Is Sidney Crosby on track to be (or already is) the 4th best forward ever?

[Master Radishes]

I just don't feel the main board is the place for this discussion. Too many fanboys and haters and people who will nostalgically insist the NHL was better back in the day.

My mistake for opening this thread, I guess, but I think from now on I'll stick to HoH board discussions about Crosby and Ovi.

 

[Maestro84]

Crosby's injuries really hold him back in terms of peak play when comparing him to other GOAT candidates. Had he stayed healthy during his prime, then I think his place among all time greats would be undeniable.

 

[Gurglesons]

Crosby's the "better" player but Ovie might go down as the "greater" player due to having a healthier career

No, he won’t. In twenty years people will look back on Sid as a top five forward talent all time. Olympics, NHL, Internationally, he’s won everything, and he potentially could add a Selke this year.

 

[Gurglesons]

Crosby's injuries really hold him back in terms of peak play when comparing him to other GOAT candidates. Had he stayed healthy during his prime, then I think his place among all time greats would be undeniable.

It is undeniable already..? He finished 11th all time on the history board. He likely has 5 more years at minimum to continue to add to that legacy.

 

[Maestro84]

lol no. when Richard retired he held 17 NHL records. Crosby just doesn't stand out against the other players of his era enough to be as great as some claim he is. Over the last decade he has 22 more points than Patrick Kane, and 23 more than Ovechkin. He doesn't even have 100 more PTS than Claude Giroux. Pavelski, Benn, Perry, and Kessel are all within 30 goals of him and Ovechkin, Stamokos, and Tavares have more. In comparison in the 50s Gordie Howe had 249 PTS than the next highest point getter of the decade. Aside from the top 10 players, trailing him he had DOUBLE every other players point total in that decade. Players in this decade who have scored more than 1/2 of Crosby's point totals include: Neilsen, Plekanec, Perron, Kunitz, Bailey, etc. The highest scoring forward this decade under 1/2 of Crosby's PTS is Tyler Bozak. For Howe, it was Red Kelly.

I'm not convinced Crosby's much different than the Yzermans/Sakics, I think he just plays in an era without other Yzermans/Sakics, and hasn't been outshined by a Gretzky or Lemieux level talent.

I mean besides Ovi and Malkin, I don't think any other player who came out around the time that they did averages over a PPG for his career in both the RS, and no one other than Malkin averages over a PPG in the postseason. I think he's seperated himself from most others in his gen quite a bit, especially when he's healthy

 

[SotasicA]

No he's not and he won't be.

Howe's longevity has no equal.

And over either one of Orr, Gretzky and Lemieux is a big NO.

I think you can put Crosby ahead of Orr when listing FORWARDS...

 

[Gurglesons]

Yeah, and the guy that's won 7 rockets hasn't been legitimately remarkable. He's actually closer to bust territory than top 6 forward material imo.

We’re talking forwards, not goal scorers. There is a reason Bossy is not up there despite being a top five goal scorer of all time.

 

[Maestro84]

It is undeniable already..? He finished 11th all time on the history board. He likely has 5 more years at minimum to continue to add to that legacy.

Yeah but he never really got the opportunity to stack up on more hardware since he missed so many seasons

 

[Gurglesons]

Yeah but he never really got the opportunity to stack up on more hardware since he missed so many seasons

He’s won multiples of everything there is. Outside of the Selke.

 

[ottawa]

We’re talking forwards, not goal scorers. There is a reason Bossy is not up there despite being a top five goal scorer of all time.

Bossy doesn't have a single rocket and his hardware isn't nearly as impressive as Ovi's and he had no longevity...they are in nowhere comparable.

 

[Maestro84]

He’s won multiples of everything there is. Outside of the Selke.

He's an ATG cuz of that, but he could've been a sure-fire top 3/5 player of all time had he not missed so much time.

He'd be a 4/5-time MVP and scoring champ instead of "only" winning two of them, which if you add in all the other stuff would prob put him up there with the big four

 

[Gurglesons]

Bossy doesn't have a single rocket and his hardware isn't nearly as impressive as Ovi's and he had no longevity...they are in nowhere comparable.

Bossy led the league in goal scoring twice once against prime Gretzky.

 

[ottawa]

Bossy led the league in goal scoring twice once against prime Gretzky.

I stand corrected.

I also wanted to add, Bossy also played with elite company that Ovechkin doesn't have...like Potvin and Trottier. Same goes for Crosby (Malkin even they they don't always share the ice).

 

[Gurglesons]

I stand corrected.

I also wanted to add, Bossy also played with elite company that Ovechkin doesn't have...like Potvin and Trottier. Same goes for Crosby (Malkin even they they don't always share the ice).

Well, that’s a joke. Washington has had a better regular season roster pretty much every year Crosby’s been in the league.

You can come up with all the excuses you want. Crosby is the player of this generation. Doesn’t take anything away from Ovechkin likely being at minimum the 3rd best goalscorer of all time and arguably the best by the end of his career.

 

[ottawa]

Well, that’s a joke. Washington has had a better regular season roster pretty much every year Crosby’s been in the league.

You can come up with all the excuses you want. Crosby is the player of this generation. Doesn’t take anything away from Ovechkin likely being at minimum the 3rd best goalscorer of all time and arguably the best by the end of his career.

Ovechkin is arguably already the greatest goal scorer of all-time, and he's still not the player of this generation? Crosby must have set a pretty damn high bar despite having the same amount of points as Ovi.

 

[Gurglesons]

Ovechkin is arguably already the greatest goal scorer of all-time, and he's still not the player of this generation? Crosby must have set a pretty damn high bar despite having the same amount of points as Ovi.

In 150 less games.

If Ovechkin is the greatest goal scorer of all time.

Should it mean something that Sid beat him twice in terms of goals.

 

[ottawa]

In 150 less games.

Shit happens.

Crosby can have the title for the best on-pace player of this generation.

 

[Gurglesons]

**** happens.

Crosby can have the title for the best on-pace player of this generation.

So, Sid beat the greatest goal scorer of all time twice. While outproducing him in less games..

 

[ottawa]

So, Sid beat the greatest goal scorer of all time twice. While outproducing him in less games..

Good for him...Ovechkin beat Crosby 11 times and beat the league 7 times.

Add an extra number to each in a week.

 

[authentic]

No.

They made rules to slow Gretz down. They made rules to protect and prop up Crosby. That creates a huge gulf between the two.

Wait a minute... One was protected while the other was not, but you got it backwards.

 

[Randyne]

Washington has had a better regular season roster pretty much every year Crosby’s been in the league.

Recheck these seasons: 2006-07; 2007-08; 2011-12; 2012-13; 2013-14

 

[Gurglesons]

Recheck these seasons: 2006-07; 2007-08; 2011-12; 2012-13; 2013-14

Ah sorry. 9 of 15 years.

Also wtf Sid and Ovie have been in the league for 15 seasons. God I’m old.

 

[Hanji]

4th best forward? No chance, unless he wins another Hart or Art Ross or more, which he’s a bit short of compared to other greats.

 

[SeanConn]

Jagr is still above Crosby, come on!

 

[Gurglesons]

Jagr is still above Crosby, come on!

Jagr wasn’t ahead of Sid after 2013.