Post-Game Talk: GAME 33 THE BEAR is doing a Sabredance

[jgatie]

Loved Seidenberg. But what really stood out to me was how coherent Jack Edwards was. Those were the days

I literally didn't recognize his voice. I was thinking it was a national broadcast until I heard Brickley. The drop off has been that severe.

 

[Aussie Bruin]

Not sure they should have kept him depending on what the cost would have been. Don’t recall.

I am happy, though,with the recognition of Sweeney’s strong moves to improve the team for the playoffs. He’s been excellent in that regard multiple times.

So for me wanna talk should? What they SHOULD have done is win the cup after Sweeney made those solid moves. He did his part.

Partly. 2019 he left a gaping hole at 2RW. 2020 his adds were Kase and Ritchie. Woof. 2021 Hall basically fell into his lap and that was nice, but he left the defense clearly undersized and lacking in grit. 2022 he got Lindholm and that was good, team probably needed more but didn't really earn it. Last season he finally went proper all in and credit to him for that. What came after was firmly on the team and the coach.

A decent in-season trade record I would say, but not a great one. Three important, potential Cup-winning years in a row where he didn't do as much as he might have. Doesn't mean he gets all the blame for the team falling short, far from it, but he must wear some.

 

[DarrenBanks56]

Que? He has 4 goals on the year, and three of those are in the last 5 games. 18 points in 33 games, 6 in the last 5 games. He’s been very disappointing this year to Wild fans.

lately since coaching change he has been excellent

 

[BB79]

I'm a fan of both teams, I'm not surprised the Bruins trounced the Sabres. Buffalo= goalies who are barely old enough to drink, poor defense, and honestly bad calls by the refs both ways. (They're terrible the last few seasons, I miss Stewie!) Still, Bruins earned that one.

 

[wintersej]

Partly. 2019 he left a gaping hole at 2RW. 2020 his adds were Kase and Ritchie. Woof. 2021 Hall basically fell into his lap and that was nice, but he left the defense clearly undersized and lacking in grit. 2022 he got Lindholm and that was good, team probably needed more but didn't really earn it. Last season he finally went proper all in and credit to him for that. What came after was firmly on the team and the coach.

A decent in-season trade record I would say, but not a great one. Three important, potential Cup-winning years in a row where he didn't do as much as he might have. Doesn't mean he gets all the blame for the team falling short, far from it, but he must wear some.

On an island, I agree with your points. But, compared to his peers Sweeney is at the very high end with their ability to make quality adds at the deadline.

Of course it comes with a cost with how few picks they have made. Since 2018 the Bruins have only made 5 of a possible 12 picks in the first two rounds. (Poitras, Lorhei, Lysell, Beecher, Axel Anderson). Only one true bust in that group, which frankly is excellent, with a lot of TBDs.

 

[mjhfb]

Ha, from about a month ago:

Worst part of this rant was laughing at Buffalo's two young defensemen, Dahlin and Powers, like they're busts, and asking if people ever heard of them.
Hey, they'd be two defensemen I'd swap with any two on Boston, that's who they are.

 

[Aussie Bruin]

On an island, I agree with your points. But, compared to his peers Sweeney is at the very high end with their ability to make quality adds at the deadline.

Of course it comes with a cost with how few picks they have made. Since 2018 the Bruins have only made 5 of a possible 12 picks in the first two rounds. (Poitras, Lorhei, Lysell, Beecher, Axel Anderson). Only one true bust in that group, which frankly is excellent, with a lot of TBDs.

For sure at the very least he's almost always added something useful. 2020 is the arguable exception but there are mitigating factors there. He's done as I said a decent job and yes good trades are hard and so on. Could I point to a GM who's consistently done it better? Probably not. BriseBois did most of his best work in the offseasons rather than at the deadline. It's that nagging feeling that the Bruins have usually been left an important and self-evident piece short that lowers my esteem for the otherwise solid performance Sweeney has demonstrated in this regard. So-often close but not quite there. But that's been the common story of the Bruins for decades and it goes back well before Don's time, so really he is perhaps just part of the fabric here, in that sense.

 

[Gordoff]

For sure at the very least he's almost always added something useful. 2020 is the arguable exception but there are mitigating factors there. He's done as I said a decent job and yes good trades are hard and so on. Could I point to a GM who's consistently done it better? Probably not. BriseBois did most of his best work in the offseasons rather than at the deadline. It's that nagging feeling that the Bruins have usually been left an important and self-evident piece short that lowers my esteem for the otherwise solid performance Sweeney has demonstrated in this regard. So-often close but not quite there. But that's been the common story of the Bruins for decades and it goes back well before Don's time, so really he is perhaps just part of the fabric here, in that sense.

