Confirmed with Link: Hossa/Hino/Oesterle & 2019 3rd to AZ for Kruger/Entwistle/Maletta/Campbell & 2019 5th

[BK]

That’s true, but some player accountant posted a long thread on Twitter the other day that it’s not as big of an advantage as people think because players have to pay taxes to the state where they play each road game. It’s still an advantage for sure, but I don’t think it’s the only factor.

Yzerman publicly played hardball with Stamkos in a way Bowman never did with the core members.

Bowman did not have the leverage that Steve Y had. The Hawks had already won cups are the Lightning have not.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Bowman did not have the leverage that Steve Y had. The Hawks had already won cups are the Lightning have not.

True, that’s another factor.

It’s hard to ignore the optics though. From the outside, it looks like Bowman gave the core what they wanted, while Yzerman fought for the best deal for the franchise.

We obviously don’t know exactly what happened behind the scenes, but Panik did give us a glimpse into his situation where Bowman came in high.

 

[Rolo]

Seabrook & Toews should find a loophole to get their contracts terminated like Mike Richards.

 

[ClydeLee]

For whatever reason, the Hawks refused to play hardball with their core. They clearly chose a different path than the Lightning did.

They also had the contracts which can be stressful back of the mind thoughts out of the way. The lightning have waiting until after their ufa and rfas dont have the secure known case and pay them after they didnt finish.

 

[AmericanDream]

That’s true, but some player accountant posted a long thread on Twitter the other day that it’s not as big of an advantage as people think because players have to pay taxes to the state where they play each road game. It’s still an advantage for sure, but I don’t think it’s the only factor.

Yzerman publicly played hardball with Stamkos in a way Bowman never did with the core members.

from what I have heard from a majority of people, it is indeed a major factor....literally, players are looking into this more than ever...the only issue is most of these places that can allocate lower taxes are really not top destinations for players...if you want to be in a sunshine state, Florida is muggy as hell and simply not the hot destination- that is California....and now Vegas..

 

[RememberTheRoar]

from what I have heard from a majority of people, it is indeed a major factor....literally, players are looking into this more than ever...the only issue is most of these places that can allocate lower taxes are really not top destinations for players...if you want to be in a sunshine state, Florida is muggy as hell and simply not the hot destination- that is California....and now Vegas..

Interesting, so that conflicts with the other assessment, but I definitely don’t doubt you.

Bare minimum, it’s still 41 games without having to worry about state income tax.

So do you think the Yzerman/Stamkos thing was just a big dog and pony show?

 

[Callidusblackhawk]

I can acknowledge your Malkin argument ... but I'm sorry Ovie was THREE TIME Hart Trophy winner by 2013. One might be a mistake ... but THREE is a trend.

So Toews wants to be paid 11% more than the 3x Hart Trophy winner. And Lord knows Kane had his issues until he finally matured ... which wasn't until the summer of 2015.

Ovi's deal was signed for 13 years and the cap was 15 million dollars less than when Kane and Toews signed their contracts. Its just silly to compare contracts signed during different CBAs.

 

[Callidusblackhawk]

For whatever reason, the Hawks refused to play hardball with their core. They clearly chose a different path than the Lightning did.

IMO Rocky doesn't want to risk running fan favorites out of town like his old man did. I wouldn't be surprised if making sure the core players were happy was more of a priority than saving money on their contracts.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

IMO Rocky doesn't want to risk running fan favorites out of town like his old man did. I wouldn't be surprised if making sure the core players were happy was more of a priority than saving money on their contracts.

I think that has something to do with it, but we don’t really know for sure.

 

[AmericanDream]

Interesting, so that conflicts with the other assessment, but I definitely don’t doubt you.

Bare minimum, it’s still 41 games without having to worry about state income tax.

So do you think the Yzerman/Stamkos thing was just a big dog and pony show?

All I am saying is look at where the top FA destinations are- has nothing to do with tax breaks....just look at the list of FA signings, it really is the exact opposite..

 

[AmericanDream]

I think that has something to do with it, but we don’t really know for sure.

I think there is validity here, and rightfully so...his father was a f***ing douchebag who did not value loyalty unless you were a season ticket holder (why games weren't televised lol!!!)

