GM thread

[Mortimer Snerd]

Being an undesirable destination 100% affects trading for players that are still RFAs. What are you willing to pay for Domi if he is willing to sign a reasonable extension in Winnipeg? What are you willing to pay if he doesn’t want to and will only arbitrate himself to UFA status in a couple years?

Yes, it comes up there too. But we wouldn't even be talking about it if we hadn't heard that he didn't like Mtl winter. We wouldn't be anticipating any problem at all. We aren't having that conversation regarding any other RFA players. We don't have it in regards to any ELC players either.

Lets see how things go with Domi. He may end up in Edmonton. It could turn out to be another case of it saving us from ourselves.

 

[tbcwpg]

Yes, it comes up there too. But we wouldn't even be talking about it if we hadn't heard that he didn't like Mtl winter. We wouldn't be anticipating any problem at all. We aren't having that conversation regarding any other RFA players. We don't have it in regards to any ELC players either.

Lets see how things go with Domi. He may end up in Edmonton. It could turn out to be another case of it saving us from ourselves.

I'm always anticipating a tough time re-signing RFAs that haven't spent a lot of time with the team. The Winnipeg stigma applies here too.

I agree trading for RFAs is a decent move but I'm always adjusting the price I'm willing to pay on the assumption that they won't re-sign. Plan for the worst, hope for the best.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I'm always anticipating a tough time re-signing RFAs that haven't spent a lot of time with the team. The Winnipeg stigma applies here too.

I agree trading for RFAs is a decent move but I'm always adjusting the price I'm willing to pay on the assumption that they won't re-sign. Plan for the worst, hope for the best.

That is a consideration for all teams though. Obviously, there are some that give that a lot less consideration than the others. It seems that everybody prefers the sun belt teams. It isn't uniquely a Winnipeg problem.

 

[Whileee]

That is a consideration for all teams though. Obviously, there are some that give that a lot less consideration than the others. It seems that everybody prefers the sun belt teams. It isn't uniquely a Winnipeg problem.

Winnipeg has a bigger challenge than the large majority of markets. I think that is indisputable. We can debate how important it is, but I think it's pretty clear that the Jets' management has constraints that most markets don't have, particularly in the contracting, free agency and trade markets.

 

[tbcwpg]

That is a consideration for all teams though. Obviously, there are some that give that a lot less consideration than the others. It seems that everybody prefers the sun belt teams. It isn't uniquely a Winnipeg problem.

No, but it's far more of a thing for a team like Winnipeg, Edmonton, Ottawa or Buffalo, than it is for even a team like Vancouver, Minnesota, Columbus etc.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Winnipeg has a bigger challenge than the large majority of markets. I think that is indisputable. We can debate how important it is, but I think it's pretty clear that the Jets' management has constraints that most markets don't have, particularly in the contracting, free agency and trade markets.

And I'm not disputing that. I'm only saying it is over-emphasized by many here.

What we need is to get them while they are young. Before they marry movie or music stars, or super models. Let them find nice Winnipeg girls and settle in here. Lifestyle preferences of wives might be our biggest obstacle.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

No, but it's far more of a thing for a team like Winnipeg, Edmonton, Ottawa or Buffalo, than it is for even a team like Vancouver, Minnesota, Columbus etc.

All 7 Canadian cities have the issue to one extent or another. The winter cities have it. Middling cities like Columbus and Nashville have it. There are a lot of factors that contribute to it. Winnipeg suffers from all of them. Some of them are offset by other factors. Not totally, but to some extent. It is just a piece of the reality that Chevy has to deal with.

But if it is even close to being as large a factor as some here make it out to be TNSE should move to Houston quickly, before someone beats them to it.

 

[JetsUK]

Yes, I think it was foolish for the Jets to trade picks to try to augment the team this year, although if they are able to re-sign DeMelo, then that 3rd round pick was probably well-spent. At least they have picks in the top 2 rounds this year and top 3 rounds next year.

But it highlights for me the need for the Jets to focus more on rebuilding their talent pipeline this year and next, rather than trying short-term fixes by trading young players and/or prospects/picks. Instead, they should look at ways to acquire more picks by TDL rentals (hello Perreault) and/or by taking on some cap for cap-strapped teams.

ITA. Trading for DeMelo was a good use of assets, especially if they resign him -- he's one player I'd expect to outplay his contract if only because he seems like a strong complementary player, who should be able to add stability to pretty much any of out likely D pairings despite not being an offensive juggernaut.

I feel like the Jets have sometimes overpaid in picks, in some cases for marginal players (Hendricks??!), without drawing much attention to this spending because it's mostly in the 3-7 round range, while adding relatively modestly through their tendency to hang onto players they don't necessarily end up using. It's never straight-up bloodletting, more death of a 1000 cuts, but it adds up over the years.

