Flames Development Camp

[TheHudlinator]

Kipper had a bad year, but Irving/Taylor/Macdonald were no better. Given that neither Berra or Ramo have played a day in the NHL, while playing behind a team always on the defense because of poor face-off/possession time, all while have no legit #1/2 pairing defensemen, we're suppose to have better tending?

I disagree MacDonald was light years ahead of what Kipper was. Kipper looked slow and tired in the majority of his game.

I think Gio is a legit #2 defenseman, I don't think any goalie will have good numbers in this system but Kipper simply looked terrible his rebound control was very poor compared to usual, he seemed slow to getting into position to make a 2nd save, and he often seemed to general misread plays. I think that it won't be hard for our goalies this year to out play what Kipper did last year.

 

[herashak]

kipper let in some soft ones but our defense broke down. the quality scoring chances other teams got relative to their total shots was crazy and made our goalies sv pct look even worse.

 

[MarkGio]

His stats were bad, but realistically, he only played in half of our games. Also, despite the bad stats, a very significant portion of the goals he allowed were due to defensive breakdowns, not just soft goaltending. There was a pattern of those that continued regardless of which netminder was guarding the twine.

That said, I agree with your final assessment. I think that we may experience a little bit of a surge just from sheer youth as opposed to tired, veteran legs, and especially when you consider how many green and maliable players will be learning Hartley's system with the benefit of a full training camp.

I think we'll be hungrier and more energetic, and I think that will balance out the perceived loss of talent.

Who's gonna be on this team that's any hungrier? Hudler, Cammy, Stajan, Stempniak, Glencross, Jones, Backlund, Galliardi, Jackman, Bouma and McGratton are all experienced veteran(-ish) guys who have been playing the same old hockey Iginla and Tangs were playing as a Flame, with no room for any new blood. We're still fairly saturated with the same players, the same management and same coaching staff who have trending downwards for the past few years.

How has one draft full of players not NHL ready and the loss of our 4 best players gonna provide more energy?

 

[MarkGio]

I disagree MacDonald was light years ahead of what Kipper was. Kipper looked slow and tired in the majority of his game.

I think Gio is a legit #2 defenseman, I don't think any goalie will have good numbers in this system but Kipper simply looked terrible his rebound control was very poor compared to usual, he seemed slow to getting into position to make a 2nd save, and he often seemed to general misread plays. I think that it won't be hard for our goalies this year to out play what Kipper did last year.

Kipper was distracted and played like he did when Keenan was around; always on edge and shaky most of the time. He still was trusted more than McDonald and played a lot better later on in the season, once his son was born.

Late season Kipper still looked better than McDonald IMO

 

[Noori]

I'm looking forward to doing my end of camp write up. A few guys are going to get some glowing reviews.

Looking forward to it. Thanks for taking the time to go out and watch and share your thoughts with the rest of us.

 

[TheHudlinator]

While we did give up some pretty terrible chances we had a PDO of .969 tied for lowest in the NHL meaning we had a fair amount of bad luck. We also had a Fenwick close % of 51.67 meaning we had control of the puck more than 50% of the time. We were around average for shots against but had the lowest SV% for 5v5 at 890.

What this tells me is we had some bad luck as well as poor goaltending but if you remove the worst goalie we had that played a majority of the games we would have a much better chance at winning game. Basically Kipper dragged us down regardless of who you would rather trust in net, the numbers don't lie that Macdonald was clearly a superior goalie last year.

 

[Anglesmith]

Who's gonna be on this team that's any hungrier? Hudler, Cammy, Stajan, Stempniak, Glencross, Jones, Backlund, Galliardi, Jackman, Bouma and McGratton are all experienced veteran(-ish) guys who have been playing the same old hockey Iginla and Tangs were playing as a Flame, with no room for any new blood. We're still fairly saturated with the same players, the same management and same coaching staff who have trending downwards for the past few years.

How has one draft full of players not NHL ready and the loss of our 4 best players gonna provide more energy?

I just think it's an atmospheric thing, and I think we saw it toward the end of last year. Last year, and every year in recent memory, Iginla has been the captain and unquestioned leader of the team. Players looked to him, and that proved to be both a good thing and a bad thing at a time. Great when he's going, bad when he's not.

