Post-Game Talk: Islanders 4, Penguins 3 - Well That Sucks

[ZorkEnchanter]

What no-one is talking about with this goal is that because there is no backside help, if TJ challenges the puck like everyone is asking for, Eberle simply just drags it across the crease for an empty net. Lee did the exact same thing later in the period that TJ stopped because he didn't fully commit to challenging the puck.

Matthews scored almost the exact same goal last night with Holtby in the same position as TJ. It's like if you get walked but a goal scorer that close to the goal you're often gonna get scored on.

Yeah, I should have said "Might have..." Forward with skill and full control of puck, easily walks defensemen, and is basically on the doorstep. Eberle could have went either way. I did mention it was a sweet backhand topshelf

 

[ZorkEnchanter]

Sully could employ a more conservative approach to the D system and I think that would solve a lot. A lot of goals against Jarry are in close (and some unchecked) because our system is too aggressive. Don’t leave guys unattended in front and things will change.

That’s not absolving Jarry but the coaches knew the goaltending situation prior to the season and still gambled on our style and haven’t really changed even though it’s not working and we are 20% of the way through the season.

He does when we lose one of the Big 2 then we go on a tear, the stars come back. He capitulates and gives said star back "his" wingers. Then we lose...

It's been this way over a few years....

 

[ChaosAgent]

I also want to say for Varlamov that both POJ and Malkin's goals were save-able. Not easy but they were.

I really think people are overrating the quality of the Penguins chances as compared to teams they play.

Varlamov made one truly spectacular save yesterday - the one on Crosby. Rust semi-boofed an open net chance and Malkin tried snapping a puck 5-hole from 18 feet out when he should have walked in and tried to deke (in fairness he scored on his next shift so there's that).

I mean the Isles second goal was a set of 5 players in a 15 foot box with no clue what they were doing, allowing a dangerous shot that was saved and getting beaten to a rebound. Our defense is the core problem but it's fair to say that we need our goalies to do better at stealing games for us so we can better tread water. And by do better, I mean do it at all. Like MM did mid-season in '18-'19 when he was superb.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

.857 save percentage

 

[Tom Hanks]

I mean, the goal was clearly Letang’s fault. But I find it funny that people criticize Letang in a game where he was on the ice for all three goals for and one goal against at 5v5.

Well we were leading with 10 or so minutes to go so a high risk low reward play was absolutely not needed. So situationally it’s a big deal in terms of the game.

The fact that he looked at his man on his own twice and still ignored him is really infuriating.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

If McCann is out for next game and ZAR is back, I’d like to see Sceviour in over Lafferty. I’d also like to see O’Connor in McCann’s spot to see what he can do with better line mates. I’d also put Weber in for Ruhwedel, hisbolay seems to diminish when he’s played too much. I thought Malkin and Kapanen showed some chemistry last night.

Guentzel Crosby Rust
Zucker Malkin Kapanen
O’Connor Blueger Tanev
Aston-Reese Jankowski Sceviour

Joseph Letang
Matheson Marino
Weber Ceci

I am not a big Ruhwedel fan as anything but a #7-8 defensman and even I thought he was fine last night when considering Weber ad an option. Once Pettersson comes back Ruhwedel would be the defensman I would sit but not now.

 

[The Grim Reaper]

2. That Hornqvist for Matheson parting gift from Jim Rutherford is one where the franchise is going to pay the price for years.

The move didn’t make sense then and looks absolutely horrible now. The only thing I can reason is that he clashed with Sullivan, and for some reason, Sullivan has ownership by the balls (probably because they’re cheap).

Hornqvist brought heart, energy, fight, and determination every game (something this team has zero of right now). I always considered him the real leader on the team (obviously I’m not in the locker room, just by eye test and interaction with players on the bench). The move makes zero sense. All the unappreciated things he did on the PP, you see the result of not having him on the PP now. The Pens really think 150lbs Jake can play in the dirty areas? Christ...

That move pisses me off more than the JJ signing.

 

[Al Smith]

Someone asked why Lafferty took the faceoff last night on the PK. Here's his percentage from last season/not good. Looks like Jank or Sid would have been better options (didn't need stats for that). TB was in the box, of course, but his percentage on the PK still sucks.

Pittsburgh Penguins- Face-off stats - 2020 - defensive zone shorthanded - Puckbase

Pittsburgh Penguins- Face-off stats - 2019 - defensive zone shorthanded - Puckbase

 

[Pancakes]

Someone asked why Lafferty took the faceoff last night on the PK. Here's his percentage from last season/not good. Looks like Jank or Sid would have been better options (didn't need stats for that). TB was in the box, of course, but his percentage on the PK still sucks.

