Post-Game Talk: Habs lose to Sens 6-3. Bring on McDavid

[DAChampion]

10.5 is not a legit answer.

That was a different Carey Price.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

That was a different Carey Price.

It was a different D.

yesterday I posted all the LDs we’ve hD over the past four years. Journeymen, rookies, scrubs. We’ve played these guys on our first and second pairings. It’s ridiculous.

 

[Archijerej]

I don’t remember their D giving away pucks in the slot like we did. We played a brutal game and did so against a team we should’ve beaten.

By far our best player this year has been Jeff Petry and he played his worst game of the year, That’s why we lost.

We created loads of scoring chances. I don't think Ottawa had more.

Anyways, I don't feel particularly inclined to be harsh on Price after such a poor defensive effort. But I also don't feel like defending him, because what happened today is a clear trend for years now.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

We created loads of scoring chances. I don't think Ottawa had more.

Anyways, I don't feel particularly inclined to be harsh on Price after such a poor defensive effort. But I also don't feel like defending him, because what happened today is a clear trend for years now.

That trend corresponds exactly with when we started putting minor leaguers in top roles on our backend.

 

[Habs Icing]

10.5 is not a legit answer. Again, he’s played well behind bad clubs. You can’t play minor leaguers on your D and then blame the goalie and scream “but 10.5!!” That’s just lazy shit.

Until we have a legit D we will remain inconsistent. 10.5 or not.

Jake Allen: an average goaltender .922% 2.23 gaa
Price the best goalie in the world .902% 2.70 gaa
Both play behind the same team. Go figure.

EDIT: To add more context. Of all goalies who played 10 or more games:
Allen is 10th in save % and 8th in gaa.
Price........wait for it..... is 39th in save% and 23rd in gaa.

 

[DAChampion]

It was a different D.

yesterday I posted all the LDs we’ve hD over the past four years. Journeymen, rookies, scrubs. We’ve played these guys on our first and second pairings. It’s ridiculous.

It's hard to argue that they're much worse than Gilbert, Pateryn, Murray, Tinordi, Beaulieu, Bryan Allen, Diaz, Gonchar, Emelin, Bouillon, Jeff Weaver, Mike Rielly, Oh Burned, Barberio, Hanley, etc.

Back in the day when Price was star, he could play behind bad D and not be a below average goalie.

 

[Kriss E]

As I implied earlier, if you focus on the parts of his game that confirm your preconceived notions (i.e. focusing on his mishaps and not on the simple plays he does well far more often), sure, he'll excel at nothing. Confirmation bias at its finest.

Guy consistently has decent on-ice results (i.e. not even advanced stats) compared to other d-men with similar deployment, great underlying stats when his usage is taken into account, and really good transition metrics (controlled exits and entries).

I fail to see how that's excellence.

 

[HotPie]

That trend corresponds exactly with when we started putting minor leaguers in top roles on our backend.

So why does Allen have a significantly better save % with the same D? What's the excuse for that one?

 

[salbutera]

Jake Allen: an average goaltender .922% 2.23 gaa
Price the best goalie in the world .902% 2.70 gaa
Both play behind the same team. Go figure.

One goalie also has the best playoff sv % with minimum 15GP over last 6-years, the other lost his job to no name rookie after years of failing to live up to 1st round expectations...

Also might want to look at stats over last 20GP.

Price had a poor game, it’s going to happen, is this a new trend after an excellent last 20GP? I highly doubt it, but let’s see...

Re-post

Price’s first 11-starts of the season:
5-3-3 .893% 2.95GAA

Allen:
4-2-1 .932% 2.14GAA
————————————————-
10-starts since (24-Feb):
6-2-2 .920% 2.18GAA

Allen:
1-1-3 .898% 2.61GAA

 

[Milhouse40]

That's why Price is paid 10.5m. It's his job. He's crapping the bed!

He's got a .903% save percentage this season. He sucks! It's killing us

You can't even name me who's one #1 center and our #1 d-pairing......but that's the goalies fault.
You know Jake Allen is 92.2% but we lost 8 games out of 13 when he's in net.....but I guess having "good stats" is more important than winning games.

What about Weber?
7.8M$ and he's barely a 2nd pairing D.
Drouin....5.5M and only 2 goals....you think that's not killing us too.

 

[Milhouse40]

So why does Allen have a significantly better save % with the same D? What's the excuse for that one?

And why Allen only won ONE game in his last 8 games.....what's the excuse, he has the same team than Price who's 6-2-2 since March....

 

[Archijerej]

Jake Allen: an average goaltender .922% 2.23 gaa
Price the best goalie in the world .902% 2.70 gaa
Both play behind the same team. Go figure.

Yeah, the Allen acquisition has finally put things into perspective. No more excuses for Carey.

I have immense respect for him, but he’s not doing his job.