The big thing that I noticed post-deadline last year was how the players seemed to be redefining leadership roles and trying to each be leaders for everyone else. Everyone was playing like the team was relying on them. It just seemed like a weight was lifted off of everyone's shoulders.

 

[MarkGio]

While we did give up some pretty terrible chances we had a PDO of .969 tied for lowest in the NHL meaning we had a fair amount of bad luck. We also had a Fenwick close % of 51.67 meaning we had control of the puck more than 50% of the time. We were around average for shots against but had the lowest SV% for 5v5 at 890.

What this tells me is we had some bad luck as well as poor goaltending but if you remove the worst goalie we had that played a majority of the games we would have a much better chance at winning game. Basically Kipper dragged us down regardless of who you would rather trust in net, the numbers don't lie that Macdonald was clearly a superior goalie last year.

I hope so. I'm just sayin' I'm prepared for the long haul.

BTW, those numbers don't separate post Kipper's son being born, for obvious reasons laugh, so his poor numbers could've been dragged down from a bad early season. That's not a stretch given it was a shortened season

 

[MarkGio]

I just think it's an atmospheric thing, and I think we saw it toward the end of last year. Last year, and every year in recent memory, Iginla has been the captain and unquestioned leader of the team. Players looked to him, and that proved to be both a good thing and a bad thing at a time. Great when he's going, bad when he's not.

The big thing that I noticed post-deadline last year was how the players seemed to be redefining leadership roles and trying to each be leaders for everyone else. Everyone was playing like the team was relying on them. It just seemed like a weight was lifted off of everyone's shoulders.

Let's hope you're right. Personally, Id rather bite the bullet and tank, otherwise go out and snag Grabo and Blum and hope for the stars align, but being in between doesn't sound fun, as always

 

[The Gnome]

I don't really think we will be much worse than last year, we'll probably pick 4-7, doubt we make the POs. However I imagine I'll actually enjoy a season for the 1st time in 5 years. These guys will likely play harder than any flames team in recent memory.

Plus you never know with young guys, 1 offseason can make a huge difference. Nobody knows what Baertschi, Brodie, backlund, etc... are going to do next season for sure.

 

[Noori]

If you haven't already, go watch Tim Harrison's interviews on FlamesTV. He's a great kid with tons of enthusiasm and personality and you see that reflected in his play. High-energy, and high-tempo. So far, he's my favorite player from the 2013 draft. Hard not to root for him.

Btw, the scout who supposedly fought like hell just to get Harrison on the list must be pretty pleased. Yes it's only a prospect camp, but he stood out among a lot of high-end talent.

Last point on Harrison. He's an older guy who was passed over last year, so perhaps he's more developed than the rest of his draft class. Still, lots of positive signs for him.

 

[TheHudlinator]

I hope so. I'm just sayin' I'm prepared for the long haul.

BTW, those numbers aren't separate those numbers post Kipper's son being born, for obvious reasons laugh, so his poor numbers could've been dragged down from a bad early season. That's not a stretch given it was a shortened season

While it is possible I don't buy it.

In his first 8 games he had 3 games above .900 and 2 below .800.

In his last 8 games he had 3 games above .900 and 2 below .800.

I think people remember his last home games and think he had a great ending to the season but that simply isn't true he was terrible inconsistent. This isn't saying he was terrible every game but simply put he was not starting goaltender material last in the majority of his games.

I think Ramo will vastly outplay what we had last year in net.

 

[The Gnome]

While it is possible I don't buy it.

In his first 8 games he had 3 games above .900 and 2 below .800.

In his last 8 games he had 3 games above .900 and 2 below .800.

I think people remember his last home games and think he had a great ending to the season but that simply isn't true he was terrible inconsistent. This isn't saying he was terrible every game but simply put he was not starting goaltender material last in the majority of his games.

I think Ramo will vastly outplay what we had last year in net.

I honestly can't imagine ramo and/or Berra being worse than kipper last year. With All due respect to kipper, he was brutal last year. But so was our defense.

 

[TheHudlinator]

I honestly can't imagine ramo and/or Berra being worse than kipper last year. With All due respect to kipper, he was brutal last year. But so was our defense.

Yea I can't find much to give Kipper credit for last year.

I agree our defense was rather brutal but the fact that MacDonald a guy who has only ever played more than 15 games once before this year was able to out up decent numbers tells me that Kipper was more of a problem then the defensem was.