 

[BrianE]

Nikolai Khabibulin (2005-2009, 2013-14)

If you want to go further back:
- Adam Creighton (1988-1991, 1996-97)
- Dave Manson (1986-1991, 1998-00)
- Dean McAmmond (1991-92, 1998-2001)
- Troy Murray (1981-1991, 1993-94)
- Eddie Olczyk (1984-1987, 1998-00)
- Denis Savard (1980-1990, 1995-97)
- Steve Thomas (1987-1991, 2001-03)
- Jimmy Waite (1988-1993, 1994-97)
- Trent Yawney (1987-1991, 1997-99)

- Al Secord (1980-1987, 1989-1990)

 

[RememberTheRoar]

I think there is validity here, and rightfully so...his father was a ****ing *****ebag who did not value loyalty unless you were a season ticket holder (why games weren't televised lol!!!)

Ya, I think it’s hard to pretend the organization negotiates hard with it’s important players. I think that’s a decision made at the top, and the directive is handed down the line to Bowman.

Hell, Rocky almost said as much in his Crain’s interview.

I thought Wirtz's most revealing answer came when I asked him if he had any regrets giving long-term contracts to Toews, Kane and Duncan Keith, all of whom have deals not set to expire until the 2022-23 season.
"No," he said. "It was the right thing to do."

 

[Blackhawks]

Seabrook & Toews should find a loophole to get their contracts terminated like Mike Richards.

Perhaps they can contract Hossa's mysterious condition? Only one can hope LOL

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Perhaps they can contract Hossa's mysterious condition? Only one can hope LOL

I would’ve preferred if Hossa would’ve unconracted it, but oh well.

 

[Bubba88]

I get that ... but still, Toews and Kane were not at the level of Crosby, Malkin, and Ovie at the time. All 3 were Hart Trophy winners. That's comparing apples to apples.

How many Cups have those players won at that time?

 

[x Tame Impala]

That’s true, but some player accountant posted a long thread on Twitter the other day that it’s not as big of an advantage as people think because players have to pay taxes to the state where they play each road game. It’s still an advantage for sure, but I don’t think it’s the only factor.

Yzerman publicly played hardball with Stamkos in a way Bowman never did with the core members.

Well Yzerman's franchise center (Stamkos) has brought exactly 0 Cups to Tampa. Way easier to play hardball when your franchise players haven't won Cups yet.

It's unbelievable that people either don't realize or belittle the influence that championships have on contract negotiations.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Well Yzerman's franchise center (Stamkos) has brought exactly 0 Cups to Tampa. Way easier to play hardball when your franchise players haven't won Cups yet.

It's unbelievable that people either don't realize or belittle the influence that championships have on contract negotiations.

Not only from a player perspective but also from a team perspective. “What have you done to warrant that much money” as well as a little embedded thank you money, do think that was a thing with Seabrook in particular. Toews and Kane were still 24-25. Seabrook had no business getting a lifer deal at that point.

 

[BK]

Not only from a player perspective but also from a team perspective. “What have you done to warrant that much money” as well as a little embedded thank you money, do think that was a thing with Seabrook in particular. Toews and Kane were still 24-25. Seabrook had no business getting a lifer deal at that point.

Seabrook is really the only deal the should not have been given out ever. Kruger as well but it's impact is not as long term.

Seabrook needs to be a compliance buyout. HE MUST BE A COMPLIANCE BUYOUT.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

Kruger deal makes some sense if the 1 year deal he accepted after 2015 is assumed to have been a handshake deal. His AAV would have fell to like mid 2s if thats included as a 4th year, which some team would have paid. He was money in that shutdown role. Never seemed to find his game after he broke his wrist. Seabrook should have received 5 years max. IDK what they were thinking.

 

[BK]

Kruger deal makes some sense if the 1 year deal he accepted after 2015 is assumed to have been a handshake deal. His AAV would have fell to like mid 2s if thats included as a 4th year, which some team would have paid. He was money in that shutdown role. Never seemed to find his game after breaking his wrist. Seabrook should have received 5 years max. IDK what they were thinking.

I don't disagree.

I am/was a Kruger fan though.

 

[Toews2Bickell]

I don't disagree.

I am/was a Kruger fan though.

.

Not sure they win the 2015 cup without him. Took on so many brutal matchups and won. Getzlaf line in WCF comes to mind.