Pre-Game Talk: GM 38 | Vancouver Canucks vs TBD - Return Postponed

[sandwichbird2023]

Gotta love Miller for standing up for the players.

This also makes me think he gets “punished” and traded in the offseason.

Honestly getting traded feels more like a reward than punishment, unless Miller ended up in Buffalo or Arizona.

 

[m9]

NFL cardio is more about your ability to stay fresh for multiple downs. NFL players don't play 45-second downs very often and get rests between bouts of exertion, it's still rough and requires excellent cardio but the game isn't played at the all-out sprint that an NHL shift requires.

On paper this is true, but teams are also frequently cutting players from and adding players to their practice squads throughout the season so in practice they have a larger pool of players to draw from. Also unlike the NHL they can sign a player for a game and cut them right away afterward without impacting any farm system or the teams overall roster and salary structure.

NFL teams have vastly more roster flexibility in a season than the NHL as well as having a larger pool of skilled players to act as replacements. There is no comparing the two when it comes to the ease of getting a reasonably decent team onto the field.

You also still haven't answered my question about what the league should do if another outbreak happens a week from now as bad as what just hit the Canucks and why whatever the plan for that is can't work for the Canucks.

I really think you're off on the cardio thing. It's different, not better or worse. Football is sprints, rest in between downs, then obviously rest when the other side of the ball is out there. Hockey is be prepared for a minute and then a couple of minutes off. Obviously I have never played in the NHL or NFL (and assume you haven't either) but I've played enough of both sports to say I don't see why coming back from Covid would be easier in one sport vs another aside from certain positions. It also doesn't really matter what the answer is because every case is different it seems in terms of how hard they are hit.

Agreed there's more flexibility in the NFL, but my point was that there was still enough flexibility with the Canucks roster to figure things out and the fact they're in this position in terms of a depleted roster is their own doing.

If another team got hit with an outbreak it would be interesting for sure. I assume they would simply delay the start of the playoffs, or possibly combine that with a slightly shorter schedule? And sure the league could do that now, but why should they? Why is it the league's fault that the Canucks didn't bring up enough players to have a proper contingency plan?

 

[tyhee]

I don't know if the NFL teams that went though it are direct comparables, but a few teams were put in pretty bad situations.

The Tennessee Titans had 24 players get Covid, though the outbreak was stretched out a bit longer and of course they would have more players on the team. It did cause major disruptions to the schedule. I would have to look back but they would have went through extremely long periods with little to no practice time, similar to the Canucks.

The Denver Broncos found out the day before their game that one of their QBs tested positive and all of their other QBs were close contacts so they had no QBs and had to put a WR in at QB. I don't know what you would compare it to on the Canucks, maybe if their entire defense core was out due to Covid. Awful and a no-win situation, essentially forfeit the game which is pretty key in a 16 game season.

I don't think either situation is as bad as the Canucks but they weren't great either.

Point is, I don't think the Canucks situation is particularly unique other than they had more players get it and for whatever reason didn't call anyone up from the minors despite having enough time to do so.

The NFL situation was nothing like the situation with the Canucks.

With the Canucks, we're talking, what, 21 players had it? Their full roster was 23, though the 21 included some from the taxi squad. In any event, take away the players that had it and there is no way the Canucks could ice a full team.

The NFL roster is 53 players. Take away the players that had it on the Titans and you still have enough for a full offence and a full defence with a few reserves even before bringing in other players.

Hockey is so intensive that subs are necessary so that players don't collapse from exhaustion. Football isn't so intensive and in olden days there were players that would play the whole game. Of course, in football players only exert themselves a few seconds at a time, then wait for the officials to place the ball, then huddle for play calling, then exert themselves for a few seconds again.

The difference in the nature of the game and in the number of players on the roster makes it completely different from the Canucks, who would have to ice their barely recovered players, who would be expected to be deficient in respiration.

I don't see any comparison at all between almost the whole team being sick and a team missing it's quarterbacks. The team missing it's quarterbacks is very likely to lose, though probably not as badly as the Canucks would stand to lose. On the other hand, the Broncos' players on the field wouldn't be suffering from respiratory issues and be as susceptible to injury.

About the only similarity I see with the football situations is that they were both covid related.

 

[m9]

The NFL situation was nothing like the situation with the Canucks.

With the Canucks, we're talking, what, 21 players had it? Their full roster was 23, though the 21 included some from the taxi squad. In any event, take away the players that had it and there is no way the Canucks could ice a full team.

The NFL roster is 53 players. Take away the players that had it on the Titans and you still have enough for a full offence and a full defence with a few reserves even before bringing in other players.

