year and takes a big step forward, but I wouldn't bet the farm on it realistically happening.

 

[PWJunior]

Unless something clicks next season and he starts to think on the ice faster, has a late growth spurt or magically becomes a better skater, I don't think this pick is going to work out.

It seems like after the Wahlstrom, Dobson and Wilde picks were made, they went for the boom/bust pick, when there were still some very solid players on the board that would have been safer and more projectable.

I hope he has a huge season next year and takes a big step forward, but I wouldn't bet the farm on it realistically happening.

I think Wilde was a boom or bust pick too, the Isles could gamble with the "safe" Dobson already in the fold. There were serious concerns about Wilde's hockey IQ despite the dazzling tools. The move made complete sense and the positional value of being a RHD was the cherry on top.

Iskhakov was a gamble on his high end skill. The lack of size and burner speed made it a more considerable risk than the one made on Wilde.

 

[leeroggy]

When that pick was made, all I could think of was at our lack of depth up the middle and the fact that Akil Thomas, Benoit-Olivier Groulx, Filip Hallander, and David Gustafsson were still on the board...

It made me cringe.

Heck, even if the team wanted to go the Russian route, I couldn't understand taking him ahead of Marchenko and Morozov.

We just have to really hope he beats the odds.

I certainly agree on a lot of that. Pronman had him as a really high pick because of his perceived skill, which Pronman tends to overweight.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

I certainly agree on a lot of that. Pronman had him as a really high pick because of his perceived skill, which Pronman tends to overweight.

True, Pronman was really high on him (had him ranked like 17th or something), mentioning as a caveat (if I remember correctly) that he was simply in love with the skill-vision-hands combo and thought they were just outstanding in comparison with his draft peers, but couldn't really forecast if they'd ever mean a thing on NHL ice in light of the below-average size combined with no second gear or particularly encouraging agility.

I've seen so many incredibly talented small players in European leagues who were little more than a spit in the bucket and even in the European leagues, on this bigger ice, they're dead once they get a bomb. Their skating is better than average in these leagues, but often still not enough to avoid the rough stuff. It becomes quite obvious why they don't make it in North America without outstanding skating abilities.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

I think Wilde was a boom or bust pick too, the Isles could gamble with the "safe" Dobson already in the fold. There were serious concerns about Wilde's hockey IQ despite the dazzling tools. The move made complete sense and the positional value of being a RHD was the cherry on top.

You know, I know what you're trying to get at here, but I don't really agree with the boom or bust thing for the exact reasons you mentioned in your second and third sentence PLUS the fact that he's an absolute physical beast.

He was talked about a lot before that draft and I remember him being seen as a likely top 5 pick two years before his draft.

For the reasons you mention, he ended up just falling into our laps.

I think most pundits out there would likely be quick to admit that even if the concerns about his hockey IQ prove legitimate, he should still be able to make it much in the same capacity as Zach Bogosian. There are just too many other tools there not to be able to etch out an NHL career if he really wants one.

 

[PWJunior]

You know, I know what you're trying to get at here, but I don't really agree with the boom or bust thing for the exact reasons you mentioned in your second and third sentence PLUS the fact that he's an absolute physical beast.

He was talked about a lot before that draft and I remember him being seen as a likely top 5 pick two years before his draft.

For the reasons you mention, he ended up just falling into our laps.

I think most pundits out there would likely be quick to admit that even if the concerns about his hockey IQ prove legitimate, he should still be able to make it much in the same capacity as Zach Bogosian. There are just too many other tools there not to be able to etch out an NHL career if he really wants one.

I remember seriously considering Wilde with #10 or #12 because of my long standing desire for a stud RHD. I didn't expect Dobson to be available (he was my #1 prospect crush), I wanted nothing to do with Bouchard, and I would have been ok with Ty Smith despite being a 5'10 LHD - his all around style fit my preference of the type of player. I loved Wilde's tools, but I was a little uneasy spending such a high pick on him because of his supposed shortcomings. I would have accepted him in the 1st, but I wouldn't have lost my shit like I did when we got Dobson.

