OT: General UFC/MMA/Boxing discussion VIII

[Kriss E]

Mike Russel quoted a book:


Book isn't written by Russell...I guess everyone has it wrong.

Reddit isn't a source. As much as I love reddit I mean...if there's a link to a known article disputing that...cool.

Like I said, this is something I hope Ali is being falsely accused about because it isn't pretty.

Yes, I mentioned the book previously, and again, it's pretty funny how despite all this alleged dangerous and criminal past, he's just managing a bunch of fighters and walking freely.

I know there are flaws in the system, but I mean..come on. The FBI was apparently using him for intelligence, you think they're just going to let him go and walk freely? Loll come on.

 

[Kriss E]

I don't think you understand. You brought up Bonds as an argument, not me. It's not my fault he's not in the hall of fame.

If your argument was "Barry bonds took PEDs and he's in HOF" as an argument that's one thing but he isn't. Am I supposed to ignore that he isn't?

I mean, bringing up Barry Bonds does the opposite of helping your argument. It doesn't disprove anything GSP said, all it does is give credence to it.

Yes, BB should be in the discussion. Do you agree or not?

 

[Goodbahd]

I love how you just deflect and run. Classic HF.
If you called me a terrorist, I wouldn't waste two seconds responding to it. I'd laugh in your face, which is what AA did, and I'm pretty sure the FBI wouldn't hold a press conference to say you were wrong either.

Again, if AA was so openly a terrorist snitch, where are all the sources linking him as such? Why don't you search the names of actual terrorists, you'll see just how many sites have info on them. AA though, there is nothing about this except referrels to one old book.

I mean, I get it, you have CM titty whities on, but at some point, logic should prevail.

If you were innocent, and smart then you’d hire a lawyer and sue the authors, and then laugh after you reap millions for defamation. But if those authors obtain credible sources from the authorities to write their book, then you’re sh*t out of luck.

You ignore facts, that are conveniently placed in front of you. Nobody would condone having their réparation as a terroist if it weren’t true, their lawyers would go after poeople for an easy defamation suit, and McGregor’s camp would have advised against that kind of allegation if there weren’t a hint of credibility to it. For the record, I have no dog in this fight, I didn’t even watch the match, just the highlights. I’m just a casual observer, not even a fan. However, I’m able to do objective research, and see a spade for a spade. Maybe take your tin foil hat off, and those biased follower goggles. By the way the sun called and asked where you’ve been, it hasn’t seen you in a couple of years.

 

[Goodbahd]

Yes, I mentioned the book previously, and again, it's pretty funny how despite all this alleged dangerous and criminal past, he's just managing a bunch of fighters and walking freely.

I know there are flaws in the system, but I mean..come on. The FBI was apparently using him for intelligence, you think they're just going to let him go and walk freely? Loll come on.

The book would not have been published if it there was no truth it. Abdelaziz would be looking at an easy defamation lawsuit agains the authors. Apparently that was a little too much for you to comprend.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Yes, BB should be in the discussion. Do you agree or not?

I don't know enough about baseball but back in the day they didn't do testing right? If so, then whatever. Include him.

UFC does testing, it's a clear rule so...

 

[LyricalLyricist]

The book would not have been published if it there was no truth it. Abdelaziz would be looking at an easy defamation lawsuit agains the authors. Apparently that was a little too much for you to comprend.

To be fair, there is a point that somehow he's free. He must've got an insanely good deal to be an informant OR some of it is wrong. I don't know.

 

[Goodbahd]

To be fair, there is a point that somehow he's free. He must've got an insanely good deal to be an informant OR some of it is wrong. I don't know.

It’s not hard to be free if you cooperate. Many corrupt people are walking free because of plea deals. If there wasn’t a hit of truth to it, the authors of the book would’ve been easily sued by now. You can’t write a book making false accusations and expect to get away with it, especially in a place like America.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

It’s not hard to be free if you cooperate. Many corrupt people are walking free because of plea deals.

Yeah but rumor has it he was let go because he couldn't be relied on or was a double agent. Does the plea bargain still apply then? Who knows.

 

[Goodbahd]

Yeah but rumor has it he was let go because he couldn't be relied on or was a double agent. Does the plea bargain still apply then? Who knows.

Well regardless where there’s smoke, there’s fire. Nobody knows the exact details, but we know something happened, and we know the general basics.

 

[Kriss E]

If you were innocent, and smart then you’d hire a lawyer and sue the authors, and then laugh after you reap millions for defamation. But if those authors obtain credible sources from the authorities to write their book, then you’re sh*t out of luck.