Hockey is so intensive that subs are necessary so that players don't collapse from exhaustion. Football isn't so intensive and in olden days there were players that would play the whole game. Of course, in football players only exert themselves a few seconds at a time, then wait for the officials to place the ball, then huddle for play calling, then exert themselves for a few seconds again.

The difference in the nature of the game and in the number of players on the roster makes it completely different from the Canucks, who would have to ice their barely recovered players, who would be expected to be deficient in respiration.

I don't see any comparison at all between almost the whole team being sick and a team missing one player, even a quarterback.
In the NFL a player doesn't play more than half of the time-offensive players are off the field while the opponents have the ball and defensive players while the Titans have the ball.

As I said the Titans weren't as bad, just a comparable of a team that lost a large portion of their team to Covid. The context of what was being discussed is that they are an example of a team that went through a bad Covid run, made adjustments to their schedule after a break, and then continued their season. This is in response to people who think the Canucks should shut it down because they've had a bad couple of weeks.

I won't even get into the rest of your post that attempts to discredit football and it's athletes. Needless to say, you should stick to discussing hockey.

 

[tyhee]

...

I won't even get into the rest of your post that attempts to discredit football and it's athletes. Needless to say, you should stick to discussing hockey.

This has got to be one of the most deliberately obtuse comments I've seen in a while.

Along the same lines as your comment, do you think it would be discrediting football players to say that soccer players need more cardiovascular fitness, or a discredit to soccer players to say that football linemen require more physical size and strength than soccer players?

Similarly, do you really think that pointing out that football is different than hockey is a discredit to one of them?

Ugh. I'm out of this exchange. Answering people who deliberately twist arguments isn't worthwhile.

 

[m9]

This has got to be one of the most deliberately obtuse comments I've seen in a while.

Along the same lines as your comment, do you think it would be discrediting football players to say that soccer players need more cardiovascular fitness, or a discredit to soccer players to say that football linemen require more physical size and strength than soccer players?

Similarly, do you really think that pointing out that football is different than hockey is a discredit to one of them?

Ugh. I'm out of this exchange. Answering people who deliberately twist arguments isn't worthwhile.

You cited that players in football played both ways 50+ years ago as an example why Covid would hit hockey players harder than football players. Then accuse me of being obtuse?

I have no doubt players in both sports (along with soccer) would be rough for the guys who were hit hard by Covid.

But back on subject - do you think the Canucks should be shut down for the season based on what we know as of now? That was the original question.

 

[Nuckler]

I'm curious why the NHL doesn't just reschedule the Canucks games with the teams that are likely out of the playoffs for the end of the season and the teams that will make it beforehand. Then the teams that are going to miss the playoffs can play out their string of games without holding up the start of the playoffs

 

[tantalum]

Cancelled games? I for one am completely surprised by this turn of events....

 

[mriswith]

If they're this desperate for all the games to be played out, they should let us do it like it's preseason and call up the AHL roster, then make a Canucks Team A and Canucks Team B that can take turns playing the 19 games back to back.

The games get played, the players get a hard schedule but not the ridiculous impossible one proposed, Rathbone finally gets a cup of coffee in the NHL, and we also **censored due to needing to be posted in a different thread**. Win win win.

 

[canuckking1]

Imac saying players around the league feeling unsympathetic and upset with the Canucks.

 

[Bad Goalie]

2-3 days is a pittance considering the league is likely to cram these two games within the existing schedule

Which will mean 8 back to backs since there is no more than 1 game between any of their 19 in the schedule as it was laid out before these cancellations.

Miller said he had skated 3 times and his lungs were burning and he didn't have COVID!

There are players still SICK! Yeah fans whining for games, just roll them out with walkers.

When are some of you going to recognize these guys weren't suffering from a minor flu? This illness kicks the shit out of its victims and the new variants feast on the young. Many of you act as if most of these guys weren't even sick but just siting out because they had had contact. The official announcement is that all of the number were infected except one who was riding out the contact quarantine.

Any Comet called up now has to quarantine anyways and would be unavailable until he was declared eligible. Guys in quarantine can't practice or skate to condition.

 

[Bad Goalie]

I have no problems with the team playing games if we can ice a healthy team, and the schedule isn't rediculous. As long as the players are willing to play. The problem is the NHL want the Canucks both to play all their remaining games, and have them finish by a certain date. Playing all the games in a reasonable schedule even if it means delaying the North playoffs, or having the Canucks not play all the games if the NHL don't want the delay is fine. If the NHL is adamant on finishing on time the Canucks shouldn't play.

"and the schedule isn't ridiculous". (fixed that spelling for you too, LOL

You just detailed the reason to shut down. The schedule was/is and now will be even more ridiculous. It was 19 in 31 days. Take a couple more off and it's still 19, but in even fewer days. The league isn't going to give them adequate time to get these games in they extended the season for them already to the 16th and that included 6 back to backs and no more than 1 day between any two game dates. That's a game every other day except for 2 in a row 6 times and still a game the day after each of the back to backs. No team has ever been subjected to that nightmare and with these cancellations it can only get worse. Any date for these new cancelled games goes into create another back to back.

