Fire/Don't Fire/Discuss Torts II

[Viqsi]

Torts was also still employed by Vancouver so they had to get permission to even talk to him.

I give Jarmo a pass on the "not finishing above third in the division" thing, they were fifth in the league one year but of course two of the four teams to have more points were in the division.

Fourth in the league, actually. The top-5 were Washington (118), Pittsburgh (111), Chicago (109), Columbus (108), and Minnesota (106). Of the 9 teams that were above 100 points that season, four were from the Metro.
2016-2017 NHL Hockey Standings

 

[EDM]

We can all talk about how the great the Jackets would be if they had Panarin, PLDouche and Bjork on the same line. That would make as much sense as talking about how good the Reds would be with Hank Aaron, Will Mays and Roberto Clemente in the same outfield. Panarin was offered $10 million a year and he said "no". He signed with New York for less. So what is the point of talking about how it would be different "if" we had a different team.

By the way, are people sure Jarmo drafted Bjork?

 

[Viqsi]

By the way, are people sure Jarmo drafted Bjork?

That depends on whether or not they're also sure he drafted Wennberg and Rychel and Dano.

 

[EDM]

Oh, he drafted that troika alright.

 

[majormajor]

We can all talk about how the great the Jackets would be if they had Panarin, PLDouche and Bjork on the same line. That would make as much sense as talking about how good the Reds would be with Hank Aaron, Will Mays and Roberto Clemente in the same outfield. Panarin was offered $10 million a year and he said "no". He signed with New York for less. So what is the point of talking about how it would be different "if" we had a different team.

By the way, are people sure Jarmo drafted Bjork?

Jarmo drafted Bjorkstrand.

He offered Panarin $12m actually.

You talk about the counterfactual if you are evaluating Jarmo's team building abilities. Is he just incapable of acquiring top end offensive talent? Or did the team just have some unfortunate defections? (It's the second one).

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Oh, he drafted that troika alright.

Then yeah he drafted Bjork

Also jarmo tried to make Panarin the richest player in the nhl. He didn’t *just* offer him 10 million.

 

[EDM]

In my mind acquiring and retaining are rather heavily related. The job of a GM is more than to just "acquire". I do not fault him in any way for the Panarin situation. As to the departure of PLDouce and Anderson, however, Jarmo's role is far from clear.

 

[pscbj80]

In my mind acquiring and retaining are rather heavily related. The job of a GM is more than to just "acquire". I do not fault him in any way for the Panarin situation. As to the departure of PLDouce and Anderson, however, Jarmo's role is far from clear.

Seemed like with Anderson Jarmo didn't want to give him term with his injury history.

 

[majormajor]

Seemed like with Anderson Jarmo didn't want to give him term with his injury history.

Yes for sure. The more contentious issue that some of us have with Jarmo regarding Anderson was the way Jarmo handled things in 2017. It seems to have set up Anderson's departure.

 

[EDM]

Yes, 2017 was that to which I was referring. That incident combined with whatever happened in the PLDouche negotiations do leave a question mark next to Jarmo's performance record.

 

[Viqsi]

At this point, I suspect Torts may well be doomed, and it's not even his fault. If we could contrive to keep him somehow, I would. But at this point the current malaise is seemingly beyond the power of anybody presently in the organization to fix. We needed a clean break away from The Traitor's FUD to keep the locker room together, but that gutless little shitheel couldn't even give us that much. So we'd have to artificially create such a break, and the only means I can see that would do that would be swapping out the coach.

That said, if Torts wants to stick around, I'd let him - I don't think we can save this season at this point. I don't think there's enough practice time to bring in someone new and get the effect we need. And, again, it's not anything he did; he deserves to go out on his own terms if he's going out. Maybe an actual offseason with an actual preseason will clear it and we can keep Torts - assuming he doesn't want to just retire. I dunno.

It's just so g-ddamn frustrating. We got Fifth Columned in the worst possible way and the winningest coach in franchise history is likely to end up paying the price for it.

