Is this defence good enough?

[surixon]

I don't know if you want to invest in a top 4 defenseman, since that's 3-4 million (see Chiarot-Kulikov), and you have Heinola and Samberg both in the fight. De-Melo is the one you need for RH depth. I'd like to bring back a Beaulieu/Sbisa to be the PK leader, Sbisa can play top 4 too, if needed. Poolman is looking good on a 3rd pairing, and has Kovacevic behind him, who might be ready next year. The left side is more uncertain with Samberg, Heinola, Chisholm, Stanley all on ELCs, and with about 8 NHL games between them. Dahlstrom is signed, and he's probably #7/8, with Niku being pretty uncertain, as to where he fits (could he become a forward?).

We are also going to need someone that meets the expansion draft requirements. I am ok paying juat cash for say Dillion and having him as an attractive option for Seattle next offseason.

They take him and we keep our forward depth and meanwhile Samberg/Heinola get another year of seasoning under them.

 

[voyageur]

We are also going to need someone that meets the expansion draft requirements. I am ok paying juat cash for say Dillion and having him as an attractive option for Seattle next offseason.

They take him and we keep our forward depth and meanwhile Samberg/Heinola get another year of seasoning under them.

That seems like money wasted to me. If you are going to sign a player just to put him in the expansion draft the following season. Since it is pretty much a consensus that the 3 d are Morrissey, Pionk, and De Melo if he re-signs. Is Brendan Dillon worth the investment? How far off are Heinola and Samberg? I think both could be top 4 next year. Especially since playing with Pionk is pretty easy. I'd rather re-sign BooBoo for 2 years, since it makes De Melo easier to re-sign, and put him up for the expansion draft, because he has already fit into the team, and knows his role.

 

[Adam da bomb]

That seems like money wasted to me. If you are going to sign a player just to put him in the expansion draft the following season. Since it is pretty much a consensus that the 3 d are Morrissey, Pionk, and De Melo if he re-signs. Is Brendan Dillon worth the investment? How far off are Heinola and Samberg? I think both could be top 4 next year. Especially since playing with Pionk is pretty easy. I'd rather re-sign BooBoo for 2 years, since it makes De Melo easier to re-sign, and put him up for the expansion draft, because he has already fit into the team, and knows his role.

So you’re losing your drive for jets to get Hammer?

 

[voyageur]

So you’re losing your drive for jets to get Hammer?

A little bit. The flat cap makes it hard to sign him long-term. He'd be exposed in the draft. When you crunch the numbers it's hard to re-sign De Melo, and I 'd like to re-sign Eakin, and then give raises to Laine and Pionk the year following. Then there is Lowry and Copp. I'd like to keep one of them. If Hamonic signs cheap, like 2.5 million, maybe, but Tucker Poolman has had a pretty good year, if he is the 3RD as 775 000 that's money to invest elsewhere.

If De Melo doesn't come back, then yeah I'd like so see Hamonic in a Jets jersey, for sure.

 

[surixon]

That seems like money wasted to me. If you are going to sign a player just to put him in the expansion draft the following season. Since it is pretty much a consensus that the 3 d are Morrissey, Pionk, and De Melo if he re-signs. Is Brendan Dillon worth the investment? How far off are Heinola and Samberg? I think both could be top 4 next year. Especially since playing with Pionk is pretty easy. I'd rather re-sign BooBoo for 2 years, since it makes De Melo easier to re-sign, and put him up for the expansion draft, because he has already fit into the team, and knows his role.

Yes I think Dillion would be worth the 3 to 4 million wed pay him. Also top 4 dmen are pretty portable so if he doesn't get chosen and Samberg/Heinola are ready then we can trade him for some assets.

I hoghly doubt Heinola is anywhere near close to playing top 4 here. He's only 18 and needs to fill out amd debelop his defensive game. He's at minnimum another year away and there is no shame in that.

Samberg I think is NHL caliber but I don't want to juat pencil him into a top 4 role. If he earns it bu beating out a good vet then great but heay not be ready for that role.

