Is it time to move Mike Green? (aka the equally confused thread) x2
- Thread starter Langway
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I know it's difficult to remove all of the other variables and I don't know where to go to find any useful data, but my question centered on Carlson's ES and PK effectiveness before and after being given PP1 minutes. I guess the best data would be Corsi/Fenwick numbers?, but I don't know where to go to break them down by date.
BobRouse
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More advanced stats that point to Mike Green not sucking....
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fancy-stats/wp/2014/06/09/how-mike-green-can-be-a-game-changer-for-the-capitals/
Advanced stats love them some Mike Green.
Some of us that watch the game see how darn effective he is and that his pros outweigh whatever cons.
Dectractors see the game thru different lenses and either disregard advanced stats or disregard them when it comes to Mike Green only to serve their agenda.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fancy-stats/wp/2014/06/09/how-mike-green-can-be-a-game-changer-for-the-capitals/
Advanced stats love them some Mike Green.
Some of us that watch the game see how darn effective he is and that his pros outweigh whatever cons.
Dectractors see the game thru different lenses and either disregard advanced stats or disregard them when it comes to Mike Green only to serve their agenda.
i am not a green hater, but that chart means nothing because he is being compared to the likes of erksine, olesky, strachan...etc. just sayin....
Langway
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It seems like that's mostly Gormley so that's all that needs to be said about that.
Capitlols
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BobRouse
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The shot attempt percentage is interesting. Outside of 09-10 (when it was even) the Caps shot pctg is better with Green than without.
His Corsi was tops on the team this year. (what were Schmidt and Orlov's possession stats without Green as their partner? Not pretty...)
http://www.japersrink.com/2014/1/24/5341120/washington-capitals-on-trading-mike-green
If anything, Green has covered for partners' shortcomings in an important respect. Let's take a closer look at those two players with whom Green has partnered most at five-on-five this season, Orlov and Schmidt. When paired with Green at full and even strength, Orlov has had a Corsi-for percentage of 57.4 percent (meaning almost 58% of the shots on goal, missed or blocked shots at five-on-five have been taken by the Caps when those two were on the ice together). When apart, Orlov's Corsi-for percentage drops to 45.1. Similarly, when Schmidt was paired with Green his Corsi-for percentage was 53.7, but when apart dropped to 48.3.
Here's an article from the 2012 offseason that stresses how valuable he is for possession:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1263700-why-the-washington-capitals-needed-to-re-sign-mike-green-to-make-the-playoffs#articles/1263700-why-the-washington-capitals-needed-to-re-sign-mike-green-to-make-the-playoffs
Article from last year with more stats:
http://www.russianmachineneverbreaks.com/2014/01/24/no-its-not-time-for-the-washington-capitals-to-trade-mike-green/
Contrary to popular belief his is not a net negative player is what I'm saying.
The Caps will feel his loss unless they get very good value back in a trade.
His Corsi was tops on the team this year. (what were Schmidt and Orlov's possession stats without Green as their partner? Not pretty...)
http://www.japersrink.com/2014/1/24/5341120/washington-capitals-on-trading-mike-green
If anything, Green has covered for partners' shortcomings in an important respect. Let's take a closer look at those two players with whom Green has partnered most at five-on-five this season, Orlov and Schmidt. When paired with Green at full and even strength, Orlov has had a Corsi-for percentage of 57.4 percent (meaning almost 58% of the shots on goal, missed or blocked shots at five-on-five have been taken by the Caps when those two were on the ice together). When apart, Orlov's Corsi-for percentage drops to 45.1. Similarly, when Schmidt was paired with Green his Corsi-for percentage was 53.7, but when apart dropped to 48.3.
Here's an article from the 2012 offseason that stresses how valuable he is for possession:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1263700-why-the-washington-capitals-needed-to-re-sign-mike-green-to-make-the-playoffs#articles/1263700-why-the-washington-capitals-needed-to-re-sign-mike-green-to-make-the-playoffs
Article from last year with more stats:
http://www.russianmachineneverbreaks.com/2014/01/24/no-its-not-time-for-the-washington-capitals-to-trade-mike-green/
Contrary to popular belief his is not a net negative player is what I'm saying.
The Caps will feel his loss unless they get very good value back in a trade.
That thought even being out there can't help his trade value though. Gormley -__-
txpd
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I think GM's know that a player has real trade value isn't going to be bought out. I think GM's would also know that a player was borderline and might be bought out. I also think most GM's have experience with the Canadian media which floats stuff with no reality attached to it at all all the time.
on the other hand, if there is anything to this idea of buying him out, those that say he downright sucks have to be right.
I find this intriguing
on the other hand, if there is anything to this idea of buying him out, those that say he downright sucks have to be right.
I find this intriguing
txpd
Registered User
he actually did in 12-13. it was a short season, but the production was there. he didn't last season because oates wouldn't let him. even with that he was removed from the pp for much of the season, he lead caps defensemen with even strength points. look at the hunter playoffs. he was tied for the team lead in points.
g00n
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BobRouse
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You're right. We could stick Alzner in Green's role and he'd have similar production.
Its not like as if Mike Green is some prolific goal scorer for his position seeing as how he has led ALL NHL dmen in goals 3 of his 8 years in the league......
BobRouse
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He led the league in goals by a D the year before this past one.....and did that DESPITE Oates and his not wanting Dmen to carry the puck
Are you basing Green ONLY off of last year?
EDIT: Green had horrible luck last year. His PDO was among the worst on the team. He shot 3.3% below his career average.
He had 172 SOG. He should have easily had another 5 or 6 goals and another 10 assists taking into account his PDO.
70GP should have been 15+39=54 with a +/- of 0
That despite not spending the full year on PP1 and stupid Oates logic.
Last year was an abberation just like it was for Ovechkin and his low assist total and terrible +/-.
We had alot of guys who just were snakebit (outside of Ward)
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Capitlols
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Then he promptly went on to not match that total in double the amount of games. #BlameOates #NoDRushes
BobRouse
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Capitlols
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BrooklynCapsFan
No more choking!
He got kicked off the PP because he was injured. He wasn't given the job back because no one trusted him to stay healthy. Carlson replaced him and we didn't skip a beat. I'm fine with 74 staying there.
lol, ya it reads to me like:
"When Green gets lucky, he is awesome.....but when he isnt, well its Oates' fault."
BobRouse
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http://www.behindthenet.ca/nhl_statistics.php?ds=34&f1=2013_s&f2=5v5&f5=WSH&c=0+1+3+5+29+30+31+32+33+34
4th worst PDO on the team. Top Corsi player.
Yes. He did get bad luck.
You're not wrong
But don't discount Oates. And not just as it pertains to Green....
BobRouse
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He does need to stay healthy and the last 2 years there is reason to be encouraged. The groin issue seems to be in the past now.
As far as luck goes...he doesn't need to have good luck...he just can't have bad luck again...difference.
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