You ignore facts, that are conveniently placed in front of you. Nobody would condone having their réparation as a terroist if it weren’t true, their lawyers would go after poeople for an easy defamation suit, and McGregor’s camp would have advised against that kind of allegation if there weren’t a hint of credibility to it. For the record, I have no dog in this fight, I didn’t even watch the match, just the highlights. I’m just a casual observer, not even a fan. However, I’m able to do objective research, and see a spade for a spade. Maybe take your tin foil hat off, and those biased follower goggles. By the way the sun called and asked where you’ve been, it hasn’t seen you in a couple of years.

You seem incapable of differentiating fact and opinion.
You need water to live, that's a fact.
You think people would sue others for calling them terrorists, that's an opinion.

Here is a fact, you do not know much of anything about this, so stop pretending like you do.

If you were innocent, and smart then you’d hire a lawyer and sue the authors, and then laugh after you reap millions for defamation. But if those authors obtain credible sources from the authorities to write their book, then you’re sh*t out of luck.

You ignore facts, that are conveniently placed in front of you. Nobody would condone having their réparation as a terroist if it weren’t true, their lawyers would go after poeople for an easy defamation suit, and McGregor’s camp would have advised against that kind of allegation if there weren’t a hint of credibility to it. For the record, I have no dog in this fight, I didn’t even watch the match, just the highlights. I’m just a casual observer, not even a fan. However, I’m able to do objective research, and see a spade for a spade. Maybe take your tin foil hat off, and those biased follower goggles. By the way the sun called and asked where you’ve been, it hasn’t seen you in a couple of years.

And how do you know if AA didn't already do this?? How do you know there was not a signed agreement where the authors agreed to pay AA a substantial amount and in return AA agrees to not ask for their book to be taken off the shelves and keep this agreement confidential???
Oh right, you don't know. So ya, let's assume that someone tied to terrorists, with felony, fraud, harrassment, and theft attached to his name, just walks freely..

Talk about a tin foil hat alright...and you say you're being objective here? lol
There are zero actual reports of anything out there, the most I've seen is a copy released by Mike Russell of a felony charge, which was possession of drugs, and he was dismissed for it.
Right...Mister Objective over here..lol

 

[Kriss E]

The book would not have been published if it there was no truth it. Abdelaziz would be looking at an easy defamation lawsuit agains the authors. Apparently that was a little too much for you to comprend.

Oh man, you're so naive. There is so much BS in books. How do you think propaganda works??
You think everything written in alt-right books is true too I suppose??

Every author is 100% correct.
Every book is 100% true.

You honestly have such a simpleton and naive view of things.
Also, again, maybe AA did negotiate a form of compensation that is confendential. Or, maybe he didn't even know he was mentioned in that book. Maybe he was a terrorist snitch in the form that the neighbour of his sister's half brother's uncle was allegedly part of a terrorist faction. Maybe it was later revealed he had no ties with any terrorists and he was using this to get out of a theft or felony charge. Maybe they just assumed he was a terrorist because he forged an ID.

Basically, we don't know jack f***ing shit, and for the record, I was never defending AA. As you said, when there's smoke there's fire, so he's a very shaddy character. I was simply correcting you on your misunderstanding of what facts, speculations and opinions are.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Regarding the book, the first thing on amazon page:

Two Pulitzer Prize-winning journalists take an unbridled look into one of the most sensitive post-9/11 national security investigations, a breathtaking race to avert a second devastating terrorist attack on American soil.

How safe are we? What do we sacrifice to feel safe? And who pays the ultimate price?

Yeah, those sketchy Pulitzer prize-winning journalists.

Ali probably got a plea deal and that's it.

 

[Kriss E]

I don't know enough about baseball but back in the day they didn't do testing right? If so, then whatever. Include him.

UFC does testing, it's a clear rule so...

UFC didn't always do testing either, and even when it did, it was shite. There were 8 positive tests from 97-2007, with Josh Barnett being the first to ever test positive at UFC34.
They only tested main events or title fights back then too.

But that's irrelevant. Using PEDs should not void your accomplishments, that is the dumbest stance and only shows ignorance from the side arguing as much.

 

[ImNeverWrong]

Just find it funny how "terrorist snitch rat" can attain so many American fighters as clients.

Mctapper literally said anything he could in Hope's of getting under khabibs skin. The glass jaw dagestanis...the Chechnya politics, etc, etc.

And lets be clear, defamation charges like most civil suits settle OUT OF COURT. So just because you cant "Google" any evidence of Ali filing one against the author of the book, doesnt mean he didnt.

I like how the word of a lying rat like McGregor who is hated by much of his own people for being a pompous tool is now the source for breaking news. It's a fact that many Irish cant stand the guy.

 

[Kriss E]

Regarding the book, the first thing on amazon page:

Yeah, those sketchy Pulitzer prize-winning journalists.