 

[voyageur]

Yes I think Dillion would be worth the 3 to 4 million wed pay him. Also top 4 dmen are pretty portable so if he doesn't get chosen and Samberg/Heinola are ready then we can trade him for some assets.

I hoghly doubt Heinola is anywhere near close to playing top 4 here. He's only 18 and needs to fill out amd debelop his defensive game. He's at minnimum another year away and there is no shame in that.

Samberg I think is NHL caliber but I don't want to juat pencil him into a top 4 role. If he earns it bu beating out a good vet then great but heay not be ready for that role.

Right there is the problem. If you are trying to sign a player, you are signing him to say hey we are going to trade you as soon as we grow our other options. That's a red flag for players, especially if they have families and are making the commitment to live somewhere. I like Dillon, I just think the market will take him elsewhere.

Heinola looked like a top 4 defenseman in most of his games last year. Very heady. Only reason he didn't stay is it didn't make sense for the organization. Samberg will be 22 by January of next year, so he's already pretty mature. Too high risk for me to add another top 4 d. Like I said I would re-sign Boo Boo. Maybe $1.5 million AAV over 2 years. Already knows the team. As he trains offseason with De Melo, kind of keeps friendships built on the team, which is part of the family building process.

If De Melo chooses to go elsewhere then I look at other options.

 

[surixon]

Right there is the problem. If you are trying to sign a player, you are signing him to say hey we are going to trade you as soon as we grow our other options. That's a red flag for players, especially if they have families and are making the commitment to live somewhere. I like Dillon, I just think the market will take him elsewhere.

Heinola looked like a top 4 defenseman in most of his games last year. Very heady. Only reason he didn't stay is it didn't make sense for the organization. Samberg will be 22 by January of next year, so he's already pretty mature. Too high risk for me to add another top 4 d. Like I said I would re-sign Boo Boo. Maybe $1.5 million AAV over 2 years. Already knows the team. As he trains offseason with De Melo, kind of keeps friendships built on the team, which is part of the family building process.

If De Melo chooses to go elsewhere then I look at other options.

Heinola was getting crushed in a very sheltered bottom pairing role. I think his early offensive success masked just how far away he is. Much like with how Scheifele shooting out the lights in his first camp. Everyone thought he was nearly ready to but we all know it took him another two years after to Crack the roster and a year after that to Crack the top 6.

He went back to Finland and was just ok in their men's league. We need to be patient with our prospects and develop them properly. Rushing everyone to the show isn't smart as we have seeb with countless other orgs. I think the Morrissey timeline to a top 4 role is realistic for him.

Samberg will be given every opportunity to make the team and contribute but i feel if the team is going to want to contend they need contingency plan for the top 4 left d slot.

 

[voyageur]

Heinola was getting crushed in a very sheltered bottom pairing role. I think his early offensive success masked just how far away he is. Much like with how Scheifele shooting out the lights in his first camp. Everyone thought he was nearly ready to but we all know it took him another two years after to Crack the roster and a year after that to Crack the top 6.

He went back to Finland and was just ok in their men's league. We need to be patient with our prospects and develop them properly. Rushing everyone to the show isn't smart as we have seeb with countless other orgs. I think the Morrissey timeline to a top 4 role is realistic for him.

Samberg will be given every opportunity to make the team and contribute but i feel if the team is going to want to contend they need contingency plan for the top 4 left d slot.

Ok you are remembering things incorrectly. I don't know how you can say he was crushed in a sheltered role, when he started off the season on a 4 game road trip, where he definitely wasn't sheltered, and played with Pionk, twice over 20 minutes. The Isles games wasn't his best if I remember. But I remember we beat Pittsburgh on the road, and he had a strong game. The home game against Pittsburgh he was sat out, in favour of Dahlstrom, and that was a disaster. In fact the 2 games he sat out on the home stand brought us from 4-2, to 4-4.

5 points in 8 games, was a front runner for the Calder, a +3 was nice, and even the Corsi was above 50%. I am not sure where he got crushed.

I would still plan to start him on the Moose. To QB their PP, and take reps on the PK. But he's going to be a good one, that is going to be one of my favourite draft picks, especially as we got it for Trouba.

