Is Provorov top 10 all around d man yet?

[Tripod]

Key word being former.

Chara is still good defensively, but not what he once was.

I agree. But I bet you would rather him vs AMac.



Hell, you might pick every Dman on the Bruins over AMac.

 

[MorgantiDrinksBlood]

Key word being former.

Chara is still good defensively, but not what he once was.

Can I ask and please be honest, would you rather have McAvoy over Provorov. If Provorov was under Chara’s wing damn I don’t even know. Maybe you’ll give a biased answer but I hope you are honest.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

Can I ask and please be honest, would you rather have McAvoy over Provorov. If Provorov was under Chara’s wing damn I don’t even know. Maybe you’ll give a biased answer but I hope you are honest.

I think I already said I would take McAvoy over Provo? I believe he has Norris potential and he’s a RHD, which are typically harder to find than their LH counterparts.

Edit: I’m sure I’m somewhat biased, as I see McAvoy a lot more than Provo.

 

[Dache]

Obviously better

Subban
Doughty
Hedman
Josi
Pietrangelo
Lindholm
Giordano
Vlasic
Jones
Suter
McDonagh
Weber

I think most would believe are better

Karlsson
Burns
Carlson
Krug
Klingberg
Ekman Larson

(Just because they’re not the greatest defensively doesn’t mean you can ignore how good they are offensively)

On same tier as Provorov

Reilly
Trouba
Morrissey
Parayko
McAvoy
Ekholm
Ellis
Ekblad
Hamilton
Werenski
Keith
Slavin
Pesce
Muzzin
Hanafin

I’m sure I’m missing some and there will be debate as to who fits in which category. But I think it’s pretty clear that he is not a top 10 d man. Yes if we take age and everything into consideration he becomes more valuable but that’s not what the question was

 

[flyersfan018]

Obviously better

Subban
Doughty
Hedman
Josi
Pietrangelo
Lindholm
Giordano
Vlasic
Jones
Suter
McDonagh
Weber

I think most would believe are better

Karlsson
Burns
Carlson
Krug
Klingberg
Ekman Larson

(Just because they’re not the greatest defensively doesn’t mean you can ignore how good they are offensively)

On same tier as Provorov

Reilly
Trouba
Morrissey
Parayko
McAvoy
Ekholm
Ellis
Ekblad
Hamilton
Werenski
Keith
Slavin
Pesce
Muzzin
Hanafin

I’m sure I’m missing some and there will be debate as to who fits in which category. But I think it’s pretty clear that he is not a top 10 d man. Yes if we take age and everything into consideration he becomes more valuable but that’s not what the question was

Most of those “on the same tier” most definitely are not.

 

[VictoriaJetsFan]

In about five years or so Provorov and Rasmus Dahlin will be the best d men in the world in a tier by themselves...at that time almost no one will disagree with that..you heard it here first.

 

[OzFlyers]

I wouldn't put him in the top 10 yet, but he's definitely in the top 1000.

I never watch the Flyers but..........

 

[Nizzle]

Provy is the closest thing I’ve seen on my hockey team to a sure-fire number 1 that can log the heavy minutes and be the guy on the backend since I’ve been watching the Flyers. I’m 29 so I think I started watching around 6-7 years old, I use to love Eric D but seriously this guy is an absolute stud. He’s 21 years old and logging massive minutes already. The closest thing I can describe him to is a robot, he moves robotically. It’s crazy.

There was this guy named Chris Pronger too.

 

[mdm815]

Young defensemen on bad teams definitely have untapped potential that make them harder to judge, but at what point does provorov get the recognition for being a key part of the Flyers ongoing resurgence?

Not to to nitpick cos both players are great, but since he was the most recent, i don’t think enough people give credit to the fact that in the Chara-McAvoy comparison, Provo would be chara (not in play styles/career-wise before i get pummeled, but in terms of impact on a game/pairing)

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

Looks like flyers are primed for playoffs, that will be a true test for provorov.

 

[BritainStix]

Provorov will struggle in the playoffs because its going to be his first time. As we know, robots need to experience things before they can calculate all future possibilities.

Next year he will dominate as the cybernetic organism that he is.

 

[Sasso09]

Key word being former.

Chara is still good defensively, but not what he once was.

How well do you think McAvoy would do with MacDonald? Cut his points in half, at best. At least we'd get to see how good he really is defensively though

 

[Sasso09]

I think differently.

McAvoy is a rookie, a year younger, is averaging more ppg, and plays top pair against the other team’s best, every game.

I wouldn’t say Provo is “definitely currently better”.

Provorov is better defensively, I don't even expect boson fans to disagree so I'll just move to the offense.