IMO it's bad policy to rely on the TDL to make significant additions and give them so little time to meld into the system/team, only to watch them leave with nothing to show for the draft pick drain. Sweeney seldom makes bigger moves except for the TDL.
Don't get me wrong, I loved last TDL but I just don't feel we got the best of a guy like Hathaway. At one point IIRC, didn't many of us think that they weren't going to trade draft assets for expiring contracts?
Many of his FA signings have been great fill ins to plug holes but we always seem to be behind TDL trades and spending on some FA's only to end up out of Cap space the next year.
I'm hoping a lot of the issues of "paying it forward" can be corrected due to the Cap going up so much this coming year. But, I also hope that he only uses what he needs to for the best affordable solutions to build out the roster instead of just plugging holes.

 

[Aussie Bruin]

IMO it's bad policy to rely on the TDL to make significant additions and give them so little time to meld into the system/team, only to watch them leave with nothing to show for the draft pick drain. Sweeney seldom makes bigger moves except for the TDL.
Don't get me wrong, I loved last TDL but I just don't feel we got the best of a guy like Hathaway. At one point IIRC, didn't many of us think that they weren't going to trade draft assets for expiring contracts?
Many of his FA signings have been great fill ins to plug holes but we always seem to be behind TDL trades and spending on some FA's only to end up out of Cap space the next year.
I'm hoping a lot of the issues of "paying it forward" can be corrected due to the Cap going up so much this coming year. But, I also hope that he only uses what he needs to for the best affordable solutions to build out the roster instead of just plugging holes.

Yeah I think that's true. FA has arguably been Sweeney's biggest weakness. Not terrible but not great. And that means that you're often playing roster catch up throughout the season, and that has costs and consequences. There's definitely a chance to clean things up and make improvements in terms of roster and cap management this coming offseason, hopefully it's put to good use.

 

[Dr Hook]

On an island, I agree with your points. But, compared to his peers Sweeney is at the very high end with their ability to make quality adds at the deadline.

Of course it comes with a cost with how few picks they have made. Since 2018 the Bruins have only made 5 of a possible 12 picks in the first two rounds. (Poitras, Lorhei, Lysell, Beecher, Axel Anderson). Only one true bust in that group, which frankly is excellent, with a lot of TBDs.

And that one bust he parlayed into another player which could have been a great deal but for Kase’s concussions.

 

[frankiess]

To quiet bruins fan

Wow...thats how you sound when they win?

Sure they are not perfect- in fact far from it. That said- they played with more focus, their passing was better and the forwards won a number of 50-50 puck battles.

I come to this site for objective and enjoyable discussions ....so for one of the very few times I have decided the ignore button is an option to use.

He said he was sorry. I thought that a negotiator solves problems, manages conflicts and builds relationships?

 

[GloveSave1]

Watching Bourque’s retirement on NESN…

Absolutely perfect speech.

 

[Mathews28]

Partly. 2019 he left a gaping hole at 2RW. 2020 his adds were Kase and Ritchie. Woof. 2021 Hall basically fell into his lap and that was nice, but he left the defense clearly undersized and lacking in grit. 2022 he got Lindholm and that was good, team probably needed more but didn't really earn it. Last season he finally went proper all in and credit to him for that. What came after was firmly on the team and the coach.

A decent in-season trade record I would say, but not a great one. Three important, potential Cup-winning years in a row where he didn't do as much as he might have. Doesn't mean he gets all the blame for the team falling short, far from it, but he must wear some.

Some fair points here.

Personally for the most part I’ve felt that the playoff shortfalls have been on the players themselves. In my mind, Sweeney has been one of the better GMs at enhancing the team for greater playoff success. That it hasn’t translated is the product of several factors.

Now on the flip side I will say there were years that i didn’t feel the late season moves were warranted in that they weren’t a strong contender. In those years I might have thought “sell”.

 

[DKH]

Flip on NESN folks

You won’t regret it

1987 vintage Bourque & Neely

Fred & Derek doing

They would beat current Bruins

Helmet less players

 

[elMatador]

Partly. 2019 he left a gaping hole at 2RW. 2020 his adds were Kase and Ritchie. Woof. 2021 Hall basically fell into his lap and that was nice, but he left the defense clearly undersized and lacking in grit. 2022 he got Lindholm and that was good, team probably needed more but didn't really earn it. Last season he finally went proper all in and credit to him for that. What came after was firmly on the team and the coach.

A decent in-season trade record I would say, but not a great one. Three important, potential Cup-winning years in a row where he didn't do as much as he might have. Doesn't mean he gets all the blame for the team falling short, far from it, but he must wear some.

The problem with Sweeney is that he is on a high horse thinking about himself as the smartest person in the room.

