How long before team USA is on par with Canada?

[koyvoo]

The US has an absolute boatload of young exciting talent coming up.. with guys like Eichel, Matthews, the Tkachuk bros, Connor, Boeser, and guys like Seth Jones and Trouba on the back end. How soon do you think these guys can be on par with team Canada at the olympics? (Provided the NHL actually goes). I’m a Canadian but the future of US hockey and team USA is bright as ever, and it’s pretty scary tbh...

I heard this first in 1991 and it was always “in 5-6 years tops”.

 

[LamorielloAndSon]

I'm just looking for someone to attempt rosters

Team USA
Lee - Mathews - Kane
Gaudreau- Eichel - boeser
Tkachuk -larken- Tkachuk
Connor - trochek - Miller
Saad/Nelson

Carlson Jones
Fowler mcavoy
Leddy faulk
Werenski

Hellebuck
Gibson

That’s one crazy good skating defense

 

[qwerty]

I think there’s a good chance the Americans eventually surpass the Canadians. In terms of sheer population size, it’s not really a fair fight when you have basically 10 x the population to extract elite athletes from.

I liken it to Women’s hockey, even though the last couple decades have dominated by the Canadians, the American females appear to have caught up and looked exceptional against the Canadians in the 2018 Olympics. If American participation is picking up and Canadian participation stays flat, it’s inevitable that the Americans eventually take over.

 

[Rebels57]

I'm just looking for someone to attempt rosters

I'll give the starting 12 forwards a shot, with an emphasis on youth and speed. Focusing on veterans and size has not been a good recipe in the past to beat Canada. I'm also trying to project based on how good I think players will be 3 1/2 years from now, which is not easy.

J. Gaudreau - Auston Matthews - Brock Boeser
Matthew Tkachuk - Jack Eichel - Clayton Keller
Brady Tkachuk - Jack Hughes - Patrick Kane
Kyle Connor - Dylan Larkin - Vincent Trochek

 

[pulfordfan]

If you use WBC as a barometer I think they are there already.

 

[VinikToWinIt]

At the end of the day, hockey is Canada’s number one sport and it is by a country mile.

They should be better than the US in hockey when they are getting all of their talent in the system.

It’s the equivalent of Canada playing the US in football or basketball.

Albeit the gap is a heck of a lot closer in terms of hockey than those other two sports.

If Canada pooled all of its resources into football, the US would still dominate.

If the US pooled all of its resources into hockey, it would take over as the primary force in the NHL.

It's this distinction that opens the door for the US to dethrone Canada in hockey while there is virtually no chance of Canada taking over football. Right now hockey is not even close to the most popular sport in the US, and the US is still producing a high number of quality players right now. If popularity took off, the gap could definitely be closed/overcome.

The main question is whether it will ever gain that level of popularity in the US. It's ingrained in Canadian culture and the US is not there yet, which I understand was the core piece of your post.

 

[ManWithNoName]

Never. No team will ever come close to the talent and depth Canada has. The US might win a game or two in the Olympics or World Cup but be on par position for position will never happen.

 

[Rebels57]

Never. No team will ever come close to the talent and depth Canada has. The US might win a game or two in the Olympics or World Cup but be on par position for position will never happen.

The games are not won on paper. All it takes is the right mix of players with the right amount of confidence.

 

[ManWithNoName]

The games are not won on paper. All it takes is the right mix of players with the right amount of confidence.

I just wrote that they might win a game or two, but they will never be on par if you compare them position for position. I believe that was what the OP was asking?

The US has beaten Canada before, that doesn't mean they are on par as a whole.

 

[Peiskos]

No offence to the US but for every up and comer they have Canada has one of equal and very likely of better caliber.

This is not to say that the US isn’t capable of beating Canada in a knockout game, I just feel Canada has more depth and this is what sets them apart.

There really hasn’t been a country that has ever been on par with Canada in hockey, some would say the Soviets were but when it came to best vs best against them Canada won the majority of the time.

