Is Elias Lindholm Overrated; Was Vancouver's Chemistry Interrupted?

[Tofveve]

I'll admit I sometimes miss the nuances on certain players, so as a Flames fan I found myself over time just accepting announcers and popular hockey journalists opinion on Elias; which was: that he was a defensively reliable yet offensively capable centreman who should (in a perfect world) be in Selke conversations year-in and year-out. A player who sort of flew under the radar after names like Bergeron. Having said that, without a doubt, Lindholm was indeed part of the Gaudreah/Monahan/Lindholm line that was one of the top lines in the league for a number of years (likely peaking in the months prior to the 2019/20 AS break).

So, when Monahan left and then Gaudreau and Tkachuk, it wasn't that surprising to me that without top calibre linemates (particularly Gaudreau IMO) Lindholm's numbers and coinciding stock started to drop.

I wondered how the new addition to Vancouver would affect the torid pace and chemistry the top players were on (and team as a whole). Initially it looked good at least with Elias L posting multi-point games. But now (as is the potential when moves like these are made), Vancouver is reeling having lost 6 of their last 7 and seeming as if they're trying to re-find themselves, particularly Elias Pettersson, and even Hughes on the back-end.

In Calgary I feel good about the return GM Conroy acquired for a player we were unlikely to retain. If we don't make the playoffs (still a bit of a stretch despite our 4 game-winstreak), I'll likely be lending my support to the Canadian team west of us that has shown to be tremendously exciting "when on their game." I'm just curious if Vancouver stumbles into the playoffs with this bolstered lineup, and if the Lindholm addition isnt the bolstering it was supposed to be.

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[canucks20]

He has looked very average. Not sure if just not meshing or his game just isn’t the same anymore. But he has been a big disappointment. He looks like a fringe player out there right now. Hopefully he figures it out soon

 

[Regal]

I don’t think Vancouver’s slump is anything to do with Lindholm. The team was bound to hit a rough patch at some point, and Hughes having a down month, the PP slumping terribly and the third line slowing down were all big factors, along with just some variance in some games that could have gone either way that were usually wins earlier in the year.

I think Lindholm got overrated after the 40 goal season, but in general this year he’s been a lot worse than others. He seemed like he wasn’t moving his feet enough and driving play in Calgary and I thought maybe that was just from being checked out, but nothing’s really changed here. He’s a guy who knows where to be but he’s not a difference maker at all.

 

[Tofveve]

He has looked very average. Not sure if just not meshing or his game just isn’t the same anymore. But he has been a big disappointment. He looks like a fringe player out there right now. Hopefully he figures it out soon

To me he looked this way in last year and a half in Calgary. He clearly was and is gunning for the big contract and I tend to think he became a little bit of a problem (entirely my speculation). Now it seems there are 2 Swedes in Vancouver who have big paydays on their minds and maybe the on-ice product is suffering as a result.

 

[Tofveve]

I don’t think Vancouver’s slump is anything to do with Lindholm. The team was bound to hit a rough patch at some point, and Hughes having a down month, the PP slumping terribly and the third line slowing down were all big factors, along with just some variance in some games that could have gone either way that were usually wins earlier in the year.

I think Lindholm got overrated after the 40 goal season, but in general this year he’s been a lot worse than others. He seemed like he wasn’t moving his feet enough and driving play in Calgary and I think maybe that was just from being checked out, but nothing’s really changed here. He’s a guy who knows where to be but he’s not a difference maker at all.

Even before Lindholm's arrival in Vancouver I was a little leary of Tochett's tinkering with a lethal pp and top lines despite the minorest of hiccups. Sometimes a glut of riches and success leads to "first world-like" problems (ie., finding and making issues where there shouldn't have been). For Vancouver's sake hopefully this was like you say that expected skid that even good teams go through. It just seems a little coincidental the timing and lack of consistent positive results post-Lindholm.

 

[mkatcherin00]

If anybody watched him the past 1.5 years, he wasn't worth much. Looked like a complete passenger. Scary that this is a contarct year for him. He Klingberg'd himself.

Tocchet has even chucked him down on the 3rd line. Guy was doing one of his 20% Corsi nights yesterday getting hemmed in over and over.

 

[Turin]

Yes he is. Decent #2 C but needs strong wingers to create.

 

[Rowlet]

Even before Lindholm's arrival in Vancouver I was a little leary of Tochett's tinkering with a lethal pp and top lines despite the minorest of hiccups. Sometimes a glut of riches and success leads to "first world-like" problems (ie., finding and making issues where there shouldn't have been). For Vancouver's sake hopefully this was like you say that expected skid that even good teams go through. It just seems a little coincidental the timing and lack of consistent positive results post-Lindholm.

The Canucks PP is actually pretty terrible

 

[Tofveve]

The Canucks PP is actually pretty terrible

It was good though when you had 3 Canucks as 1,2 and 3 in League scoring (points) and Boeser challenging for the goal lead. I guess that was awhile ago but it wasn't exactly at the start of the season either. Had to have been around Thanksgiving.