Some of his trades were for over the hill/declining fast/damaged players but overpaying for it like they were in the prime: Rick Nash, Kase, Mike Reilly, Stempniak.

His FA signings are the real killer. Way too often he has given rich contracts with NTC, NMC to random players past their prime. He is smart in hiding it when he has to eventually dump them by packaging them with a high pick/s for another shiny toy.

Craig Smith, packaged with 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th for Orlov and Hathaway
John Moore, packaged with 1st, 2nd, 2nd and Vaak for Lindholm
Backes, packaged with 1st for Kase
Beleskey, packaged with 1st, Lindgren and Spooner for Rick Nash
Hall, given for cap space to Blackhawks for free.
Mike Reilly, there were no picks left so he was bought out.
Foligno, was terrible the 1st year.

 

[Gordoff]

The problem with Sweeney is that he is on a high horse thinking about himself as the smartest person in the room.

Some of his trades were for over the hill/declining fast/damaged players but overpaying for it like they were in the prime: Rick Nash, Kase, Mike Reilly, Stempniak.

His FA signings are the real killer. Way too often he has given rich contracts with NTC, NMC to random players past their prime. He is smart in hiding it when he has to eventually dump them by packaging them with a high pick/s for another shiny toy.

Craig Smith, packaged with 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th for Orlov and Hathaway
John Moore, packaged with 1st, 2nd, 2nd and Vaak for Lindholm
Backes, packaged with 1st for Kase
Beleskey, packaged with 1st, Lindgren and Spooner for Rick Nash
Hall, given for cap space to Blackhawks for free.
Mike Reilly, there were no picks left so he was bought out.
Foligno, was terrible the 1st year.

The traded that I hate(d) the most was the Lindgren/Nash one.
Absolutely terrible.

 

[JOKER 192]

The problem with Sweeney is that he is on a high horse thinking about himself as the smartest person in the room.

Some of his trades were for over the hill/declining fast/damaged players but overpaying for it like they were in the prime: Rick Nash, Kase, Mike Reilly, Stempniak.

His FA signings are the real killer. Way too often he has given rich contracts with NTC, NMC to random players past their prime. He is smart in hiding it when he has to eventually dump them by packaging them with a high pick/s for another shiny toy.

Craig Smith, packaged with 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th for Orlov and Hathaway
John Moore, packaged with 1st, 2nd, 2nd and Vaak for Lindholm
Backes, packaged with 1st for Kase
Beleskey, packaged with 1st, Lindgren and Spooner for Rick Nash
Hall, given for cap space to Blackhawks for free.
Mike Reilly, there were no picks left so he was bought out.
Foligno, was terrible the 1st year.

At the end of the day , Sweeny has made made many goods moves but he's also made many horrible moves. I get that hind sight is 20/20 but as elMatador has outlined in detail many assets out the back door guised as wins.

Covid threw a wrench in the wheels of many a GM's plans and Sweeny and many other GM's had to adjust on the fly which would explain some of his short comings but certainly not all. Frankly I think he failed mightily to adjusting to the reality of the situation.

The last off-season however was a stroke of genius IMO. He let Hall go , a player I would have chosen over Seguin . A player I really liked . He let Bertuzzi walk, a player we all saw had some awesome chemistry with Pasta . In hind site however, Taylor Hall is out for the season and JVR alone is outpacing both those players combined . Management did the only thing they could do given the situation. Most of us were all aboard with his TDL moves and rightfully so but hockey is a funny game . When they had to account for overages and lack of cap space it's hard to argue that either Taylor Hall or Tyler Bertuzzi or even both for that matter would have been better assets than ,

JVR 1M
Hienen .775M
Shattenkirk 1.05M
Geekie 2M

Sorry, I can't explain Brown but over all he did very well.

 

[BiteThisBurrows]

JVR 1M
Hienen .775M
Shattenkirk 1.05M
Geekie 2M

Sorry, I can't explain Brown but over all he did very well.

Brown, Boquist, Chiasson along with the above and to some extent Lucic (except maybe Geekie who was good in Seattle and a reasonable move) were all just a smattering of toss against the wall and see what sticks. 4 hits 4 misses is that good? I guess so given the players we are looking at.

Whatever it is, yes, just be thankful it wasn't Bertuzzi.

 

[SonnyBoy]

Que? He has 4 goals on the year, and three of those are in the last 5 games. 18 points in 33 games, 6 in the last 5 games. He’s been very disappointing this year to Wild fans.

How can he be very disappointing when he has done exactly same thing since 2010. 0.54 ppg?

Who is on the unofficial injury list (playing injured)

Lindholm might be healed ,we'll see

Mac ,shoulder

Pasta ?

Who else ?

