Is Matthews making Ovi look a bit replacable?

Discussion in 'National Hockey League Talk' started by illpucks, Apr 8, 2021.

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  1. Jmo89 Registered User

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    Is OP even a Leafs fan? Don't think I've ever seen them on the Leafs board. Usually just absurd main board threads.
     
  2. Shark Finn Unregistered user

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    Surprised this wasn't a Mulletman or GeorgeLeafer12 thread.
     
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  3. AndreRoy Registered User

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    You’re forgetting about Stamkos, who before all his injuries was beating out Ovi for Rockets. People at the time were talking about the NHL’s Big 3, not its Big 2. Obviously that didn’t last thanks to Stammer’s horrific leg break, but that doesn’t diminish his accomplishments or his status as the second-greatest goal scorer of the era. Had he better luck with injuries this thread might well have had his name in the title.
     
  4. Pavels Dog Registered User

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    You only need 20 seasons of 40 goals, and one, just ONE, 95 goal season to beat Gretzky. Anyone can do it.
     
  5. Kuznetsnow Registered User

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    Don't even need that. Just 45 seasons of 20 goals will do
     
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  6. FunkySeeFunkyDo Registered User

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  7. StevenB Registered User

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    Even as a leafs fan this is laughable. Did you ever watch prime Ovi? That guy was a bulldozer usually good for at least 40 goals every season if not more.
     
  8. AndreRoy Registered User

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    Prorating Matthews’ numbers is ridiculous considering performance doesn’t scale linearly with games played, but if Leafs fans want to play that game let’s compare anyway:

    Matthews:
    - 19 years old season: 40 actual in 82 games
    - 20 years old season: 34 actual in 62 games = 45.0 prorated
    - 21 years old season: 37 actual in 68 games = 44.6 prorated
    - 22 years old season: 47 actual in 70 games = 55.0 prorated
    - 23 years old season: 27 actual in 36 games = 62.5 prorated
    Total: 185 actual, 247.1 prorated

    Stamkos:
    - 19 years old season: 51 actual in 82 games
    - 20 years old season: 45 actual in 82 games
    - 21 years old season: 60 actual in 82 games
    - 22 years old season: 29 actual in 48 games = 49.5 prorated
    - 23 years old season: 25 actual in 37 games = 55.4 prorated
    Total: 210 actual, 260.9 prorated

    Even giving Matthews the benefit of prorating his numbers Stamkos was still by far the better player for the first few seasons under comparison; Matthews does begin to close the gap somewhat over the next two but he’s also on a far more offensively loaded team than Stammer was. In short there is simply no reason to put Matthews over Stamkos at the same point in their careers.
     
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  9. sdf Registered User

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    By me he's seen as douchebag who hacked the game with his moronic style of play
     
  10. illpucks Registered User

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    how about curiousgeorge? That poster has best threads and avatar
     
  11. illpucks Registered User

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    stammer highly underrated and is one of best goal scorers OAT
     
  12. Get North Registered User

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    Can you elaborate? What's the biggest problem with Matthews style of play? He does a lot of gliding around for sure, not much stop and go which needs to change to win in the playoffs. But, a lot of young guys do that.
     
  13. snag Registered User

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    Meh...at least OV doesn't look like some pervert when sporting a moustache. ;)
     
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  14. chauron Registered User

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    Not unless they start playing empty net all the time
     
  15. sdf Registered User

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    I meant ovie))
     
  16. Alexander the Gr8 Registered User

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    Next up, is Leon Draisaitl on pace to have a better career than Jaromir Jagr?
     
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  17. Randyne Registered User

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    Are we talking about pace here?
    [​IMG]
    Matthews is 7 trophies off the pace right now
     
  18. Sky04 Registered User

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    Ovechkin's dominance isn't about his younger years, which still is far ahead of Matthews. It's about those 3 50 goal seasons, a 48 and 49 goal season after the age of 30.
     
  19. bobholly39 Registered User

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    Matthews looks fantastic as a goal-scorer. I've been saying for a couple of years now, he has 700+ career goals in his future. And that's not even a ceiling or potential - that almost seems like a strong possibility/likelihood. It's what happens when you've been as consistent as him since day 1.

    There are 2 things however he doesn't have on Ovi and likely won't ever touch.

    1. Overall peak. Outside of just goals, Ovi was absolutely insane for that 3 year stretch. I suppose anything's possible, and maybe Matthews can channel a higher level and contend with that, but in all likelihood Ovi > Matthews for peak very easily.

    2. This second thing is more relevant to goals. Ovechkin did ~okay in goal-scorer until age 27 or so. Really good, but nothing too unique in an all-time sense. I think he's 11th all-time for career goals through age 27. He's actually only 23 goals ahead of Stamkos through age 27, as an example. Really good, but not greatest of all-time good. I think Matthews is pacing that pretty well. I don't know if he'll top Ovi by age 27 or not (pandemic and such aren't helping) - but he likely makes a race out of it, and is in that vicinity.

    What sets Ovi apart all-time is that he won the Rocket at age 27. Then he won it at age 28. And 29. He won it 7 times in 8 years from ages 27 to 34. Goal scorers never age that well, there's always a big drop off in that age usually. That's why Ovechkin is unique in an all-time sense. That's why he's in the running for 894. Matthews won't touch that. He'll probably get close to ~700 or above, but I don't see him ever touching 800, let alone 894.
     
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  20. Ivo Registered User

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    Ovechkin's consistency, longevity as a goalscorer and his almost unmatched durability is what makes him a potential candidate to score 894, not scoring at a 60 goal pace at age 23. And even for Ovechkin, the record is a bit of a longshot at this point.
     
  21. Bauer Shill Registered User

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    Yeah let's wait until Matthews replicates once what Ovie has done 9 times before we start talking about them as equals. And that's assuming he can't win a 10th before he retires.
     
  22. Peasy Registered User

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    Nah according to HF its blasphemy to think that Matthews is now the best goal scorer in the NHL.
     
  23. Spirit of 67 Registered User

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    He has a very, very, long, long, long, long way to go before we start thinking about stuff like this.
     
  24. RealisticLeaf55 Hurt a Smurf

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    Ovechkin is a goal scorer and has a model of consistency like the NHL has never seen.

    I am excited for Matthews, but there is 16 games left and McDrai are both in range.

    Let's wait till the post season starts before we decide who the winner is. Furthermore lets wait till the end of both players careers before we bring our the yard sticks.

    Spoiler alert: Ovechkin will still win. I am say saying this as a firm believer in Matthews elite goal scoring and obvious Leaf homer.
     
  25. The Podium Registered User

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    There’s a big difference between peak and longevity. Matthews probably has the best shot of anyone in the league right now, but the feat is nearly impossible to hit so it’s a discussion for 10 years from now. Matthews also hasn’t had the cleanest bill of health in his career so I doubt he can play at this level for as long as Ovi has.
     
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