Samberg is more NHL ready, and I'd be looking to slot him right into Kulikov's role. If he plays 3rd pairing with Poolman that's good too. But the need for that top 4 defenseman may be overstated, given the potential we already have. A stop gap might be it, and maybe that player is already here.

 

[PhilJets]

Just need 5 solid Dmen and 1 anchor.

Jets have star/superstars in every position except defense.
Someone needs to stand up and take it now that Buff is not the alpha male there anymore.

 

[Krauser]

He went back to Finland and was just ok in their men's league.

Heinola put up a 59.0% Corsi in Liiga this year, the best mark on his team and one of the best in the league — 15th highest of all skaters, and 5th of all D (who played more than 10 games)

Player stats | Advanced | Regular season 2019-2020 | Stats | Liiga

 

[ps241]

Heinola was getting crushed in a very sheltered bottom pairing role. I think his early offensive success masked just how far away he is. Much like with how Scheifele shooting out the lights in his first camp. Everyone thought he was nearly ready to but we all know it took him another two years after to Crack the roster and a year after that to Crack the top 6.

He went back to Finland and was just ok in their men's league. We need to be patient with our prospects and develop them properly. Rushing everyone to the show isn't smart as we have seeb with countless other orgs. I think the Morrissey timeline to a top 4 role is realistic for him.

Samberg will be given every opportunity to make the team and contribute but i feel if the team is going to want to contend they need contingency plan for the top 4 left d slot.

I was the guy calling for Samberg in the 2nd round before we drafted him. He has made some huge level jumps in his career.

exhibit A: He was playing in the smaller high school league in Minnesota the year he was drafted. The next season he made the jump to the NCAA National championship team and by the end of the season was trusted against the other teams best in the last minute in 1 goal games.

Exhibit B: that same year he made Team USA world Juniors and played on the best and safest pair with Adam Fox.

Exhibit C: just the maturation to the heavy minute munching bad ass on the best NCAA team.

Also he is physically mature at 6’4” 215. His strength is his defensive game and mobility and we are short on that. He also took the 3rd year in college and drove up his PPG totals. I sense Maurice will love him due to a bias on his prototype alone.

With all that being said I would love Dillion to round out our top 4 next year. Let Samberg adjust to the pro game in a lower pressure role on the bottom pair and wait for injuries or Even if he needs time on the Moose. Even if he is ready out of camp having 5 top 4 D assets would be a huge luxury for us.

I want more talent on our D core and if we started with a very legit top 4 and had guys like Samberg in the wings then that would be a major level jump for our talent base and we could be ready to contend again IMO.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

That seems like money wasted to me. If you are going to sign a player just to put him in the expansion draft the following season. Since it is pretty much a consensus that the 3 d are Morrissey, Pionk, and De Melo if he re-signs. Is Brendan Dillon worth the investment? How far off are Heinola and Samberg? I think both could be top 4 next year. Especially since playing with Pionk is pretty easy. I'd rather re-sign BooBoo for 2 years, since it makes De Melo easier to re-sign, and put him up for the expansion draft, because he has already fit into the team, and knows his role.

That investment gives us a decent top 4 next year, allows Samberg to ease in on the 3rd pair and provides someone Seattle might actually take. We have to lose someone. Better him than someone we have longer term plans for. And even if they don't take him, it meets a requirement that we must fulfill, one way or another.

I suggest we consider Jon Merrill for that role though. Younger and cheaper than Dillon, decent defensively. Would fulfill the XD requirement and if Samberg pushes him down to 3rd pair after 1 season, he is not so expensive that he can't play 3rd pair, or be traded.

 

[surixon]

That investment gives us a decent top 4 next year, allows Samberg to ease in on the 3rd pair and provides someone Seattle might actually take. We have to lose someone. Better him than someone we have longer term plans for. And even if they don't take him, it meets a requirement that we must fulfill, one way or another.

I suggest we consider Jon Merrill for that role though. Younger and cheaper than Dillon, decent defensively. Would fulfill the XD requirement and if Samberg pushes him down to 3rd pair after 1 season, he is not so expensive that he can't play 3rd pair, or be traded.

I would be fine with him as well. What do you think he'd cost?