 

[Tuggy]

And why Allen only won ONE game in his last 8 games.....what's the excuse, he has the same team than Price who's 6-2-2 since March....

Goal support.

Price gets some of the best in the league and Allen gets some of the worst.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

It's hard to argue that they're much worse than Gilbert, Pateryn, Murray, Tinordi, Beaulieu, Bryan Allen, Diaz, Gonchar, Emelin, Bouillon, Jeff Weaver, Mike Rielly, Oh Burned, Barberio, Hanley, etc.

Back in the day when Price was star, he could play behind bad D and not be a below average goalie.

But our number one was Markov. He’d eat 20 mins. At least we had a legit blueliner there.

We have minor leaguers now.

 

[Milhouse40]

Goal support.

Price gets some of the best in the league and Allen gets some of the worst.

It's the same team.....

Maybe, just maybe....when the it's the backup in net, the team play more tight defensively and when it's the number 1 they push more offensively. That would explain the stats, and the fact the team wins more games with Price than Allen. But I guess it's simply coincidence

Not so long ago people like you were aying that the team doesn't want to play for Price and that's why the team in front of him didn't score much goals...

 

[HotPie]

And why Allen only won ONE game in his last 8 games.....what's the excuse, he has the same team than Price who's 6-2-2 since March....

The excuse is pretty simple: the team scores more goals when Price is in nets. Nothing Allen can do about that.

 

[Milhouse40]

But our number one was Markov. He’d eat 20 mins. At least we had a legit blueliner there.

We have minor leaguers now.

Hell, Mete was on our top pairing for 2 freaking years and now most don't even want it in the line-up and that's considering it's not even because we have a good D-squad.

But for 2 years, it was okay.....we were losing also because of Price, we had a good D and Mete was great apparently as Weber's partner.

 

[Tuggy]

It's the same team.....

Maybe, just maybe....when the it's the backup in net, the team play more tight defensively and when it's the number 1 they push more offensively. That would explain the stats, and the fact the team wins more games with Price than Allen. But I guess it's simply coincidence

Not so long ago people like you were aying that the team doesn't want to play for Price and that's why the team in front of him didn't score much goals...

Perhaps.

I don't notice anything specifically that is different when Price or Allen plays.

The biggest difference would be Price's puck handling.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Yeah, the Allen acquisition has finally put things into perspective. No more excuses for Carey.

I have immense respect for him, but he’s not doing his job.

A couple of things here.

Allen has played really well. Full marks to him. And Price did NOT play well to start the year. Some of his numbers can be explained by us getting killed on the PK but he let in soft goals way too often. Definitely on him.

But the more the season has gone on, Price has improved and Allen is coming back down to earth,

Last night though was fully on the D. And if Allen were in nets we’d have gotten the same result. Only difference is that today we’d be talking about how he got left out to dry. Last night was on the D.

 

[WeThreeKings]

The excuse is pretty simple: the team scores more goals when Price is in nets. Nothing Allen can do about that.

Maybe it's because Price helps the D get out of its own end, with his puck handling and puck movement?

I'm not saying -this- is the reason; but our D is severely low on puck movers and it's a huge issue that MB doesn't see as one, because he traded Subban for Weber.. got Alzner, Chiarot then Edmundson in an attempt to have as many slow footed, non puck movers as possible.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Perhaps.

I don't notice anything specifically that is different when Price or Allen plays.

The biggest difference would be Price's puck handling.

Allen had some of the best numbers in the league to start the year. He’s been great. And we’re going to need him with the brutal schedule coming up. If we ever needed a competent backup, this year is it.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Maybe it's because Price helps the D get out of its own end, with his puck handling and puck movement?

I'm not saying -this- is the reason; but our D is severely low on puck movers and it's a huge issue that MB doesn't see as one, because he traded Subban for Weber.. got Alzner, Chiarot then Edmundson in an attempt to have as many slow footed, non puck movers as possible.

He’s probably our 2nd best puck moving defenseman.

 

[HotPie]

Maybe it's because Price helps the D get out of its own end, with his puck handling and puck movement?

I'm not saying -this- is the reason; but our D is severely low on puck movers and it's a huge issue that MB doesn't see as one, because he traded Subban for Weber.. got Alzner, Chiarot then Edmundson in an attempt to have as many slow footed, non puck movers as possible.

I'm sure it helps, but I don't think it's enough to explain why the team is simply scoring more goals in front of Price versus Allen. Unless you're Brodeur playing in the trap era, a goaltenders impact on offense is practically non-existent.

 

[WeThreeKings]

He’s probably our 2nd best puck moving defenseman.

I really wish Harris didn't go back.. he could have earned a look and really helped out the puck movement/mobility of the back-end, provided he could hold up elsewhere.

 

[Goldenhands]

Welcome Eric Stall, you are going to make our center line much better! Finally Suzuki on the wing!