Pittsburgh Penguins- Face-off stats - 2020 - defensive zone shorthanded - Puckbase

Pittsburgh Penguins- Face-off stats - 2019 - defensive zone shorthanded - Puckbase

I don't get why Lafferty even gets played. He sucks. But I guess we're lacking options.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I mean, the goal was clearly Letang’s fault. But I find it funny that people criticize Letang in a game where he was on the ice for all three goals for and one goal against at 5v5.

Situational hockey matters.

Why the hell would you check your assignment (twice), then decide to go behind the net when Squirt players know to stay home there?

Like, who gives a shit about what he did the rest of the game when he makes a boneheaded mistake like that.

He’s my favorite player on the team, but I’m not going to try and pass off his backbreaking mistake on Jarry.

Letang absolutely cost them the game last night and I’m 100% sure he knows as much.

 

[Pancakes]

For everyone shitting on our goalies, are u watching this flyers caps game

I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure we statistically still have the worst goaltending in the league.

 

[Al Smith]

I don't get why Lafferty even gets played. He sucks. But I guess we're lacking options.

I'm not sure what Sceviour did to get benched, except maybe ask Sully about Riiko's whereabouts.

 

[BlindWillyMcHurt]

Someone asked why Lafferty took the faceoff last night on the PK. Here's his percentage from last season/not good. Looks like Jank or Sid would have been better options (didn't need stats for that). TB was in the box, of course, but his percentage on the PK still sucks.

Pittsburgh Penguins- Face-off stats - 2020 - defensive zone shorthanded - Puckbase

Pittsburgh Penguins- Face-off stats - 2019 - defensive zone shorthanded - Puckbase

Even Malkin would have been a better choice. Not one that I'D have made but better than Laff.

This team pretty clearly gets idea about players in their heads (Simon, ZAR, Erod, etc) and has a hard time shaking them despite results. Somehow it seems like they've convinced themselves that Lafferty is this guy just waiting to break big and I just don't understand.

Sceviour, meanwhile, is sitting on the bench. Not a world beater sure but what the hell?

 

[Pancakes]

I'm not sure what Sceviour did to get benched, except maybe ask Sully about Riiko's whereabouts.

Yeah Sceviour isn't all that either but he might occasionally score a goal at least.

Lafferty is totally useless.

 

[vikingGoalie]

i don’t agree with this...I’ve seen Pens teams absolutely get dejected by goalie play and play accordingly (lack of effort)...I’m not saying that’s what happened last night but I do think they played hard in the second and third periods with Jarry making big stops that allowed them to tie the game and then take a lead...what came first? mistakes were made after that w tying goal being on Letang but Jarry was a big letdown on the go ahead goal

in fact that's what Murray did when he first came up he played a big blocking style goalie just remained calm, make a few big saves and the our team would get it going. Thing is I have played as a goalie for quite a while. While our goalies are not getting any favors, you have to hold the short side and not get beat by the shot on that eberle goal. I know the risk of getting walked and perhaps (have to look at it again) Jarry was reading that his defender couldn't stop him from going across.
but high level shooters if you give a corner like that they will beat you too many times. Make them make the move, last year Jarry would've challenged the shooter and been able to move laterally with him if he tried to do so.

That and the winner which leaked through him to be tapped in was just not good. Jarry needs to settle down in net. This is shades of hyper fleury. Calm fleury is an elite goalie, hyper bounce around Fleury can be elite and terrible all in the same game. Still I think Jarry can be a very good goalie for us, he just needs to believe in himself and settle down some.

I still think we need a different goalie coach. Bales was much better then buckley.

 

[heysmilinstrange]

I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure we statistically still have the worst goaltending in the league.

I'm pretty sure Ottawa still does, but Murray's last two games were .920+ so things may have changed. Marcus Hogberg's are still very poor.

 

[CascadiaPenguin]

Someone asked why Lafferty took the faceoff last night on the PK. Here's his percentage from last season/not good. Looks like Jank or Sid would have been better options (didn't need stats for that). TB was in the box, of course, but his percentage on the PK still sucks.

Pittsburgh Penguins- Face-off stats - 2020 - defensive zone shorthanded - Puckbase

Pittsburgh Penguins- Face-off stats - 2019 - defensive zone shorthanded - Puckbase

The Lafferty FO decision still baffles me. Didn't it come after a TV timeout, to boot? WTF?

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

the fact that Yohe is calling him out in unprecedent way, never heard before, tells me that many people in the organization feel the same about Tanger otherwise Yohe would not dare to be vocal about his on ice gaffes....Tanger has always played the ame game its just that he is not raking up points anymore and his mistakes become more highlighted (he is still driving plays and tilting the ice)

Unfortunately with Letang you are going to have to take the good with the bad. Overall he helps the team win but at times he tries to do it all himself and costs us a game. I remember game 6 2018 Caps loss Letang single handily lost that game going over to his left to go after the puck carrier when Dumoulin was already over and in position. That last goal was literally all Letang. Don't get me wrong the reason we lost that series was because Murray was badly outplayed but even then we still had a chance to go to game 7 and beat them a 3rd year in a row I'd not for that bonehead decision.