 

[voyageur]

I was the guy calling for Samberg in the 2nd round before we drafted him. He has made some huge level jumps in his career.

exhibit A: He was playing in the smaller high school league in Minnesota the year he was drafted. The next season he made the jump to the NCAA National championship team and by the end of the season was trusted against the other teams best in the last minute in 1 goal games.

Exhibit B: that same year he made Team USA world Juniors and played on the best and safest pair with Adam Fox.

Exhibit C: just the maturation to the heavy minute munching bad ass on the best NCAA team.

Also he is physically mature at 6’4” 215. His strength is his defensive game and mobility and we are short on that. He also took the 3rd year in college and drove up his PPG totals. I sense Maurice will love him due to a bias on his prototype alone.

With all that being said I would love Dillon to round out our top 4 next year. Let Samberg adjust to the pro game in a lower pressure role on the bottom pair and wait for injuries or Even if he needs time on the Moose. Even if he is ready out of camp having 5 top 4 D assets would be a huge luxury for us.

I want more talent on our D core and if we started with a very legit top 4 and had guys like Samberg in the wings then that would be a major level jump for our talent base and we could be ready to contend again IMO.

I'm just curious as to the logic. So we need to sign De Melo, I think everyone is on board. Then we sign a potential top 4 d-man, only to give him up in the expansion draft, as there is no way we protect 4 defensemen. And how much would you sign him for, knowing that by the end of next year, we might have both Heinola and Samberg in the lineup? Wouldn't it be wiser to sign someone who can play 4-7? How much would Dillon increase our talent level? He had less points than Tucker Poolman last year. If we wanted to increase our talent level, throw Niku in the lineup. As a PKer is he better than Sbisa or Boo Boo, who would come alot cheaper?

 

[Roughneck1]

Heinola put up a 59.0% Corsi in Liiga this year, the best mark on his team and one of the best in the league — 15th highest of all skaters, and 5th of all D (who played more than 10 games)

Player stats | Advanced | Regular season 2019-2020 | Stats | Liiga

What was he playing do you know? 1st line, 3rd line wondering what matchups he got.

 

[surixon]

I'm just curious as to the logic. So we need to sign De Melo, I think everyone is on board. Then we sign a potential top 4 d-man, only to give him up in the expansion draft, as there is no way we protect 4 defensemen. And how much would you sign him for, knowing that by the end of next year, we might have both Heinola and Samberg in the lineup? Wouldn't it be wiser to sign someone who can play 4-7? How much would Dillon increase our talent level? He had less points than Tucker Poolman last year. If we wanted to increase our talent level, throw Niku in the lineup. As a PKer is he better than Sbisa or Boo Boo, who would come alot cheaper?

You also have to account for injuries. Our defense has never managed to stay healthy so having another legit top 4 option helps to mitigate against that. Quality defensive depth is important as we witnessed this year. Also nothing wrong with over ripening the kids on the farm or on the bottom pair. If they push a player out then thats fine but I have to think contract status will also play a role. Given the flat cap you gotta believe they will want to defer the start of Heinola's elc another year so I believe the plan will be to have him season on the farm all year.

As for the expansion draft I would much rather lose an asset like Dillion that we spent no assets or development time on then one of Copp, Roslovic, Harkins, or Appelton (depending on how the Jets elect to fill put their last few forward protection slots)

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I would be fine with him as well. What do you think he'd cost?

My guess is that 3x2.5 would get him - but I will wait for @Whileee to post the EW estimates. They may be a little suspect in this Covid season, but are still probably better than my seat of the pants guess.

 

[voyageur]

You also have to account for injuries. Our defense has never managed to stay healthy so having another legit top 4 option helps to mitigate against that. Quality defensive depth is important as we witnessed this year. Also nothing wrong with over ripening the kids on the farm or on the bottom pair. If they push a player out then thats fine but I have to think contract status will also play a role. Given the flat cap you gotta believe they will want to defer the start of Heinola's elc another year so I believe the plan will be to have him season on the farm all year.

