Confirmed with Link: Hurricanes offer sheet for Kotkaniemi (1 year, 6.1M)

[OldCraig71]

lmao, so you entertain the possibility that KK could actually breakthrough
but no matter the outcome you'll blame Bergevin! I like you man but you clearly have a fixation on Bergevin.

It has nothing to do with how I feel about MB. Why did this drag on in such a manner? Clearly, MB has been lowballing him because he is shopping him. The Canes are rumored to have made an offer that MB rejected. He played with fire and got burned here. Poor management.

 

[Kwikwi]

Bergevin thinks he's so smart, now he pays for his stupidity.

The way he talked about KK in the offseason, MB is glad that this happened. The fact that you lose to worst top 10 pick of that draft and have compensation redemption is insanely welcome for the team.

 

[Belial]

I think you gotta make calls all week seeing if you can strike a deal for a replacement center.
If you get a deal lined up, let him walk. But if you don't then match the offer sheet.

He's not worth that, come on.. The problem is that in one year you'll have to offer him the same salary or more to keep him around and that's a no-no for me.

 

[Andy]

Now that I’ve had time to think about it, this was really well played by the Canes.

 

[BarracudaMtl]

f*** KK …. Take the 1rd and move On

 

[Habidelidoo]

Waddell : "Look, we'd give you 5M × 5 years. But instead let's do this : we give you 6M for one year, and then we secretly agree to a 4 years extension of 4.75AAV. We both win : you leave habs for a great team, while we get you for cheap."

 

[Clumsyhab]

Would a 'Canes 1st and 3rd enough to trade for a player like Christian Dvorak?

 

[tazsub3]

Can you explain this please? Is he now untradable by the Habs so that it's basically "match the Canes offer or take the 1st and 3rd? No other options?

Yes sadly. Only option to trade if a match would be sept 2022

 

[Belial]

It has nothing to do with how I feel about MB. Why did this drag on in such a manner? Clearly, MB has been lowballing him because he is shopping him. The Canes are rumored to have made an offer that MB rejected. He played with fire and got burned here. Poor management.

He got burned because he didn't offer him 6m$?

You can't be serious man..

 

[WeThreeKings]

Ultimately when I look at it from every angle, you have to steer clear of the path which has the worst possible outcome,

The worst possible outcome is that you don't match.. KK hits his potential and all you have to show for it are two measly draft picks at the end of their respective rounds.

The way I see it.

Matching the OS.
Best possible outcome: KK hits or shows progress toward his ultimate upside and you can comfortable make a long term deal with him.
Worst possible outcome: You don't tender him at his QO next season and try to sign him back, if he goes elsewhere. All you are out in aggregate is a late 1st and early 3rd.

Not matching the OS.
Best possible outcome: Carolina somehow misses the play-offs (most unlikely) and you have another first in the lottery.. and KK shows no real progression in his game, whereby Carolina walks away from him.
Worst possible outcome: KK hits his progression, Carolina is now deep down the middle and can be a legitimate contender for years behind Aho and KK, while we are picking a player of Poehling's caliber and back to missing a top 6 center with size again, like we have for the previous 20 years before we selected him.

Matching the OS is the best option of a bunch of not great options because MB sucks.

 

[dinodebino]

To me, the decision is not difficult at all. I don't match.

Same here. I don’t match.

 

[EXPOS123]

Would a 'Canes 1st and 3rd enough to trade for a player like Christian Dvorak?

What the hell is this obsession with Dvrorak? The guy is worse than KK and you want to give more to get him?

 

[didimentionlarseller]

I wouldn’t match either Kotka doesn’t want to be here

 

[Belial]

Now that I’ve had time to think about it, this was really well played by the Canes.

And what was the end goal in your opinion?

 

[abo9]

It has nothing to do with how I feel about MB. Why did this drag on in such a manner? Clearly, MB has been lowballing him because he is shopping him. The Canes are rumored to have made an offer that MB rejected. He played with fire and got burned here. Poor management.

Got me wondering what were the negotiation talks. Like, I can't fathom Kotkaniemi asking for more than 2M? Probably 1-2 years deal to prove himself.

was MB offering league minimum for 5 years or something?

 

[Seb]

Bergevin must be Pikachu facing hard.

 

[Matthew McConaughay]

Right now, KK is not even worth a first round pick, so take the pics and run.

 

[willzyix]

Now that I’ve had time to think about it, this was really well played by the Canes.

I really don’t think so. If we don’t match and KK does what he’s most likely to do (30-40 points) they’ll have given up two picks, money under the cap for a mediocre centre they won’t resign.

if he plays decently well they’re forced to pay him the same salary to keep him, and if he explodes in one year then they’re not even locking up years.

its a stupid offer IMO.

