Post-Game Talk: GAME #56: Canucks 4 vs. Flames 3 (S/O): Markstrom masterclass, EP gets his 50th point

[member 290103]

Flames should just be thankful that they got a point tonight. Absolutely dominant performance by the Canucks tonight where the score just as easily could have been 8 or 9-3 for us.

Go Canucks!!!

Lol.

 

[Jack Burton]

How Wow

 

[David Bruce Banner]

This point won't go away.

I think Benning got extremely lucky here that no one took a chance on Markstrom at that time.

Not really. Markstrom, at that point was a dumpster fire.

 

[Bleach Clean]

Not really. Markstrom, at that point was a dumpster fire.

Juolevi is a dumpster fire right now, should we move him for future considerations?

Markstrom still had all the necessary traits to be a #1G. If it were me, I wouldn’t have risked losing that for nothing. YMMV

 

[absolute garbage]

Canucks got destroyed but I think everyone here has to give credit where credit is due.

Thank you Gillis! What a stud Markstrom is.

 

[David Bruce Banner]

Juolevi is a dumpster fire right now, should we move him for future considerations?

Markstrom still had all the necessary traits to be a #1G. If it were me, I wouldn’t have risked losing that for nothing. YMMV

Juolevi isn’t 24. If, by then, he’s playing like a poor man’s Pouliot I’d have no problems waiving him. Although I’ll admit, young defencemen and goalies are poor comparisons.

No team had space on their NHL roster for a player of Markstrom’s caliber at that time. Not even us.

Besides, there was no guarantee he was ever going to turn it around. The total rebuild of Markstrom is one of this regime’s few bright points.

 

[DarrenX]

I think it just goes to show a valuable lesson. It ain’t over till it’s over. You NEVER give up up on a young kid.......especially goaltenders that have a tendency to develop much later.

None of this “D+1” or “D+2” nonsense.

Hutton and Stecher are other examples of how this management group is staying committed to the kids and how they are developing the right way. Hutton isn’t exactly a spring chicken either. Hutton was pushed by Green, but he’s responded in a big way this year. I got nothing but respect for Hutton now.

The reason why I’m mentioning this, is because I have faith that we’ll see the same late development from Virtanen and Juolevi. We’re already seeing a little bit of this from Virtanen.

Always be patient with kids! If someone hasn’t fully developed by the age of 23, they aren’t necessarily castoffs.

This is frankly a bit silly. Teams *have to* evaluate players and make choices, and sometimes that choice has to be to move on from a young player who isn't getting it and make other arrangements.

If we have an opportunity to acquire a left defenceman, do we pass it up because Olli friggin Juolevi will be along any day now? Or do we take a hard look at Juolevi's D+1, D+2, D+3 performance ("nonsense" as you put it) and make decisions accordingly?

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

Travis Green summed this one up nicely - these are the types of games that balance out the schedule. I thought the Canucks were the better team in their previous two losses but they came up short, and here they were, thoroughly outclassed, but managed to come out on top. In all three of those games, goaltending was the X-Factor, IMO (the opposing goalies in our losses, and Markstrom last night)

Markstrom's performance yesterday was the best I've seen in a Vancouver netminder since Luongo's time here. Simply outstanding. Made several five-alarm saves off of Calgary's top snipers in prime scoring positions, and was unbeatable in the shootout. Just terrific from start to finish.

The rest of the team was not as good. I thought Pettersson, Boeser, Horvat and Stecher had moments, and that our PK as a whole was quite good. But five on five, on the PP, and for large stretches of the game, the Canucks just didn't have it. Fortunately their goalie did.

On a different note, to reflect on Markstrom's past - it was definitely a risk to place him on waivers to start the 2014-2015 season. Whether there was a plan to or not, the Canucks had little wiggle room given they had Lack and Miller on the main club that year. But as others have pointed out, there's been plenty of cases of players who went on to become the real deal who cleared waivers at one point or another - Devan Dubnyk is a good example, as is Chris Kunitz. At the end of the day, we clearly lucked out in that Markstrom cleared, and that season in Utica served his development very well. I don't know if you could really call it "strategic", but it worked out in our favour.

 

[Bleach Clean]

Juolevi isn’t 24. If, by then, he’s playing like a poor man’s Pouliot I’d have no problems waiving him. Although I’ll admit, young defencemen and goalies are poor comparisons.