Ali probably got a plea deal and that's it.

So what do they say about Ali exactly?
1- He was turned informant after caught for ID fraud.
2- He was a unreliable.
3- FBI cut ties.

The FBI also could not deport him...despite
1- Alleged ties to terrorists.
2- Felony
3- Fraud
4- Theft
5- Harrassment

Well goddang..
Also,
Apparently, FBI gets him a plea deal but then...tries to deport him??

Maybe people should stop talking out of their asses instead? The guy is shaddy, that's about it.

Little FYI, Janet Cooke is a Pulitzer prize winner who was proven to have frauded her story. Now, that's not to say everyone that has a Pulitzer Prize needs to have an asterisk next to their name, but you really need to stop with the ''appeal to the authority'' arguments.

Outside a little passage in a book, there is no information on AA linked to terrorism, which is rather odd.

 

[ImNeverWrong]

So what do they say about Ali exactly?
1- He was turned informant after caught for ID fraud.
2- He was a unreliable.
3- FBI cut ties.

The FBI also could not deport him...despite
1- Alleged ties to terrorists.
2- Felony
3- Fraud
4- Theft
5- Harrassment

Well goddang..
Also,
Apparently, FBI gets him a plea deal but then...tries to deport him??

Maybe people should stop talking out of their asses instead? The guy is shaddy, that's about it.

Lol just throwing whatever they can at the wall and hoping it sticks in a "gotchya" moment.

With that said, ali needs to tone down the smacktalk if wants to rep khabib. Cussing out 50 cent and others doesnt help the guy when hes trying to cleanup the sport and making clowns like colby cringeyton an afterthought.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

UFC didn't always do testing either, and even when it did, it was ****e. There were 8 positive tests from 97-2007, with Josh Barnett being the first to ever test positive at UFC34.
They only tested main events or title fights back then too.

But that's irrelevant. Using PEDs should not void your accomplishments, that is the dumbest stance and only shows ignorance from the side arguing as much.

Why not? Rules are rules.

It does not matter what your stance is on PEDs. It's not part of the rules and gives an advantage, that simple.

Jones is a massive repeat offender. Whether or not he's the greatest, I'd argue he cannot play by the rules of his contract and should not be in the octagon.

He's had criminal issues outside of the octagon, does play not play by the rules either.

He was flagged for anomalies in UFC 182 where he beat DC
Kicked out of UFC 200 where he was scheduled to face DC
Was found with steroids in his body at UFC 214 weigh ins...again vs DC

USADA started in the UFC July 1st, 2015.

Jones fought UFC 197
Jones was caught with PEDs UFC 200
Jones was caught with PEDS UFC 214

The guy had 3 scheduled fights since USADA came in, he couldn't make it to one and failed another next. He's at 33% success of following rules since USADA came into UFC.

Yeah, you may be for or against steroid use but it's against the rules. I may think throwing the puck into the net with your hands is a goal but it isn't. That's the rules.

I wouldn't be shocked to see Jones lose vs Gus if he's clean. We'll see.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

So what do they say about Ali exactly?
1- He was turned informant after caught for ID fraud.
2- He was a unreliable.
3- FBI cut ties.

The FBI also could not deport him...despite
1- Alleged ties to terrorists.
2- Felony
3- Fraud
4- Theft
5- Harrassment

Well goddang..
Also,
Apparently, FBI gets him a plea deal but then...tries to deport him??

Maybe people should stop talking out of their asses instead? The guy is shaddy, that's about it.

Little FYI, Janet Cooke is a Pulitzer prize winner who was proven to have frauded her story. Now, that's not to say everyone that has a Pulitzer Prize needs to have an asterisk next to their name, but you really need to stop with the ''appeal to the authority'' arguments.

Outside a little passage in a book, there is no information on AA linked to terrorism, which is rather odd.

I didn't see the part where they tried to deport him afterwards. All I've seen is your first part. He wasn't immediately seen as unreliable, he did the job a long time. Eventually, they saw no more use for him and Ali had already secured his get out of jail free card for doing the work.

You know, you claim I appeal to authority(Pulitzer prize journalists) but you are aware your source is...reddit. You do realize that right?

Again, I hope Ali is a great guy. I don't know him personally, why should I hope for anything bad? If this is true it's bad, not good! Thing is this is what has been investigated. If it is wrong perfect but appealing to reddit posts isn't exactly encouraging.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Lol just throwing whatever they can at the wall and hoping it sticks in a "gotchya" moment.

With that said, ali needs to tone down the smacktalk if wants to rep khabib. Cussing out 50 cent and others doesnt help the guy when hes trying to cleanup the sport and making clowns like colby cringeyton an afterthought.