We are likely to have extra cap room next year -- why not take on some cap dumps and add picks? Trade Perrault for a 3rd, 4th, whatever and retain some salary. We need to think a bit more creatively, IMO, and stop falling back on the "It's Winnipeg, no one will ever play here" repertoire of excuses -- there's some truth in these, but it isn't the whole story. In my field we lose talent and we also gain talent -- but it's likely a net positive averaged over years especially where the city has notable strengths (cardiology, epidemiology, orthopaedics, digital medicine, etc). When the Jets are playing fast, attractive, well-coached, competitive hockey with marquee talent assembled by a strong GM and staff, it's a whole lot easier to attract and retain talent -- as we saw with the very positive player interviews given by Myers etc when they arrived from Buffalo. Be that team, make those moves, stop trying to patch holes with NHL driftwood and invest in the pipeline, then look to bounce back with a vengeance in 2021-22. IMO.

 

[Teemusalami204]

Currently in the NHL:

162 players have NMC, NTC, or modified NMC / NTC out of 1,059 players on capfriendly. Doing simple maths this equals 15.3%.

Given your statement that you bet 15% of the players have us on their NO list... this would mean EVERY player that has a NMC / NTC has Winnipeg on their list. Is that likely? Maybe...

Note: Of those 162 players, 127 of them make more than $5,000,000

You just made my point even stronger I was trying to be generous to not be such a pessimist .


Thanks

 

[Al Camino]

I'd add the Hayes trade also. Bubble team in need of a 2C /bluechip prospects trades a 1st for a capable player who fails to move the needle and ends up down the lineup despite his solid points %. Also the Hendricks trade -- only a 7th, but if you need to trade for locker-room heroes because a playoff team lacks motivation. then your coach isn't doing his job -- so talk to the coach and save the pick.

I don't have a lot of complaints with Chevy -- but in a cap league in a small market creativity and thinking ahead of the pack are increasingly important attributes IMO.

Yeah that Hayes and Hendricks fiasco is on Muarice. Hayes has been pretty good in Philly. Granted overpaid a bit but different story for a different thread.

 

[Al Camino]

Chevy hasn’t done much outside of the first round.
Lots of goalies are taken in the later rounds
Copp and Lowry and that’s about it.

He is on par with first round picks I would say but he has drafted a bunch of soft players that have turned this team into a pushover.

His job on the defense was good for 2 years out of his entire tenure with last years being the worst.


I will still wait to see what he does this off season before I judge once and for all. If he gets a couple complementary players to round out the D and goes with what he has i think it’s time to go

His second round picks have been terrible. He's done ok in rounds 4-6. His 2013 and 2015 late round picks have basically made him and his scouts look better than maybe they would otherwise have been.

 

[surixon]

His second round picks have been terrible. He's done ok in rounds 4-6. His 2013 and 2015 late round picks have basically made him and his scouts look better than maybe they would otherwise have been.

He's batting 20% on his second round picks so far which is what is expected from that area of the draft.

If Samberg and Gus join Harkins as good roster players his second round success rate shoots right up to being very good.

 

[surixon]

Chevy has gotten good results from his drafts:
Two from each of 2011, and 2012 drafts (Scheifele, Lowry, Helle, Trouba)
Three and a half from 2013 (Morrissey, Copp, Poolman, and Petan who is a fringe NHL player)
One from 2014 (Ehlers)
Four from 2015 (Conner, Roslovic, Harkins, Appelton) jury still out on Niku
One from 2016 (Laine) jury still out on Stanley and Berdin
2017 -Jury still out but a number of promising prospects in Ves, Samberg, Kovacevik, Gawke, Holm
2018 - Gus, Smith and Chisholm all showing some promise
2019 -Way too soon to say

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

So ....... Montreal has done something about LD. Took 2 moves.

Chevy still hasn't signed DeMelo - 1 move.

Please don't eff this up Chevy.

 

[tbcwpg]

So ....... Montreal has done something about LD. Took 2 moves.

Chevy still hasn't signed DeMelo - 1 move.

Please don't eff this up Chevy.

Not sure they did well with what they did, but we'll see. I thought Chiarot would've tanked there but he did alright, albeit paired with Weber.

Also won't quote the whole thing but to the idea of trading Perreault for a mid-round pick: at this point, the Jets would have to include the mid round pick to have a team take him on. His value is pretty bad right now.

 

[Teemusalami204]

Chevy has gotten good results from his drafts:
Two from each of 2011, and 2012 drafts (Scheifele, Lowry, Helle, Trouba)
Three and a half from 2013 (Morrissey, Copp, Poolman, and Petan who is a fringe NHL player)
One from 2014 (Ehlers)
Four from 2015 (Conner, Roslovic, Harkins, Appelton) jury still out on Niku
One from 2016 (Laine) jury still out on Stanley and Berdin
2017 -Jury still out but a number of promising prospects in Ves, Samberg, Kovacevik, Gawke, Holm
2018 - Gus, Smith and Chisholm all showing some promise
2019 -Way too soon to say

Middle of the pack or sub par to tell you the truth.

 

[Teemusalami204]

So ....... Montreal has done something about LD. Took 2 moves.