As for the expansion draft I would much rather lose an asset like Dillion that we spent no assets or development time on then one of Copp, Roslovic, Harkins, or Appelton (depending on how the Jets elect to fill put their last few forward protection slots)

I don't think the Jets would have any problem bringing up Heinola at 19. Did it for Trouba, Ehlers, Gus. Pencil him in for the minors, unless he blows the roof off, but he's depth, the best kind, ELC.

I'm just wondering what Dillon brings that we don't already have. Frankly I would rather have Sbisa back, because one, our coach knows him, two, he's been a mentor to others, and three, he's a tough sob, will play injured, and still get in front of the puck. You could sign him and Niku for 2 year deals, and hey, that's the quota.

So Morrissey, De Melo, Pionk, Samberg, Sbisa/BooBoo, Poolman, Niku (who everyone seems to have jumped off the bandwagon for), Dahlstrom (who is here because Logan Stanley hasn't progressed, and because his size could make him a good PKer), Heinola, Kovacevic is 10 deep. If Stanley rebounds, or Gawanke makes another step forward, could be 11. Chisholm is a lock for a season on the Moose. The mere fact of having Samberg and Heinola makes the group more talented. When I look at the group, I can see what you mean, but I'm surprised how many people on here want to block the youth, when the complaint is usually the other way. Defense I suppose, requires more patience.

I still think we lose one of Harkins, Apples, or Berdin in the draft. Those are the guys who will be hard to protect.

 

[surixon]

I don't think the Jets would have any problem bringing up Heinola at 19. Did it for Trouba, Ehlers, Gus. Pencil him in for the minors, unless he blows the roof off, but he's depth, the best kind, ELC.

I'm just wondering what Dillon brings that we don't already have. Frankly I would rather have Sbisa back, because one, our coach knows him, two, he's been a mentor to others, and three, he's a tough sob, will play injured, and still get in front of the puck. You could sign him and Niku for 2 year deals, and hey, that's the quota.

So Morrissey, De Melo, Pionk, Samberg, Sbisa/BooBoo, Poolman, Niku (who everyone seems to have jumped off the bandwagon for), Dahlstrom (who is here because Logan Stanley hasn't progressed, and because his size could make him a good PKer), Heinola, Kovacevic is 10 deep. If Stanley rebounds, or Gawanke makes another step forward, could be 11. Chisholm is a lock for a season on the Moose. The mere fact of having Samberg and Heinola makes the group more talented. When I look at the group, I can see what you mean, but I'm surprised how many people on here want to block the youth, when the complaint is usually the other way. Defense I suppose, requires more patience.

I still think we lose one of Harkins, Apples, or Berdin in the draft. Those are the guys who will be hard to protect.

The difference between when Ehlers and Trouba were 19 and now is that the Jets are much closer to the cap ceiling and were in the building phase of their development. Difference between Gus and Heinola is player ceiling. Gus wont break the bank on a bridge or long term deal whereas if Heinola gets into the top 4 he's looking at 3 million on a bridge and 5 plus million on a long term deal. Letting his contract slide one more year ensures that he becomes an RFA when the Wheeler contract is off the books. More room to sign him and an extra year to load up around Wheeler as you have a player making 900k on an elc. It just smart business, cap management, and likely better player development. You see it in baseball all the time where teams exercise their rights to prolong control of the player and prolong paying them a lot of money.

As for Dillion, the metrics say that he is a physical top 4 defensive dmen. He would be a decent sized upgrade over the third pair guys we have in Beau, Sbisa, Kuli. I think all did what they could this year but there is a reason that so many teams have passed on Beau and Sbisa. Both are ok third pairing guys but you are stretching yourself if you have them taking reps in the top 4. Kuli has been a solid third pairing guy for us and can fill in in the top 4. The problem is that he can't stay healthy and that impacts his play.

I am not trying to block the kids but I view the next few years as the Wheeler contention window which to me means that you need to make the team as strong as possible. I think bringing in a legit vet top 4 LD to play with Pionk while we have a vet top 4 RD to play with JoMo gives the team a strong multi-faceted top 4. It also allows the Jets to bring Samberg along slowly on the bottom pairing. I think we have now seen a few dmen break in under Moe to know how he handles them. He will slowly increase their responsibilities over time. It took him the better parts of half the year to put either Morrissey or Poolman on the PK as rookies so I expect him to treat Samberg similarly. Also if Samberg outplays Dillon then you just move him up and have a good third pairing with Dillion anchoring it.

