Proposal: Free agency edition Trade Rumours/Proposals [MOD - Stay on Topic] 4

[Cosmix]

Does formenton return to the lineup and get a contract when his suspension is up, even if it's a longer suspension?

Or would his suspension not commence until he receives a contract?

I heard even away from the whole incident, that formenton and Ottawa don't like each other? If it came out that formenton was in a different country (I know it's no the case) do formenton and Ottawa even agree to terms, or is he done in Ottawa for possibly more than the reason we can't talk about?

I don’t know and will not guess as I do not know what he did

Only way to keep pinto and Joseph is to trade away Kubalik. I rather just attach lassi and a 2nd to Joseph and get the cap space

Hopefully the cap situation can be addressed without paying such a high price

 

[BigRig4]

Pure speculation but I think someone big is going to start on LTIR. The three candidates imo are Norris, Chabot, and Forsberg.

Forsberg doesn’t really make sense because he would have to miss basically the entire year to offset a Pinto extension.

Norris has said very recently he expects to play preseason.

To me the darkhorse is Chabot. Had a major injury and iirc still hasn’t been cleared. I wonder if he misses ~25 games.

 

[Micklebot]

Pure speculation but I think someone big is going to start on LTIR. The three candidates imo are Norris, Chabot, and Forsberg.

Forsberg doesn’t really make sense because he would have to miss basically the entire year to offset a Pinto extension.

Norris has said very recently he expects to play preseason.

To me the darkhorse is Chabot. Had a major injury and iirc still hasn’t been cleared. I wonder if he misses ~25 games.

Putting guys on LTIR doesn't open up space for Pinto beyond during the time the guy is on LTIR. If we use the LTIR room created to extend Pinto we just have find room when whoever comes off LTIR, unlike unused cap space, LTIR space doesn't accumulate

 

[BigRig4]

Putting guys on LTIR doesn't open up space for Pinto beyond during the time the guy is on LTIR. If we use the LTIR room created to extend Pinto we just have find room when whoever comes off LTIR, unlike unused cap space, LTIR space doesn't accumulate

Didn’t know that… disregard essentially everything I’ve said then haha.

 

[Ouroboros]

The easiest way to be cap compliant is to waive Joseph and grind Pinto into a 1M deal. At that point you have a 21 man roster at 83.2M.

If Pinto holds out then Greig plays in the 3C slot.

 

[SlapJack]

The easiest way to be cap compliant is to waive Joseph and grind Pinto into a 1M deal. At that point you have a 21 man roster at 83.2M.

If Pinto holds out then Greig plays in the 3C slot.

It would be easier to ask Gary Bettman for an exception to the rules just for us this year and let Ottawa to go over the cap actually.

We are making hypotheticals not based in reality here, right?

 

[Alf Silfversson]

Putting guys on LTIR doesn't open up space for Pinto beyond during the time the guy is on LTIR. If we use the LTIR room created to extend Pinto we just have find room when whoever comes off LTIR, unlike unused cap space, LTIR space doesn't accumulate

Huh? I'm pretty sure that if Chabot is on LTIR for 50% of the season we get cap relief to the tune of $4M.

Are you saying we don't get that space?

EDIT: Yeah I'm wrong on that one.

 

[Sun God Nika]

If you put a player on LTIR and that player becomes healthy you just can't take that player off LTIR until you can be cap compliant is that the only penalty? Theoretically the Sens can realistically expect that there will always be a injury and just gamble with it.

Realistically you pay the cost to move Joseph and you sign Pinto for 2M~ and call it a day for your roster.

 

[Micklebot]

If you put a player on LTIR and that player becomes healthy you just can't take that player off LTIR until you can be cap compliant is that the only penalty? Theoretically the Sens can realistically expect that there will always be a injury and just gamble with it.

Realistically you pay the cost to move Joseph and you sign Pinto for 2M~ and call it a day for your roster.

Technically, as soon as they are healthy they must come off LTIR, but realistically there's likely some wiggle room based on who determines if they are healthy.

 

[Ouroboros]

It would be easier to ask Gary Bettman for an exception to the rules just for us this year and let Ottawa to go over the cap actually.

We are making hypotheticals not based in reality here, right?

Nothing unrealistic about what I proposed.

Pinto can either play at Ottawa's number or he can go play for even less than that in Finland or wherever. His choice.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

It may be complicated but Steve doesn't offer any possible solutions

 

[BigRig4]

Anyone know how much relief we get (if any) for sending Joseph to the minors?

 

[Sun God Nika]

Anyone know how much relief we get (if any) for sending Joseph to the minors?

1.15m

 

[bert]

Didn’t know that… disregard essentially everything I’ve said then haha.

There's likely never going to be a point this season when everyone is healthy. Your point stands as a premise but yes the details aren't accurate.

Is it? He's a Habs super fan. Like it's not bad but it's not amazing either. They retained alot of money but he skips that part.

 

[Micklebot]

There's likely never going to be a point this season when everyone is healthy. Your point stands as a premise but yes the details aren't accurate.

Unless we have someone on LTIR all season it doesn't work, because if everyone is healthy for even one game you need to clear the space, the last couple years that's been what happens to us, more or less, but I don't think you can bank on it.

We need to move one of Joseph or Brannstrom, I guess Kubalik is also an option. Waiving j
Joseph technically works too, but it's tight. That could buy us time I suppose, but I don't like the idea of burying him all year, that's not a great look imo.

 

[GCK]

You can accrue cap space while a player is on LTIR.