Chevy still hasn't signed DeMelo - 1 move.

Please don't eff this up Chevy.

Happens every offseason he waits until everyone else is done and does a couple things at the end with the scraps

 

[surixon]

Middle of the pack or sub par to tell you the truth.

Definitely not, why don't you go pick some other teams draft boards and come back with who has drafted better then us in that window.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Not sure they did well with what they did, but we'll see. I thought Chiarot would've tanked there but he did alright, albeit paired with Weber.

Also won't quote the whole thing but to the idea of trading Perreault for a mid-round pick: at this point, the Jets would have to include the mid round pick to have a team take him on. His value is pretty bad right now.

Did I say we could get anything for Perreault now? I think he is still better than he is perceived to be around here, if he was played in a more suitable role. But still not quite worth his contract. And this isn't the year anyone is going to be willing to take on a short term overpay. I would not be willing to pay anything to get someone to take him. I would let him play out his contract. Move him at the TD if he has any value at all at that time. Otherwise, buy him out if we need the cap or the cash savings.

Hmmm, just went to CF to see what the cash saving of a buyout would be. They no longer show that as an option for him. Is this year's buyout period another casualty of Covid, or of that new CBA?

 

[DRW204]

when you're constantly picking top 10, you'll surely nab better players than most teams. from '11-'16 the Jets had the 3rd highest average pick (behind EDM and BUF). Shit, i hope their draft is better than most with that high of a pick on average.

 

[Teemusalami204]

Winnipeg has a bigger challenge than the large majority of markets. I think that is indisputable. We can debate how important it is, but I think it's pretty clear that the Jets' management has constraints that most markets don't have, particularly in the contracting, free agency and trade markets.

excuses excuses. , we haven’t overpaid for one player yet. Every player under 26 has no choice but to come here if they get traded as well. There isn’t even that many players with no moves and they don’t all include us anyway. I bet 5 percent of the players have us as a NO.

free agency is a legitimate excuse. But Detroit never had a problem when they were a powerhouse and that city does not have the best rep. When Chevy gets his act together and if we can be a perinatal contender and convince players it’s worth coming here this won’t be an excuse either.

You are completely wrong.and pushing the excuse narritive that is wearing very thin on these boards.

 

[tbcwpg]

Did I say we could get anything for Perreault now? I think he is still better than he is perceived to be around here, if he was played in a more suitable role. But still not quite worth his contract. And this isn't the year anyone is going to be willing to take on a short term overpay. I would not be willing to pay anything to get someone to take him. I would let him play out his contract. Move him at the TD if he has any value at all at that time. Otherwise, buy him out if we need the cap or the cash savings.

Hmmm, just went to CF to see what the cash saving of a buyout would be. They no longer show that as an option for him. Is this year's buyout period another casualty of Covid, or of that new CBA?

You didn't say anything about Perreault, no. Just didn't want to go back and find the post again on mobile. Sorry that wasn't clear. There's no point to buy him out right now with one year left

 

[tbcwpg]

excuses excuses. , we haven’t overpaid for one player yet. Every player under 26 has no choice but to come here if they get traded as well. There isn’t even that many players with no moves and they don’t all include us anyway. I bet 5 percent of the players have us as a NO.

free agency is a legitimate excuse. But Detroit never had a problem when they were a powerhouse and that city does not have the best rep. When Chevy gets his act together and if we can be a perinatal contender and convince players it’s worth coming here this won’t be an excuse either.

You are completely wrong.and pushing the excuse narritive that is wearing very thin on these boards.

Detroit is a bigger city than Winnipeg, close to Toronto, and is just like any other bigger US city outside of the main area.

Some might say that the constant pessimism is also wearing quite thin on these boards. The team isn't in a horrible spot. It has holes but most teams do.

Trading for impact RFAs usually costs impact RFAs and/or higher draft picks. Trading isn't as simple as it's made out to be on here. Chevy has some valuable pieces that you don't want to just give away for the sake of it, you need to get good value out of it too.

 

[Teemusalami204]

Detroit is a bigger city than Winnipeg, close to Toronto, and is just like any other bigger US city outside of the main area.

Some might say that the constant pessimism is also wearing quite thin on these boards. The team isn't in a horrible spot. It has holes but most teams do.

Trading for impact RFAs usually costs impact RFAs and/or higher draft picks. Trading isn't as simple as it's made out to be on here. Chevy has some valuable pieces that you don't want to just give away for the sake of it, you need to get good value out of it too.

I’m a realist not a pessimist.

Trading for rfas is just as hard for every gm as it is for Chevy. What’s your point ?

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

You didn't say anything about Perreault, no. Just didn't want to go back and find the post again on mobile. Sorry that wasn't clear. There's no point to buy him out right now with one year left

The point of the buyout would only be in the case that we needed the cap - or, in this crazy year, that saving ~1.3 mil over 2 years actually matters. But going by the absence of that option on CF, I'm speculating that it is no longer available for him. Checked a few other players entering their UFA seasons and buyout is not shown for any that I checked.