Who says Ali is trying to clean up the sport?

 

[ImNeverWrong]

Laughable how jones just comes in gets a title shot. Just like Lesnar. Just like cm punk getting a free roster spot. Just like McGregor getting a title shot after the bus. Just like gsp getting a shot vs bisping in a weight class hes never fought in. Same with conor against alvarez, etc, etc. What's the point of even having rankings then?


Theres literally no structure to the ufc. It's all about money. I understand it's a business. But it's a sport first...an if they want to remain professional they will need to clean up the manner in which people get title fights and give opportunities. Otherwise people will start to question the legitimacy of the organization as a whole. if tony Ferguson gets passed on for a mctapper rematch, the ufc will become a total joke in my eyes. I mean I heard one of those idiot paul brothers was going to fight sage northcutt too? Huh?!

 

[ImNeverWrong]

Who says Ali is trying to clean up the sport?

I'm talking about khabib...
Ending this era of bogus smack talking. Bringing back respect to the art of just fighting.

McGregor peaked at who da fook is dat guy. Hes been unbearable since and hes birthed bunch of colby cringeytons as a result.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

I'm talking about khabib...
Ending this era of bogus smack talking. Bringing back respect to the art of just fighting.

McGregor peaked at who da fook is dat guy. Hes been unbearable since and hes birthed bunch of colby cringeytons as a result.

Who said Khabib is trying to clean up the sport either?

Isn't he the one who caused drama with Lobov over basic trash talk?
Didn't Khabib trash talk McGregor's family at open workouts?
Isn't he the one who jumped over the cage?

I mean, McGregor isn't cleaning up sport either, no question...but what did Khabib do that suggests he's trying to clean up the sport?

Ali bitching at 50 cent is nothing. Why are we pointing to Ali's comments as if that's the biggest thing with Khabib lately?

Still, in Khabib's defense the stuff before jumping the cage wasn't over the top but I don't see how he's some pinnacle of class. He's a good guy but I don't think he's one to talk right now.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Laughable how jones just comes in gets a title shot. Just like Lesnar. Just like cm punk getting a free roster spot. Just like McGregor getting a title shot after the bus. Just like gsp getting a shot vs bisping in a weight class hes never fought in. Same with conor against alvarez, etc, etc. What's the point of even having rankings then?


Theres literally no structure to the ufc. It's all about money. I understand it's a business. But it's a sport first...an if they want to remain professional they will need to clean up the manner in which people get title fights and give opportunities. Otherwise people will start to question the legitimacy of the organization as a whole. if tony Ferguson gets passed on for a mctapper rematch, the ufc will become a total joke in my eyes. I mean I heard one of those idiot paul brothers was going to fight sage northcutt too? Huh?!

A lot of the things you mentioned aren't really fair.

Jones technically beat the champion, hence a title shot. I don't even like Jones but it is what it is.

McGregor hadn't lost the 155 belt, hence being first in line.

McGregor fighting Alvares was champ vs champ. Holloway(champ) almost fought Khabib for 155 title, no one minded then.

GSP fighting 185 was questionable for sure. Clear money grab fight. As much as I love GSP(and I was in NYC to see it) I think this one is a stretch. He's a top end legend but skipped the line big time. At 170? Sure. In new weight class? No.

Lesnar? 1000000% BS. I want to see the fight for entertainment and I want DC to get that money fight but its big time bullshit.

I agree Ferguson should get next fight. Honestly McGregor can fight another top end guy, sure...but Khabib again? I don't know. I'd watch it but it's clear money grab.

Logan Paul wanted to face Sage Northcutt. Dana White said no, you can't blame UFC for this...they never agreed.

 

[ImNeverWrong]

Who said Khabib is trying to clean up the sport either?

Isn't he the one who caused drama with Lobov over basic trash talk?
Didn't Khabib trash talk McGregor's family at open workouts?
Isn't he the one who jumped over the cage?

I mean, McGregor isn't cleaning up sport either, no question...but what did Khabib do that suggests he's trying to clean up the sport?

Ali *****ing at 50 cent is nothing. Why are we pointing to Ali's comments as if that's the biggest thing with Khabib lately?

Still, in Khabib's defense the stuff before jumping the cage wasn't over the top but I don't see how he's some pinnacle of class. He's a good guy but I don't think he's one to talk right now.

Hes got the support of most past and current fighters right now actually. Hes brought attention to the manner in which the ufc does business...so yes hes cleaning up the sport.

 

[LyricalLyricist]

Hes got the support of most past and current fighters right now actually. Hes brought attention to the manner in which the ufc does business...so yes hes cleaning up the sport.

By cornering fighters in hotels so you can slap them? Oh okay.