With Ves I see a young player who is going to be served better by a year in the minors where he gets to play big minutes in all situations. He still has a ways to go with regards to physical maturity and his play in his own end need polish. Plus I think Vincent is one of the best developmental coaches around. I think all our young players who played under him are much better as a result. I treat development very seriously and I think having a great system has led to this org getting the most out of their top end prospects. Two of the dmen I compare him to physically and stylistically are Hughes and Makar and both were rookies this year at ages 20 and 21. So keeping Heinola out one more year puts him on a similar trajectory.

 

[voyageur]

The difference between when Ehlers and Trouba were 19 and now is that the Jets are much closer to the cap ceiling and were in the building phase of their development. Difference between Gus and Heinola is player ceiling. Gus wont break the bank on a bridge or long term deal whereas if Heinola gets into the top 4 he's looking at 3 million on a bridge and 5 plus million on a long term deal. Letting his contract slide one more year ensures that he becomes an RFA when the Wheeler contract is off the books. More room to sign him and an extra year to load up around Wheeler as you have a player making 900k on an elc. It just smart business, cap management, and likely better player development. You see it in baseball all the time where teams exercise their rights to prolong control of the player and prolong paying them a lot of money.

As for Dillion, the metrics say that he is a physical top 4 defensive dmen. He would be a decent sized upgrade over the third pair guys we have in Beau, Sbisa, Kuli. I think all did what they could this year but there is a reason that so many teams have passed on Beau and Sbisa. Both are ok third pairing guys but you are stretching yourself if you have them taking reps in the top 4. Kuli has been a solid third pairing guy for us and can fill in in the top 4. The problem is that he can't stay healthy and that impacts his play.

I am not trying to block the kids but I view the next few years as the Wheeler contention window which to me means that you need to make the team as strong as possible. I think bringing in a legit vet top 4 LD to play with Pionk while we have a vet top 4 RD to play with JoMo gives the team a strong multi-faceted top 4. It also allows the Jets to bring Samberg along slowly on the bottom pairing. I think we have now seen a few dmen break in under Moe to know how he handles them. He will slowly increase their responsibilities over time. It took him the better parts of half the year to put either Morrissey or Poolman on the PK as rookies so I expect him to treat Samberg similarly. Also if Samberg outplays Dillon then you just move him up and have a good third pairing with Dillion anchoring it.

With Ves I see a young player who is going to be served better by a year in the minors where he gets to play big minutes in all situations. He still has a ways to go with regards to physical maturity and his play in his own end need polish. Plus I think Vincent is one of the best developmental coaches around. I think all our young players who played under him are much better as a result. I treat development very seriously and I think having a great system has led to this org getting the most out of their top end prospects. Two of the dmen I compare him to physically and stylistically are Hughes and Makar and both were rookies this year at ages 20 and 21. So keeping Heinola out one more year puts him on a similar trajectory.

It's a good argument you presented. but I am not sure I buy into it. If Heinola makes the team better that increases Wheeler's chance of winning. Holding him back an entire year seems like a waste of potential. He didn't look out of place in the NHL. Definitely expect him to start on the Moose. He'll be 20 by March, when I think he makes the team. Yes the d-man that can buffer Samberg seems necessary, I think we just disagree on the player, which is fine. Forums aren't meant to be a consensus. You definitely made a good argument I'll give you that.

 

[surixon]

It's a good argument you presented. but I am not sure I buy into it. If Heinola makes the team better that increases Wheeler's chance of winning. Holding him back an entire year seems like a waste of potential. He didn't look out of place in the NHL. Definitely expect him to start on the Moose. He'll be 20 by March, when I think he makes the team. Yes the d-man that can buffer Samberg seems necessary, I think we just disagree on the player, which is fine. Forums aren't meant to be a consensus. You definitely made a good argument I'll give you that.