Thus, your decision that if the NHL is adamant on the schedule speaks for itself. The Canucks shouldn't play.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

"and the schedule isn't ridiculous". (fixed that spelling for you too, LOL

You just detailed the reason to shut down. The schedule was/is and now will be even more ridiculous. It was 19 in 31 days. Take a couple more off and it's still 19, but in even fewer days. The league isn't going to give them adequate time to get these games in they extended the season for them already to the 16th and that included 6 back to backs and no more than 1 day between any two game dates. That's a game every other day except for 2 in a row 6 times and still a game the day after each of the back to backs. No team has ever been subjected to that nightmare and with these cancellations it can only get worse. Any date for these new cancelled games goes into create another back to back.

Thus, your decision that if the NHL is adamant on the schedule speaks for itself. The Canucks shouldn't play.

100%. If the NHL wants all the games played without delay then the Canucks shouldn't play. If not that, someone said they could schedule the games against Ottawa during the playoffs. There is a lot of middleground between canceling the season and playing all the games.

I should probably proof read my posts and check my spelling before posting.

 

[Cogburn]

Up until I heard Miller's comments, I doubted whether management would seriously consider trading him. Now I've changed my mind.

Being correct under an autocracy is a good way to go missing.

 

[Luck 6]

Which will mean 8 back to backs since there is no more than 1 game between any of their 19 in the schedule as it was laid out before these cancellations.

Miller said he had skated 3 times and his lungs were burning and he didn't have COVID!

There are players still SICK! Yeah fans whining for games, just roll them out with walkers.

When are some of you going to recognize these guys weren't suffering from a minor flu? This illness kicks the shit out of its victims and the new variants feast on the young. Many of you act as if most of these guys weren't even sick but just siting out because they had had contact. The official announcement is that all of the number were infected except one who was riding out the contact quarantine.

Any Comet called up now has to quarantine anyways and would be unavailable until he was declared eligible. Guys in quarantine can't practice or skate to condition.

Perhaps a stupid question, but why did Miller and other healthy Canucks only skate a couple times in the last couple of weeks? These are NHL players, they don’t know how to stay in at least close to game shape on their own?

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Imac saying players around the league feeling unsympathetic and upset with the Canucks.

From the bottom of my heart - f*** them.

 

[Get North]

Imac saying players around the league feeling unsympathetic and upset with the Canucks.

That's exactly what the boys need to get fired up for 19 games.

 

[Coachcorner]

So, hello and respect y'all again! What is ya'lls prediction on this. Is the canucks going to play saturday next time, or is the monday a better time for this again? A simple question on respect and answers. Big respect y'all.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

So, hello and respect y'all again! What is ya'lls prediction on this. Is the canucks going to play saturday next time, or is the monday a better time for this again? A simple question on respect and answers. Big respect y'all.

The buzz on Twitter today was that the Canucks/Leafs games would move to Sunday/Monday, but nothing official yet as far as I know.

 

[VanillaCoke]

New schedule is expected to be released by the NHL tomorrow.

 

[EpochLink]

At least the guys are taking some time off, did Quinn Hughes contact covid? If not, he’s enjoying the time off.

Just saw him scooter down Robson Street.

 

[Coachcorner]

The buzz on Twitter today was that the Canucks/Leafs games would move to Sunday/Monday, but nothing official yet as far as I know.

That's cool sire. Gives also mo time. Like it. Big respect and thank you for the answer. Seems to be like a wise move also. Sounds ok. On these circumstanions. Mayne like, they get over 48h from that, and still play. Aaight, that's tight sire.

 

[iFan]

Imac saying players around the league feeling unsympathetic and upset with the Canucks.

that’s also the age group that thinks covid is fake so it doesn’t surprise me to hear this.

 

[VanJack]

So now some other NHL players are unsympathetic and upset with the Canucks? Who cares?

At some point the schedule will resume; the Canucks will be back playing and losing more than they win; and the season will soon be mercifully over.

It's 'what happens next' that matters. In fact it's the ONLY thing that matters. From top to bottom, this franchise is in a shambles....and their embarrassment is spreading around the league.

Unless the owner is intransigent and stubborn; or just plain incompetent, changes have to be coming. We've passed the point where his own credibility is on the line.

 

[Hansen]

At least the guys are taking some time off, did Quinn Hughes contact covid? If not, he’s enjoying the time off.

Just saw him scooter down Robson Street.

Hughes was one of the hardest hit and one of the ones who had to be put on an IV apparently