For instance, if Forsberg starts on LTIR. We could get 23 players that add up as close to 83.5M as possible for season start. That becomes our new upper limit. The next day we send a couple players down and we begin accruing cap space. We then need to have enough cap space when Forsberg is ready to make up the difference between Forsberg and Soogard. Finding an LTIRetired contract in the 2M range would really help as we would put them on the initial opening day roster and then put back on LTIR the next day. It’s complex but very doable.

 

[SlapJack]

Is it? He's a Habs super fan. Like it's not bad but it's not amazing either. They retained alot of money but he skips that part.

There's a few parts being skipped to make it seem like they got a ton of stuff for nothing. Matheson was acquired for Petry when Petry had value, then Petry was reacquired and traded out again. Take Matheson out of the list and you've gone to the carnival to spend a ton of cash on crappy midway prizes

 

[bert]

You can accrue cap space while a player is on LTIR.

For instance, if Forsberg starts on LTIR. We could get 23 players that add up as close to 83.5M as possible for season start. That becomes our new upper limit. The next day we send a couple players down and we begin accruing cap space. We then need to have enough cap space when Forsberg is ready to make up the difference between Forsberg and Soogard. Finding an LTIRetired contract in the 2M range would really help as we would put them on the initial opening day roster and then put back on LTIR the next day. It’s complex but very doable.

This was also my understanding. However there seems to be a concensus it's untrue. Which I accepted as fact.

I heard that Chabot is having issues with his wrist unfortunately but I thought it might be a solution to the cap problem. However Mickelbot proved that to be un true.

 

[slamigo]

I thought I read somewhere (Garrioch?) that the Sens aren't worried about Pinto or the cap issue because they have flexibility with Norris potentially not being ready/healthy to start the season? Or maybe Forsberg? I swear I read that.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Putting guys on LTIR doesn't open up space for Pinto beyond during the time the guy is on LTIR. If we use the LTIR room created to extend Pinto we just have find room when whoever comes off LTIR, unlike unused cap space, LTIR space doesn't accumulate

Ya just buys time,

 

[Golden_Jet]

Forsberg is at CTC training atm, not sure how long he’s been in town. Sylvain from le Droit said he’s good to go someone told me today.
Haven’t listened yet, but it’s in this hour somewhere.

Mornings - Hour 3

Steve and Kenny are joined by Sylvain St-Laurent to chat some Sens and Redblacks, they get into Bet and Breakfast and wrap up the hour talking some movies and NBA.

www.tsn.ca

 

[Micklebot]

You can accrue cap space while a player is on LTIR.

For instance, if Forsberg starts on LTIR. We could get 23 players that add up as close to 83.5M as possible for season start. That becomes our new upper limit. The next day we send a couple players down and we begin accruing cap space. We then need to have enough cap space when Forsberg is ready to make up the difference between Forsberg and Soogard. Finding an LTIRetired contract in the 2M range would really help as we would put them on the initial opening day roster and then put back on LTIR the next day. It’s complex but very doable.

So, Forsberg, even on LTIR, counts against the cap. Putting him on LTIR means we now only accumulate cap space when below the ACSL, which for our situation is calculated by taking the team cap hit minus the LTIR players cap it.

So, let's say we make a 23 man roster that has a cap hit of 83.5, plus Forsberg and his 2.75, out teams cap hit would be 86.25, we'd LTIR Forsberg to get to the 23 man roster and use 2.75 from our cap relief pool. The ACSL would then be 83.5. in order to accumulate cap space, we would need to move out over 2.75 mil, so 3 guys at 916k each or more. Once we get below that ACSL level and are no longer using the cap relief pool created by LTIRing Forsberg, we accumulate, but that doesn't really help us enough to get Forsberg back without needing to clear space unless we do a lot more than send some ELC down to the minors.

 

[Golden_Jet]

So, Forsberg, even on LTIR, counts against the cap. Putting him on LTIR means we now only accumulate cap space when below the ACSL, which for our situation is calculated by taking the team cap hit minus the LTIR players cap it.

So, let's say we make a 23 man roster that has a cap hit of 83.5, plus Forsberg and his 2.75, out teams cap hit would be 86.25, we'd LTIR Forsberg to get to the 23 man roster and use 2.75 from our cap relief pool. The ACSL would then be 83.5. in order to accumulate cap space, we would need to move out over 2.75 mil, so 3 guys at 916k each or more. Once we get below that ACSL level and are no longer using the cap relief pool created by LTIRing Forsberg, we accumulate, but that doesn't really help us enough to get Forsberg back without needing to clear space unless we do a lot more than send some ELC down to the minors.

Also, using your example
If Senators are 1 million below cap, and Forsberg goes on LTIR, only 1.75 million million in temporary cap relief until healthy. Meaning 1.75 is listed as LTIR, still get use of the 2.75.

 

[GCK]

So, Forsberg, even on LTIR, counts against the cap. Putting him on LTIR means we now only accumulate cap space when below the ACSL, which for our situation is calculated by taking the team cap hit minus the LTIR players cap it.

So, let's say we make a 23 man roster that has a cap hit of 83.5, plus Forsberg and his 2.75, out teams cap hit would be 86.25, we'd LTIR Forsberg to get to the 23 man roster and use 2.75 from our cap relief pool. The ACSL would then be 83.5. in order to accumulate cap space, we would need to move out over 2.75 mil, so 3 guys at 916k each or more. Once we get below that ACSL level and are no longer using the cap relief pool created by LTIRing Forsberg, we accumulate, but that doesn't really help us enough to get Forsberg back without needing to clear space unless we do a lot more than send some ELC down to the minors.

We would need to accumulate the prorated difference between Forsberg and Sogaard to bring Forsberg back from LTIR.