 

[DFF]

Kipper looked slow and tired in the majority of his game.

.

He quit a year early. that's all

 

[MarkGio]

While it is possible I don't buy it.

In his first 8 games he had 3 games above .900 and 2 below .800.

In his last 8 games he had 3 games above .900 and 2 below .800.

I think people remember his last home games and think he had a great ending to the season but that simply isn't true he was terrible inconsistent. This isn't saying he was terrible every game but simply put he was not starting goaltender material last in the majority of his games.

I think Ramo will vastly outplay what we had last year in net.

They all looked bad to me. Irving, Taylor, McDonald and Kipper. And Taylor had the best percentage

The common denominator was a crappy year, offensive system, but it wasn't Kipper as the single cause

 

[TheHudlinator]

They all looked bad to me. Irving, Taylor, McDonald and Kipper. And Taylor had the best percentage

The common denominator was a crappy year, offensive system, but it wasn't Kipper as the single cause

No Kipper was certainly not a single cause and I hope that isn't how my argument is coming off. What I mean is that we have many issues but Kipper was one of the major problems last year as he simply wasn't good enough. I find it hard to image that all of Ortio,Ramo,Berra,MacDonald can't even slightly outplay what our goalies did last year. As even a slight improvement in net will be a big help to the team.

 

[MonahanTHEMoneyMan]

Just wondering who exactly is a contender to pick ahead of us...(most of you thinking we are picking btween 6 to 8). And I dont think our defence improved...|I think it will be worse than last year.

 

[TheHudlinator]

Just wondering who exactly is a contender to pick ahead of us...(most of you thinking we are picking btween 6 to 8). And I dont think our defence improved...|I think it will be worse than last year.

Florida still has as many question marks about defense and goaltending as we do.

If Colorado's defense doesn't improve they are a option.

If Dallas's defense is poor again or Kari gets hurt for a large portion of the season they are an option.

Buffalo is rumored to be trying to move Vanek and Miller so they are an option.

NJD is obvious option.

If Tampa's goaltending doesn't step up they are an option.

Nashville hasn't really improved from last year.

I personally think Winnipeg could fall apart.

So there is 8 teams and that doesn't include teams like Columbus that had a great year but it was unexpected and Philly who still don't have a #1 goalie.

 

[Flamester]

Florida still has as many question marks about defense and goaltending as we do.

If Colorado's defense doesn't improve they are a option.

If Dallas's defense is poor again or Kari gets hurt for a large portion of the season they are an option.

Buffalo is rumored to be trying to move Vanek and Miller so they are an option.

NJD is obvious option.

If Tampa's goaltending doesn't step up they are an option.

Nashville hasn't really improved from last year.

I personally think Winnipeg could fall apart.

So there is 8 teams and that doesn't include teams like Columbus that had a great year but it was unexpected and Philly who still don't have a #1 goalie.

remember new jersey downt have a 1st round pick next year so you can remove them from your list

 

[tyflames]

Just wondering who exactly is a contender to pick ahead of us...(most of you thinking we are picking btween 6 to 8). And I dont think our defence improved...|I think it will be worse than last year.

Jersey is going to be bad. I think Florida, Carolina, Nashville, Colorado, Tampa will all improve. I put us in the bottom 3. I think New Jersey is going to have the worst year. Buffalo could be bad as well.

 

[TheHudlinator]

remember new jersey downt have a 1st round pick next year so you can remove them from your list

True those poor ********. I still think we could finish ahead of them in the standings.

 

[herashak]

florida buffalo and tampa are the only teams im worried about being worse than us

 

[MarkGio]

remember new jersey downt have a 1st round pick next year so you can remove them from your list

I got to feel bad for Jersey. They lost Oduya, Comier, Bgfors, and two first round picks, one of which will be a top 5 pick, for nothing but 150 games of Kovalchuck.

Not to mention the (arguably) best goalie in NHL history, Clarkson, Parise, and a few guys here and there have left their roster lately with nothing in return.

Plus they're also struggling financially. Given how hard it will be to recover from this, I imagine they will have to worry about losing their franchise in a decades time.

 

[InfinityIggy]

Anyone else seen Berra's interview on the flames site?

"Yeah, is really beautiful you have small mountains. In Switzerland we have really big mountains".