I just don't see Heinola making this team that much better if at all next year as a 19 year old. Also like I mentioned I think his long term development is of more importance and I feel he will develop better on the Moose. But yes we can agree to disagree on what type of buffer we need.

 

[Teemusalami204]

The difference between when Ehlers and Trouba were 19 and now is that the Jets are much closer to the cap ceiling and were in the building phase of their development. Difference between Gus and Heinola is player ceiling. Gus wont break the bank on a bridge or long term deal whereas if Heinola gets into the top 4 he's looking at 3 million on a bridge and 5 plus million on a long term deal. Letting his contract slide one more year ensures that he becomes an RFA when the Wheeler contract is off the books. More room to sign him and an extra year to load up around Wheeler as you have a player making 900k on an elc. It just smart business, cap management, and likely better player development. You see it in baseball all the time where teams exercise their rights to prolong control of the player and prolong paying them a lot of money.

As for Dillion, the metrics say that he is a physical top 4 defensive dmen. He would be a decent sized upgrade over the third pair guys we have in Beau, Sbisa, Kuli. I think all did what they could this year but there is a reason that so many teams have passed on Beau and Sbisa. Both are ok third pairing guys but you are stretching yourself if you have them taking reps in the top 4. Kuli has been a solid third pairing guy for us and can fill in in the top 4. The problem is that he can't stay healthy and that impacts his play.

I am not trying to block the kids but I view the next few years as the Wheeler contention window which to me means that you need to make the team as strong as possible. I think bringing in a legit vet top 4 LD to play with Pionk while we have a vet top 4 RD to play with JoMo gives the team a strong multi-faceted top 4. It also allows the Jets to bring Samberg along slowly on the bottom pairing. I think we have now seen a few dmen break in under Moe to know how he handles them. He will slowly increase their responsibilities over time. It took him the better parts of half the year to put either Morrissey or Poolman on the PK as rookies so I expect him to treat Samberg similarly. Also if Samberg outplays Dillon then you just move him up and have a good third pairing with Dillion anchoring it.

With Ves I see a young player who is going to be served better by a year in the minors where he gets to play big minutes in all situations. He still has a ways to go with regards to physical maturity and his play in his own end need polish. Plus I think Vincent is one of the best developmental coaches around. I think all our young players who played under him are much better as a result. I treat development very seriously and I think having a great system has led to this org getting the most out of their top end prospects. Two of the dmen I compare him to physically and stylistically are Hughes and Makar and both were rookies this year at ages 20 and 21. So keeping Heinola out one more year puts him on a similar trajectory.

I agree with this 100 percent. I have been saying this since the beginning.

Cap managment is a real thing in a salary cap world. Players are left off their team all the time when they could contribute because of money.

Now if I can just find one poster that can agree that teams marginalize their players contracts as I feel happened with laine I can go to bed with a smile on my face haha

Great post brother.

 

[ps241]

I just don't see Heinola making this team that much better if at all next year as a 19 year old. Also like I mentioned I think his long term development is of more importance and I feel he will develop better on the Moose. But yes we can agree to disagree on what type of buffer we need.

This past season we got sucker punched with Buff along with the turn over. A step back for one season is understandable but we can’t afford to blow off another potential contending season of cost controlled prime Scheif and Helle era.

Tick tock

 

[surixon]

This past season we got sucker punched with Buff along with the turn over. A step back for one season is understandable but we can’t afford to blow off another potential contending season of cost controlled prime Scheif and Helle era.

Tick tock

Agreed. Although a bit premature to say we have blown this season ;p.

In the end if a young player forces his way past a good vet then i am quite fine with it. But I don't believe we can afford to try to break two rookie dmen in next year. It will likely be one or the other and my money is on the older/more physically developed player winning the job.

 

[ps241]

Agreed. Although a bit premature to say we have blown this season ;p.

In the end if a young player forces his way past a good vet then i am quite fine with it. But I don't believe we can afford to try to break two rookie dmen in next year. It will likely be one or the other and my money is on the older/more physically developed player winning the job.

yes for sure it is premature to say we have blown this season. Honestly with 4 months off this is much more like next season already than last season. It’s going to be so odd which is why I want us to win the play in so badly.