 

[K2MyEverest]

It's really a bad position to be in for MB.

I understand the sentiment of letting him walk - a 1st and a 3rd for what we've seen of him to date would be great value. However, MB let Danault walk probably thibking of Kotkaniemi as a staple in the top 9. If he lets Kotka walk, he loses 2 top 9 centers in one year, and your new 2C is either Jake Evans or... Ryan Poehling? It's just a really bad look for the "GM of the year finalist". There's also a not insignificant chance that Kotka steps up to be a 40-50pts C next season, and then letting him walk sucks.

But then, signing him means that he NEEDS to produce at that rate, otherwise you lose him for nothing next year (are we really gonna qualify him at 6M if he's yet again a 30 pts player?). And if he does step up, you pay RFA years at a premium... which is just plain dumb.

So, MB's probably gonna have to match to keep his job, but he's losing either way. This offer sheet is lower in value but is much more damageable to MB/the Habs than the Aho offer sheet which was laughable at best.

Oh, the Canes could miss the playoffs and win the lottery sure... but would you really bet on that as the hockey workd laughs at your incompetence as a gm?

It's not good but there's meat on the bone for the Habs. The roster isn't lock as it is right now. You take the picks and you make something out of them. With all their assets and prospects. If you want Dvorak you can make it happen for sure. He's paid 4.45 for the next 4 seasons. That would be a great second line center on a reasonable deal instead of KK at 6.1M.

 

[sandviper]

Ultimately when I look at it from every angle, you have to steer clear of the path which has the worst possible outcome,

The worst possible outcome is that you don't match.. KK hits his potential and all you have to show for it are two measly draft picks at the end of their respective rounds.

The way I see it.

Matching the OS.
Best possible outcome: KK hits or shows progress toward his ultimate upside and you can comfortable make a long term deal with him.
Worst possible outcome: You don't tender him at his QO next season and try to sign him back, if he goes elsewhere. All you are out in aggregate is a late 1st and early 3rd.

Not matching the OS.
Best possible outcome: Carolina somehow misses the play-offs (most unlikely) and you have another first in the lottery.. and KK shows no real progression in his game, whereby Carolina walks away from him.
Worst possible outcome: KK hits his progression, Carolina is now deep down the middle and can be a legitimate contender for years behind Aho and KK, while we are picking a player of Poehling's caliber and back to missing a top 6 center with size again, like we have for the previous 20 years before we selected him.

Matching the OS is the best option of a bunch of not great options because MB sucks.

Well, thanks Bergy for essentially just giving the team a bunch of shit options…

 

[SakuKoivu11]

I don’t think it’ll be lottery worthy but either way take them. Getting the first and third gives you two extra assets to target Eichel. Sell some of our farm and some of Carolinas and it’s a more compelling offer that hurts is less long term.

I probably offer Canes first and something else for Dvorak.

 

[WeThreeKings]

It's not good but there's meat on the bone for the Habs. The roster isn't lock as it is right now. You take the picks and you make something out of them. With all their assets and prospects. If you want Dvorak you can make it happen for sure. He's paid 4.45 for the next 4 seasons. That would be a great second line center on a reasonable deal instead of KK at 6.1M.

If Dvorak could be had for that package, the Canes would have done it already and got their pettiness done a different way.

 

[Arto Kilponen]

It is interesting to see who to blame here.
Player shouldn't be blamed because of course he takes a lot of money.
Carolina has full right to make such offer, especially after they were "victims" in Aho case (in the end worked out great for them, but anyway).
Canadiens can't be blamed for wanting to negotiate a good deal, it just happened to take longer.
Canadiens can't be blamed for taking two picks to save their cap situation.
Canadiens can't be blamed for keeping their good center.

And at the same time you can blame them all.

I like the situation, this is really fun to watch. No matter how it ends.

Edit. And Canadiens can win this regardless of what they do. There's no real "do this and you lose for sure"-scenario.

 

[WinterLion]

The best thing about this is that both the team and JKO is forced to step up and lay it on the table. You in or you out Bergy?? This could still end well.

 

[abo9]

It's not good but there's meat on the bone for the Habs. The roster isn't lock as it is right now. You take the picks and you make something out of them. With all their assets and prospects. If you want Dvorak you can make it happen for sure. He's paid 4.45 for the next 4 seasons. That would be a great second line center on a reasonable deal instead of KK at 6.1M.

Am I missing something? Isnt Dvorak a 25 years old 35 pts player?

could we get him for less than a 1st and a 3rd? Because otherwise Kotkaniemi is a 21 years old 35 pts player...