It can't be his shoulder because when I was worried about it here last summer, some armchair doctor definitely knew that Mac's shoulder gonna last forever, because poster had his shoulder operated and he knew everything about shoulders.

 

[bruins19]

sort of game I expected coming outta the break, thought Jake looked terrific, needs to keep doing that

Very nice set up to Coyle, going behind the net and delivering a perfect pass for Coyle to quickly rip.

 

[bruins19]

you know who looks amazing right now?
marcus johansson.
huuge mistake not keeping him.
coyle had big chemistry with that guy

I was watching the game against Boston with my wife and said, “Look at that guy, he’s flying!” It was Mojo. Surprised he still has those kind of wheels.

 

[Mathews28]

Flip on NESN folks

You won’t regret it

1987 vintage Bourque & Neely

Fred & Derek doing

They would beat current Bruins

Helmet less players

Watched this last night; Dave was in that sometimes awkward 3rd man in the booth role. I chuckled when he made a really good observation about chemistry between penalty killers and Turk said "very good Dave. That's exactly right."

Focused on Bourque a lot in this replay, was reminded, as if i could really forget, how good he was in all aspects of the game.

His sense of composure, anticipation, strength, compete level, ability to see the ice, leadership, etc was off the charts.

 

[DKH]

Watched this last night; Dave was in that sometimes awkward 3rd man in the booth role. I chuckled when he made a really good observation about chemistry between penalty killers and Turk said "very good Dave. That's exactly right."

Focused on Bourque a lot in this replay, was reminded, as if i could really forget, how good he was in all aspects of the game.

His sense of composure, anticipation, strength, compete level, ability to see the ice, leadership, etc was off the charts.

Boom!!!!

Yup - thought same of Dave.

Bourque was unbelievable- there is no defenseman today close to Bourque

Fred was hilarious complaining about how soft the Rangers were

If @Sheppy or @Fenian24 watched this they would be ordering a portrait of Fred Cuisik for the living room (actually Fenian I’m sure saw it in real time)

Kluzak was pretty good and Jay Miller actually looked good

Courtnall wasn’t playing but he was a stud

Courtnall - Linseman- Neely
Burridge - Kasper - Crowder
Carter - Sweeney - Middleton
Miller - O’Dwyer - Byers/Plett

Bourque - Kluzak
Wesley - Larson
Thelven

Renford

Harry should have not traded Courtnall

This was a heck of a team

Bourque & Neely were at peak & the Bruins could kick the crap out of teams

I’m weeping as I type this

 

[Mathews28]

Boom!!!!

Yup - thought same of Dave.

Bourque was unbelievable- there is no defenseman today close to Bourque

Fred was hilarious complaining about how soft the Rangers were

If @Sheppy or @Fenian24 watched this they would be ordering a portrait of Fred Cuisik for the living room (actually Fenian I’m sure saw it in real time)

Kluzak was pretty good and Jay Miller actually looked good

Courtnall wasn’t playing but he was a stud

Courtnall - Linseman- Neely
Burridge - Kasper - Crowder
Carter - Sweeney - Middleton
Miller - O’Dwyer - Byers/Plett

Bourque - Kluzak
Wesley - Larson
Thelven

Renford

Harry should have not traded Courtnall

This was a heck of a team

Bourque & Neely were at peak & the Bruins could kick the crap out of teams

I’m weeping as I type this

100%. Was going to say is there a D man in the last decade as good as Bourque? Because there isn't currently.

Chemistry was so good too. When Middleton scored on that aerial pass, O'Reilly came over and was patting him on the head and shoulder, so appreciative of the effort, Middleton was focused and calm, there was just a vibe about the B's teams of that era.

That the 87-92 teams didn't win cups was largely due to the Oilers and the Pens, both boasting massively talented top players.

I was out of college, working, no kids until 1992, so had all the time avail to watch those teams, miss that.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

The problem with Sweeney is that he is on a high horse thinking about himself as the smartest person in the room.

Some of his trades were for over the hill/declining fast/damaged players but overpaying for it like they were in the prime: Rick Nash, Kase, Mike Reilly, Stempniak.

His FA signings are the real killer. Way too often he has given rich contracts with NTC, NMC to random players past their prime. He is smart in hiding it when he has to eventually dump them by packaging them with a high pick/s for another shiny toy.

Craig Smith, packaged with 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 5th for Orlov and Hathaway
John Moore, packaged with 1st, 2nd, 2nd and Vaak for Lindholm
Backes, packaged with 1st for Kase
Beleskey, packaged with 1st, Lindgren and Spooner for Rick Nash
Hall, given for cap space to Blackhawks for free.
Mike Reilly, there were no picks left so he was bought out.
Foligno, was terrible the 1st year.

Based on 2015 draft (which I agree with) and nothing else.