Your Bogosian comparable is very interesting and I love it. Back in 2008 when my RHD obsession started, Pietrangelo was my Dobson and Wilde was my Bogosian. 2018, we got them both. Haha.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

BTW, Blade Jenkins has until June 1st to be signed or we lose his rights.

Of course, I "believe" he can be signed to an AHL contract and then even loaned back to the OHL for next season.

I'm not certain though.

I haven't got a copy of it now, but there is a rather long list of players in his situation throughout the league and many of them are guys who put up a decent amount of points in the CHL this season.

 

[mm11]

BTW, Blade Jenkins has until June 1st to be signed or we lose his rights.

Of course, I "believe" he can be signed to an AHL contract and then even loaned back to the OHL for next season.

I'm not certain though.

I haven't got a copy of it now, but there is a rather long list of players in his situation throughout the league and many of them are guys who put up a decent amount of points in the CHL this season.

So do the isles feel he is not sharp enough???

 

[MJF]

So do the isles feel he is not sharp enough???

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

So do the isles feel he is not sharp enough???

Slow day, eh?

 

[steveat]

Re Blade: Unless he's another Brendan Kichton (sp?) then he should be signed. This is probably a value signing in that they don't want to start a contract too soon to work out the books better. Accounting stuff.

Re: Ishakov: Don't look too deeply into his foot speed. This game is fast, we know that and it's what is needed to be successful in the long term in this league. There are two types of fast though which people forget. There's fast skating and fast moving.

Fast skating + Slow moving = Grabner

Iskhakov is a fast mover. His one timer/release is NHL calibre. I would say top 10-20%..

Another example is the Bruins. Slower skating team but quick moving team. pass pass pass ...shoot.

I think within the next 2 years we are going to have a very different lineup...just not sure who's coming, who's going and who's stepping up from the minors.

 

[PK Cronin]

Re Blade: Unless he's another Brendan Kichton (sp?) then he should be signed. This is probably a value signing in that they don't want to start a contract too soon to work out the books better. Accounting stuff.

Re: Ishakov: Don't look too deeply into his foot speed. This game is fast, we know that and it's what is needed to be successful in the long term in this league. There are two types of fast though which people forget. There's fast skating and fast moving.

Fast skating + Slow moving = Grabner

Iskhakov is a fast mover. His one timer/release is NHL calibre. I would say top 10-20%..

Another example is the Bruins. Slower skating team but quick moving team. pass pass pass ...shoot.

I think within the next 2 years we are going to have a very different lineup...just not sure who's coming, who's going and who's stepping up from the minors.

To further the point I think you're making, there's a difference between quickness and speed. Quickness has more to do with agility and the pace at which you can certain things, while speed is how fast a player can move up and down the ice.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

Re Blade: Unless he's another Brendan Kichton (sp?) then he should be signed. This is probably a value signing in that they don't want to start a contract too soon to work out the books better. Accounting stuff.

Uhhh, he has to be signed by June 1st or his rights are forfeited.

Not only could he re-enter the draft, but I think our owning of his rights discontinue.

I think we could give him an AHL contract, but that would first have to come after the draft, granted no-one takes him.

Re: Ishakov: Don't look too deeply into his foot speed. This game is fast, we know that and it's what is needed to be successful in the long term in this league. There are two types of fast though which people forget. There's fast skating and fast moving.

Except that Iskhakov has neither straight-ahead speed nor particularly special agility and jump.

As others have mentioned above, no matter what the skill set is, if he can't constantly avoid the brain-jiggling hits, i.e. protect himself through his ability to sidestep or avoid the big hits, then we don't even need to continue talking about him as a possible prospect.

 

[scott99]

I hated this pick SO much!

So many more worthwhile options on the board at that time.

I agree with this, and mentioned that when we drafted him. We've been through this before. If you are going to draft someone who's tiny, they need to have great speed. He does not have great speed. We've been through this before with Cammarata. That kid had great hands, but was not a great skater, I see the same thing from Ishkabibble,

 

[PROMputt]

Regarding the Iskhakov pick. I wanted Akil Thomas in that spot and still like him. But before everyone goes writing off the pick. You all do know that only 2 players have played a game in the NHL outside the first round from this draft and 14 from the first round have not played a NHL game yet. It is WAY to early to make predictions on anyone from the 18 draft.

 

[SI90]