McAvoy has higher PPG? Slightly, but well behind ESP/60.

Provorov has more than double the goals and far better ES scoring with much tougher minutes and plays more than 2 more mins a game.

Compare them Rookie year for rookie year and you could have an argument, which is fair to McAvoy.

Current comparison isn't fair to McAvoy, he's not as good or proven and he shouldn't be expected to be yet. That year this early for defensemen is huge.

 

[FatTugboatFlahr]

Obviously better

Subban
Doughty
Hedman
Josi
Pietrangelo
Lindholm
Giordano
Vlasic
Jones
Suter
McDonagh
Weber

I think most would believe are better

Karlsson
Burns
Carlson
Krug
Klingberg
Ekman Larson

(Just because they’re not the greatest defensively doesn’t mean you can ignore how good they are offensively)

On same tier as Provorov

Reilly
Trouba
Morrissey
Parayko
McAvoy
Ekholm
Ellis
Ekblad
Hamilton
Werenski
Keith
Slavin
Pesce
Muzzin
Hanafin

I’m sure I’m missing some and there will be debate as to who fits in which category. But I think it’s pretty clear that he is not a top 10 d man. Yes if we take age and everything into consideration he becomes more valuable but that’s not what the question was

Actually sad.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

How well do you think McAvoy would do with MacDonald? Cut his points in half, at best. At least we'd get to see how good he really is defensively though

Do you have some sort of formula or are you just throwing shit against the wall to see what sticks?

Cut his points in half? Based on what exactly?

 

[Critical13]

I think he's on the Morrissey - Rielly - Werenski - Parayko - MacAvoy - Ekholm tier, below the top dogs.

Somewhere above the Trouba - Ghost - Gardiner - Skjei - Faulk - Leddy tier.

 

[Tripod]

I think he's on the Morrissey - Rielly - Werenski - Parayko - MacAvoy - Ekholm tier, below the top dogs.

Somewhere above the Trouba - Ghost - Gardiner - Skjei - Faulk - Leddy tier.

Now look at those list of players, and which ones are:

Their teams #1Dman?
Their teams go to defensive guy against top lines?
Their teams go to PK Dman?
Their teams top ES point scoring Dman?
Their teams top ES goal scoring Dman?

 

[Sasso09]

Do you have some sort of formula or are you just throwing **** against the wall to see what sticks?

Cut his points in half? Based on what exactly?

Formula is called Common sense.

McAvoy plays with a great defensive defensemen who allows him to Rome and has easier minutes. He would be glued to his blueline with Amac

 

[StoneHands]

I'd say in the 15-20 range right now but he could be in the top 10 as soon as next year.

 

[Dache]

Actually sad.

What’s sad is having a great up and coming defenseman but feeling the need to claim other defenseman with better, longer track records are lesser than him. He’s a really good player already and getting better. He doesn’t need to win the Norris this year for him to be a success you know.

 

[mja]

Recovers the puck off the faceoff, skates it up the ice to lead a 3-2, gains a controlled entry, lays a subtly awesome pass from his feet to Konecny who is able to fire off a perfect pass immediately to Giroux for the one timer.


Holds onto the puck until the Flyers get back onside for a controlled entry (how many defenders would have just dumped the puck into the corner?) and then with Pasternak coming to check him backhands a soft pass to Konecny who then goes on to score a GOTY candidate.


2 5v5 assists, plus 2, in 22.5 minutes of play.

 

[PK16]

Now look at those list of players, and which ones are:

Their teams #1Dman?
Their teams go to defensive guy against top lines?
Their teams go to PK Dman?
Their teams top ES point scoring Dman?
Their teams top ES goal scoring Dman?

This is a good point that seems to be missed in this argument.

 

[mja]

What’s sad is having a great up and coming defenseman but feeling the need to claim other defenseman with better, longer track records are lesser than him. He’s a really good player already and getting better. He doesn’t need to win the Norris this year for him to be a success you know.

Yeah, Flyers fans haven't claimed he should win the Norris. In fact, looking at the thread, most Flyers fans feel he has an argument for top 20, with some holdouts who don't think he's even at that level yet. Has there been a single Flyers fan in the entire thread who even thinks he's a top 10 guy right now?

 

[Dache]

Most of those “on the same tier” most definitely are not.

Sure, that can definitely be a valid opinion, but even ignoring the entire “on the same tier” list puts him behind 18 other players. The. The fact that even you admitted “most” were not on his tier, makes it safe to assume that a few are which would make it fair to say he’s around 20-25 in the league?

 

[JP Nolan]

NO......No way. Many many DMEN better then him.