No team had space on their NHL roster for a player of Markstrom’s caliber at that time. Not even us.

Besides, there was no guarantee he was ever going to turn it around. The total rebuild of Markstrom is one of this regime’s few bright points.

No GM thought he had space for Markstrom at the time. Obviously, that decision seems suspect now.

And you're right, there was no guarantee Markstrom was going to put it together. This regime didn’t even know if he would. That’s why they were OK with waiving him.

The age comparison between goalies and Dmen is different, as you have admitted.

Basically, if your end goal is to attribute Markstrom’s post-waive development to this regime, you are free to do so. Just be sure to not forget that he was in fact waived when doing so.

 

[Horse McHindu]

When Markstrom was waived, the probability of another team picking him and making room for him was close to zero. Period. End of story.

A large part of the reason why Markstrom developed into the type of goalie that he isntoday, is due to the way he was developed and nurtured by this management regime. Period. End of story.

 

[Star Ocean]

Erik Karlsson is doubtful for tomorrows game vs canucks. Hopefully he stays out.

 

[Peter10]

When Markstrom was waived, the probability of another team picking him and making room for him was close to zero. Period. End of story.

A large part of the reason why Markstrom developed into the type of goalie that he isntoday, is due to the way he was developed and nurtured by this management regime. Period. End of story.

Or maybe it has to do with working with Clarke instead of Cloutier.

 

[Horse McHindu]

Or maybe it has to do with working with Clarke instead of Cloutier.

I can agree with this.

 

[Fire Benning]

Markstrom's numbers were actually firmly at league average last year and in 15/16 when he was still being blocked by Miller.

His even strength numbers were frequently middle of the pack but his overall numbers took a hit because of the Canucks dreadful penalty kill, which affected the way he was viewed by fans. He was never a complete bum in his Canucks tenure before this season.

 

[Peter10]

Markstrom's numbers were actually firmly at league average last year and in 15/16 when he was still being blocked by Miller.

His even strength numbers were frequently middle of the pack but his overall numbers took a hit because of the Canucks dreadful penalty kill, which affected the way he was viewed by fans. He was never a complete bum in his Canucks tenure before this season.

The main issue was the weak goals he let in every so often and last year he quickly got tired. Wonder if that has anything to do with getting just about 25 games in the 2 years prior. But yeah awesome development plan.

 

[hookshott]

Travis Green summed this one up nicely - these are the types of games that balance out the schedule. I thought the Canucks were the better team in their previous two losses but they came up short, and here they were, thoroughly outclassed, but managed to come out on top. In all three of those games, goaltending was the X-Factor, IMO (the opposing goalies in our losses, and Markstrom last night)

Markstrom's performance yesterday was the best I've seen in a Vancouver netminder since Luongo's time here. Simply outstanding. Made several five-alarm saves off of Calgary's top snipers in prime scoring positions, and was unbeatable in the shootout. Just terrific from start to finish.

The rest of the team was not as good. I thought Pettersson, Boeser, Horvat and Stecher had moments, and that our PK as a whole was quite good. But five on five, on the PP, and for large stretches of the game, the Canucks just didn't have it. Fortunately their goalie did.

On a different note, to reflect on Markstrom's past - it was definitely a risk to place him on waivers to start the 2014-2015 season. Whether there was a plan to or not, the Canucks had little wiggle room given they had Lack and Miller on the main club that year. But as others have pointed out, there's been plenty of cases of players who went on to become the real deal who cleared waivers at one point or another - Devan Dubnyk is a good example, as is Chris Kunitz. At the end of the day, we clearly lucked out in that Markstrom cleared, and that season in Utica served his development very well. I don't know if you could really call it "strategic", but it worked out in our favour.

Not really lucking out. At the beginning of the season, every team has roster problems so very difficult to pick somebody up from waivers. Certainly the best time of the season to send somebody down and have to put them on waivers.

 

[mathonwy]

Not really lucking out. At the beginning of the season, every team has roster problems so very difficult to pick somebody up from waivers. Certainly the best time of the season to send somebody down and have to put them on waivers.

Any implication that this front office is playing 4D underwater parcheesi is laughable as they have proven many times over that they are as kneejerkish and reactionary Mgmt team as one can can get.

 

[Motte and Bailey]

Canucks got destroyed but I think everyone here has to give credit where credit is due.

Thank you Gillis! What a stud Markstrom is.