 

[Rowlet]

It was good though when you had 3 Canucks as 1,2 and 3 in League scoring (points) and Boeser challenging for the goal lead. I guess that was awhile ago but it wasn't exactly at the start of the season either. Had to have been around Thanksgiving.

They rotated positions and it's been struggling for months

 

[Dave92]

How could anyone possibly disrupt this Canucks dynasty. What a terrible player he must be.

 

[crazyfisherman]

Unfortunate hes not off to a good start, but i still believe in him becoming a 1st line caliber player. He was definitely just going thru the motions with the flames and its prob taking longer to get moving again. Good thing is guy is still an elite defensive player, still useful as he try to find hes offensive game

 

[Dabeast]

Yes. No.

 

[GhostfaceWu]

Hes basically back to his Carolina self anyone who didn't see that his numbers were inflated playing with Johnny is a sucker.

 

[jcs0218]

There were concerns in the weeks leading up to Lindholm getting traded that Lindholm was a player whose reputation was bigger than his actual play.

 

[Breakers]

Looks like it.

I’ve never liked big purchases at deadlines,

Just don’t double down on the mistake and re-sign him.

 

[Grifter3511]

Just from watching I feel like the biggest explanation for Canucks slump is Hughes looks tired and Pettersson is mercurial. Lindholm probably isn't all he's cracked up to be but I dont think he's the problem. If the rest of the team (outside of miller and boeser to an extent) were firing on all cylinders I think he'd be doing just fine.

 

[Play]

I don’t see much urgency in his game, needs talented playmaking wingers to produce.

Safe reliable in his own zone, but he hasn’t done much to separate himself from other depth centers like Suter who has been great, but 3C at best

if I’m the Canucks I’m moving on from him in the off-season, cap is too tight as it is.

 

[SEALBound]

They should have prioritized Guentzel.

 

[Buresflyingelbow]

Still time to move him and flip those assets plus some of their own for a Guentzel. If Boston or Rangers come knocking I hope they at least entertain the idea.

 

[Felidae]

He's only overrated if you were expecting a 40 goal, PPG player.

But just last season he was 2nd in scoring with 64 points while playing very well defensively without Gaudreau or Tkachuk. Which is completely in line with his flames seasons outside of 2021-22.

Now as someone who watched a good chunk of flames games last year, He never really popped out. He's not particularly flashy, strong, or fast. But he was always in good positions to score with decent playmaking ability. You also rarely saw him make egregious mistakes defensively or cheat for offense, which was in stark contrast to some of his linemates (Like Huberdeau).


This year, he's really lost his scoring touch. Shooting at 8% with a career average of 12%. But you just notice him even less unless you're really focusing in on him.

In conclusion, unless this is the start of a physical decline (which would be normal) I think he's better than what he's shown this year, and the idea that he was propped up by Gaudreau and Tkachuk, while having merit, is a bit over exaggerated imo.

 

[thaman8765678]

He is saving his effort for next year when he is reunited with his BFF Johnny.

 

[Dust]

It was good though when you had 3 Canucks as 1,2 and 3 in League scoring (points) and Boeser challenging for the goal lead. I guess that was awhile ago but it wasn't exactly at the start of the season either. Had to have been around Thanksgiving.

It was 8th at 25% prior to Feb 1st when Lindholm joined the team, looks like it's been at 15% since that point which is 28th. I don't watch enough Vancouver games to really know how much that's Lindholm, or just a general slump. That PP has loads of talent on it though, they'll figure it out and it will bounce back I'm sure.

 

[Oddbob]

You can't judge trades right away like this. Moving to a new team, brings not only new teammates, but new coach, new style, new role/usage, and expecting every player to immediately gel have chemistry with new teammates right away shouldn't be expected. Lots of players struggle when they first go somewhere new.

Bo Horvat looked not great for NYI last season after the trade, and this season he looks good.

 

[Bounces R Way]

He's a solid all around player. The best center Gaudreau has played with. But he hasn't been playing well and hasn't played well for a concerningly long time now.

When he's on he's aggressive in all three zones and forcing turnovers. Moving his feet and digging in on 2nd efforts to create opportunities for his linemates. Finding quiet space in the slot to get a wrister off. It was those 2nd efforts that made him a dangerous top 6 fwd, and I haven't seen those 2nd effort board battles and stick checks out of Lindy with any consistency for quite some time now. Smart positioning only goes so far in this league.

Very happy the Flames got the return they did for him because he was honestly even worse than his paltry numbers before the trade suggested. If I was Tocchet I would stick him on Miller or EP's wing for a while and tell him to concern himself with nothing else other than scoring some goals. Center is a tough position on a new team to hop into right away. Can't think of many acquired Cs that click right off the bat mid-season. If you're expecting him to be the main offensive catalyst on a line you're simply not using him right.