 

[Syckle78]

I'll give the starting 12 forwards a shot, with an emphasis on youth and speed. Focusing on veterans and size has not been a good recipe in the past to beat Canada. I'm also trying to project based on how good I think players will be 3 1/2 years from now, which is not easy.

J. Gaudreau - Auston Matthews - Brock Boeser
Matthew Tkachuk - Jack Eichel - Clayton Keller
Brady Tkachuk - Jack Hughes - Patrick Kane
Kyle Connor - Dylan Larkin - Vincent Trochek

That's by far the most forward talent we've ever had.

 

[Jtown]

Their centres are almost on par, which is somethin that hasn't happened for any country during my lifetime.

McDavid and Mackinnon are both better than Eichel and Matthews, but USA has some depth and talent coming up and I think they can at least be close.

How's the defence match up? I feel like there is a bit of a lull in Canada's defensive development.



Larkin and especially Johnson show the difference. They would be matching up vs some combo Seguin/Tavares/Bergeron/Crosby/Mackinnon/McDavid down the middle. That's not a good look for USA.

you're right. now compare that to kesler, backes, drury, and statsny.

That is the comparison.

 

[Jtown]

That's by far the most forward talent we've ever had.

holy f***

 

[Inkling]

The way things are going, we may never know. NHL execs don't want to go to the Olympics and players don't seem too excited over the World Cup.

 

[nowhereman]

Lol, the’re not “close”...

 

[Rebels57]

That's by far the most forward talent we've ever had.

There are a lot more possibilities too. Young unproven kids that by 2022 might be impact players (Mittelstadt, Wahlstrom, Farabee, etc), veterans that might still have a lot more in the tank in 2022 (Pavelski, Wheeler, etc) and future draft picks (American draft pools are getting better every year).

 

[stranger]

• Crosby
• McDavid
• MacKinnon
• Doughty
• Tavares
• Marner
• Benn
• Giroux
• Bergeron
• Marchand
• Subban
• Seguin
• Hall
• OReilly
• Letang
• Point
• Barzal
• Couturier
• Scheifle
• Rielly
• Dumba
• Barrie
• and on and on

Kidding me dude?

A list of great players...then seeing Dumba. Luckily I had no drink in my mouth or my computer screen would be drenched.

He's decent, maybe even above average, but doesn't belong on a list like that.

 

[InglewoodJack]

The US is gaining on Canada, but really all it takes is for either country to bear a superstar to fix that balance. Also, Canada seems to not be able to have all of our provinces perform at once. For example, if Quebec's system started producing the stars it did a few decades ago, Canada would be so far ahead of the US.

 

[Bonzo111]

A list of great players...then seeing Dumba. Luckily I had no drink in my mouth or my computer screen would be drenched.

He's decent, maybe even above average, but doesn't belong on a list like that.

whatever, I'm not picking the team

 

[Dominance]

U-29 (players likely to be at a high level if NHL goes to the next Olympics) forwards:

Skinner-McDavid-Marner
Hall-MacKinnon-Seguin
Huberdeau-Point-Scheifele
Duchene-Tavares-Stone

Dubois-Barzal-Stamkos
Drouin-Domi-O’Rielly
Monahan-Horvat-Reinhart
Marchessault-Johansen-Gallagher
Schenn/Schwartz/Kadri
(Just by going down the NHL stats, I could make a whole ‘nother forward roster before more than 6 Americans + Matthews and Hughes were slotted in)

vs.

Gaudreau-Matthews-Keller
Tkachuk-Eichel-Boeser
Connor-Hughes*-Palmieri
Tkachuk*-Larkin-Tuch
Trocheck/Zucker/Kreider

*Dependent on projected potential

U-29 “top pairing” blueliners:

Canada: Chabot, Rielly, Pietrangelo, Hamilton, Girard, Morrissey, Ekblad, Ellis, Brodie, Dumba, Pulock? Matheson? Parayko? Nurse? Severson? Barrie?
+ Doughty, multiple Norris winner, only a year older

USA: McAvoy, Slavin, Jones, Carlson, Werenski, Trouba, Dumoulin, Fowler? Leddy? Skjei? Ghostisbehere?