I still want to keep Letang but he is frustrating at times. Letang cost us the game but honestly so did Blueger with that clearing attempt. Team played one of their better games of the year with great pressure and scoring chances and certainly better than many of their wins but those few mistakes cost you when a goaltender makes some nice saves.

 

[radapex]

On the whole I agree with you. Holtby in Vancouver is a nice example of that, he's sporting an .888 on he seasons. Having said that, tonight it felt like the Isles scored on 4 out of 6 chances. Maybe I'm off on that, just going on my gut feeling. I'm not expecting Jarry to be a world beater, but I am expecting him to at least be around .900, or a middle of the pack goalie. He played in front of a fairly similar defense last year and faired much better,

Holtby had a .897 SV% on a pretty good Washington team last season. He was 191-73-31 with a 2.31 GAA and .922 SV% through the end of the 2016-17 season; the league started shrinking goalie equipment in 2017, and he's gone 94-53-15 with a 3.00 GAA and .905 SV% since. Him sitting at a .888 SV% with the Canucks is basically just following the trajectory he's been on.

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

I'm pretty sure Ottawa still does, but Murray's last two games were .920+ so things may have changed. Marcus Hogberg's are still very poor.

It's not been pretty but neither are the quality chances we have been giving. Granted most of those was the early games and I think the team is playing much better 5v5 hockey lately.

 

[DearDiary]

The team is playing well enough to have a chance to win every game at 5on5, that's even with the struggles by the Pens top players.

Even just below average play by Crosby/Malkin/Guentzal and the PK/PP the Pens might be leading the division.

That's why I hope the team isn't discouraged. Everything can be fixed without any roster changes. The PP/PK is the main issue because if Crosby/Malkin were picking up PP points then they wouldn't be giving up on plays like usual when things aren't going their way.

What I find most worrying is Sullivan is having them play as if Bonino and Cole are still on the team. No one other than Tanev will block shots, no Dman will clear the crease. Marino is the biggest offender, too many times I've seen scoring chances against because he goes stick on stick instead of going for the body.

 

[Victor Z]

The issue of not having D men that clear the crease is something that has plagued this team for years. Our players get their asses best into the ice when they get in the slot or the crease, while we allow opposing players to camp out in front of the net and order pizzas.

That's what happens when the defense is, to quote a former coach, "so soff". It's been this way for years and years.

Not one person on the D can move Anders Lee (hell, they'd have trouble moving Theron Fleury), and the coaches know it. So instead of putting a guy on Lee and making the goalie try to see the puck through TWO guys -- or putting 2 D near the crease and making the goalie see through THREE guys -- the plan is obviously to just ignore Lee (or whoever the other team puts there) and leave him 1-on-1 with the netminder.

So what happened on the game-losing goal was exactly the likeliest outcome: a puck sitting in the crease waiting to be slam dunked while the Pens' d-men are distant spectators. Even if the new GM brings in a big physical defenseman, would the coach let him play that way?

 

[CrosbyMalkin]

Holtby had a .897 SV% on a pretty good Washington team last season. He was 191-73-31 with a 2.31 GAA and .922 SV% through the end of the 2016-17 season; the league started shrinking goalie equipment in 2017, and he's gone 94-53-15 with a 3.00 GAA and .905 SV% since. Him sitting at a .888 SV% with the Canucks is basically just following the trajectory he's been on.

That goalie shrinking of equipment was a big reason Murray stopped being a dominant goalie. Murray was not the athlete Fleury was but was very good at positioning himself to let the puck hit him. I noticed immediately that equipment shrinkage hurt him more than most goalies. I still think Murray is a decent NHL goalie but with the old equipment I think he is still a top 10 type goalie.

 

[Gurglesons]

Situational hockey matters.

Why the hell would you check your assignment (twice), then decide to go behind the net when Squirt players know to stay home there?

Like, who gives a shit about what he did the rest of the game when he makes a boneheaded mistake like that.

He’s my favorite player on the team, but I’m not going to try and pass off his backbreaking mistake on Jarry.

Letang absolutely cost them the game last night and I’m 100% sure he knows as much.

I am blaming Letang. But, I also want Jarry to make saves. And he ain’t.

Also, last night ultimately lies at Bleuger’s feet.

 

[ColePens]

I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure we statistically still have the worst goaltending in the league.

As always..

We could be a good team with our current goaltending

We chose those route for cap space.

People shit over muzz incorrectly, IMO.

Team system is number one issue. Fire sully