BUT GILLIS! He’s been gone for so long that he can’t be responsible for anything!

 

[Harold]

When Markstrom was waived, the probability of another team picking him and making room for him was close to zero. Period. End of story.

A large part of the reason why Markstrom developed into the type of goalie that he isntoday, is due to the way he was developed and nurtured by this management regime. Period. End of story.

Hogwash.

As reported at the time, at least four teams had serious interest in Markstrom, who was touted as a “goalie of the future”. Benning took a risk, and it was dumb luck that Markstrom wasn’t claimed.

NHL notes: Canucks place Jacob Markstrom on waivers

 

[TruKnyte]

cant say i follow your logic.

Boeser Pettersson Horvat and whether its Leivo Baertschi Goldobin and Stecher Hutton Edler or IMO Quinn Hughes these guys van legitimately go toe to toe with the Flames top guys who are driving the 2nd best team in the NHL right now.

Gaudreau Monahan Lindholm Giordano Tkachuk
Pettersson Horvat Boeser Edler Baertschi..........Hughes Goldobin/Dahlen ?????

As far as the support groups....
Rittich Hanifin Brodie Hamonic Backlund Bennett Jankowski Frolik
Markstrom Hutton Stecher Tanev Sutter Roussel Leivo Virtanen ..........Gaudette

depth
Anderson Kylington Mangiapane Hathaway Ryan Neal
Pouliot Gudbranson Beagle Motte Eriksson Granlund.......????? ?????? MacEwen

point being you can see were not that far off with some maturity and most importantly a 3c that is playing well and good defense....not 3 train wrecks

I can't say I agree, pretty much every player you listed as a comparable (at least I think that's what you're trying to do, correct me if I'm wrong) for the Canucks is either much worse or has proven nothing yet at the NHL.

Giordano>Edler (whose career is closer to retirement than prime)
Tkachuk>>Baertschi (whose career may be done with concussion issues)
Goldobin: don't know if he's even going to be with the team at the end of this season let alone next
Hughes/Dalen: Haven't played any NHL games yet
Rittich<Markstrom
Hanifin >=Hutton
Hamonic>=Stecher
Bennett>=Leivo (let's see what he can do for a full season)
Jankowski=Virtanen

I'd argue Stecher and Hutton should be 3rd pairing dmen on a contending team. However, I'd be willing to concede that one of them could play in the top 4 if they have a partner that can drive play.

Anderson>>Pouliot
Kylington>Gudbrandson

I'll give you Beagle and Motte, but those aren't players you build around. Rest of the players are straight up bad or career AHL fodder.

So 3. 3 core players to build around.

 

[TruGr1t]

I know next to freaking nothing about Brisebois, but there is absolutely no way he's worse than Pouliot, who is a dumpster fire of epic proportions. There has to be at least one or two guys better than Pouliot in Utica. I refuse to believe there aren't.

 

[PavelBure10]

What a game. Although the Canucks were badly outplayed for a lot of it, specially in the second, Markstrom was there to keep the pucks out. Marky was spectacular, making extremely hard saves look rather easy. Im sure Gaudreau was getting sick of Markstrom's glovehand. Amazing performance by our goaltender, this years MVP of the Canucks.

Really liking Stech on the PP, he is calm, cool and collected out there. He distributes the puck quick and with ease. I really hope Green keeps him on the PP even when Edler comes back. Its refreshing to see a new dman out there.

Love that Pettersson and Boeser continued to collect points.

Overall a truely entertaining Sat game to watch. Markys best game as a Canuck.

 

[Mr. Canucklehead]

I know next to freaking nothing about Brisebois, but there is absolutely no way he's worse than Pouliot, who is a dumpster fire of epic proportions. There has to be at least one or two guys better than Pouliot in Utica. I refuse to believe there aren't.

Given that the Canucks have sat on Alex Biega and played Pouliot over him night after night, I can’t see them benching Pouliot for anyone from the minors (although I agree with you, I’d insert almost anyone into the lineup over him). Green’s fascination with Pouliot is frustrating.

 

[The Drop]

Spinning Markstrom into a win for this current regime lol. Oh the stupidity or dishonety. You pick

 

[M2Beezy]

Kinda losing steam as a hockey fan, dont think we gotta chance in this one. Sorry guys dont mean to be so negative but getting close to thats it

LOL idiot