America seems to have an edge in goalies for now, but it’s the most unpredictable:

Canada: Murray, Jones, Allen

USA: Gibson, Hellebuyck

The US should probably have to visibly surpass Russia, Sweden, and Finland before it gets compared to Canada. That said, I fully expect them to be the dominant hockey power within two decades.

 

[LamorielloAndSon]

Team USA
Lee - Mathews - Kane
Gaudreau- Eichel - boeser
Tkachuk -larken- Tkachuk
Connor - trochek - Miller
Saad/Nelson

Carlson Jones
Fowler mcavoy
Leddy faulk
Werenski

Hellebuck
Gibson

That’s one crazy good skating defense

Team canada
Seguin - mcdavid - giroux
Benn- Tavares - marner
Hall - mackinnon - barzal
Marchand - Crosby - Bergeron
Scheifele

 

[beach]

The US has an absolute boatload of young exciting talent coming up.. with guys like Eichel, Matthews, the Tkachuk bros, Connor, Boeser, and guys like Seth Jones and Trouba on the back end. How soon do you think these guys can be on par with team Canada at the olympics? (Provided the NHL actually goes). I’m a Canadian but the future of US hockey and team USA is bright as ever, and it’s pretty scary tbh...

2015?

 

[Machinehead]

Canada has weak goaltending tbh

 

[Dominance]

There are a lot more possibilities too. Young unproven kids that by 2022 might be impact players (Mittelstadt, Wahlstrom, Farabee, etc), veterans that might still have a lot more in the tank in 2022 (Pavelski, Wheeler, etc) and future draft picks (American draft pools are getting better every year).

On the last bit, there’s definitely a trend that way, but I think there’s at most 1 American currently projected as a top-10 prospect for 2020, for example, so it will take longer than you expect.

I’m mostly scared of when the US starts racking up long gold medal streaks at WJC and picking up Olympic golds, as that will grow the player pool a lot. Oh well. It’s in the benefit of the sport of hockey we all love when all is said and done.

 

[Soundgarden]

Well for example, in the 2016 NHL draft, there were 12 American players were taken in the 1st round - 5 of them coming from St. Louis, Missouri, alone. One of the potential greats in US hockey history grew up in freaking Phoniex, Arizona. There are elite programs in the U.S. and they are growing. When many NHLers retire, they stay, and lot of them coach and contribute to local programs around the cities they played in.

Pittsburgh is also becoming a major hotbed for hockey.

Not in the sense of ridiculous talent coming out, because I have not heard of any, but the amount of national tournaments being held in the area is insane. They have built more rink complexes, in the city region, in the past couple years than in the previous 10 combined.

Hell, I think I even read that they are putting a rink over in the North Shore when they start doing development. Pittsburgh is becoming a boom town in multiple terms.

Tropical lagoon, ice rink proposed for North Shore development

Something to note is that more kids are being drafted in places like Chicago, Pittsburgh and St.Louis, look back 5-6 years or longer and see where those teams were at, all contenders or winners. It makes me feel ancient but those 12-13 year olds who watched Crosby and Toews and Kane win championships are now 18 and some of them are being drafted.

If a team sustains success over a large period of time the better the odds of more players coming out of there and eventually better quality players. I would be surprised to see a slight bump in kids in Nashville and Vegas in a couple years, expect them to be more like Blake Geoffrion and Emerson Etem than Auston Matthews, but a bump nonetheless.

As long as American teams can contend or even dominate the league then the hype will grow for kids wanting to be hockey players. Now, the first gen players out of Vegas, Nashville or Anaheim may not be McDavid quality but as long as the teams in those cities invest their time and resources like they have been it should bode well for future generations. Which is one of the reasons the league wants Vegas, Arizona and Seattle to succeed, more success = more players and eventually better players.