 

[majormajor]

At this point, I suspect Torts may well be doomed, and it's not even his fault. If we could contrive to keep him somehow, I would. But at this point the current malaise is seemingly beyond the power of anybody presently in the organization to fix. We needed a clean break away from The Traitor's FUD to keep the locker room together, but that gutless little shitheel couldn't even give us that much. So we'd have to artificially create such a break, and the only means I can see that would do that would be swapping out the coach.

That said, if Torts wants to stick around, I'd let him - I don't think we can save this season at this point. I don't think there's enough practice time to bring in someone new and get the effect we need. And, again, it's not anything he did; he deserves to go out on his own terms if he's going out. Maybe an actual offseason with an actual preseason will clear it and we can keep Torts - assuming he doesn't want to just retire. I dunno.

It's just so g-ddamn frustrating. We got Fifth Columned in the worst possible way and the winningest coach in franchise history is likely to end up paying the price for it.

I think it might not be a curse or hex or anything like that.

But then again I'm thinking it's Max Domi's fault. So is that a better answer?

 

[Finner]

Only Sens and Canucks are allowed more goals than we. That stat is is awful our defencegame has been disaster. Scoring is in middle so our problem isnt offence its defence thats nuts

 

[majormajor]

Only Sens and Canucks are allowed more goals than we. That stat is is awful our defencegame has been disaster. Scoring is in middle so our problem isnt offence its defence thats nuts

It's even more striking than that. They've played 10 games this month, and allowed 41 goals against. That's dead last at 4.1 GA/GP.

They've scored 36, and 3.6 GF/GP is 5th best in the league in that span.


You can look at how our defensemen performed in those ten games (the problem sure isn't Jones and Gavrikov, they've been good), and how our forwards performed in those ten games. The guys getting buried at 5v5 have been Domi, Stenlund, and Laine.

 

[Finner]

It's even more striking than that. They've played 10 games this month, and allowed 41 goals against. That's dead last at 4.1 GA/GP.

They've scored 36, and 3.6 GF/GP is 5th best in the league in that span.


You can look at how our defensemen performed in those ten games (the problem sure isn't Jones and Gavrikov, they've been good), and how our forwards performed in those ten games. The guys getting buried at 5v5 have been Domi, Stenlund, and Laine.

And these stats are unbealivible. We need trades cause these guys just cant do what it needs. Z ofc back from injury but its not enough

 

[JacketsDavid]

You can look at how our defensemen performed in those ten games (the problem sure isn't Jones and Gavrikov, they've been good), and how our forwards performed in those ten games. The guys getting buried at 5v5 have been Domi, Stenlund, and Laine.

Pretty scary stuff (and I just looked at forwards).

 

[MoeBartoli]

It's even more striking than that. They've played 10 games this month, and allowed 41 goals against. That's dead last at 4.1 GA/GP.

They've scored 36, and 3.6 GF/GP is 5th best in the league in that span.


You can look at how our defensemen performed in those ten games (the problem sure isn't Jones and Gavrikov, they've been good), and how our forwards performed in those ten games. The guys getting buried at 5v5 have been Domi, Stenlund, and Laine.

Thanks for the various stats. Just a couple of (obvious) observations:

*hard to believe a Tort coached team would be last in GA/G.

*way to many D men have some troubling overall numbers surprising “led”by Savard (another case where the analytics and eye test match). Peeke hasn’t been vey good either.

* Kukan is an interesting one whose stats confirm the eye test. He has some good numbers, but the eye’s reveal of his problems in losing puck battles behind the net and in corners, leading to turnovers, are seen in the xGA and GA numbers.

*My feelings on Domi have been expressed many times on this Board and I can only say that if I’m a forward, I pray to not be saddled on a line with him.

*I believe if Torts keeps Bjork with Laine, it’ll help Laine’s underlying numbers while increasing Bjork’s box score numbers.

 

[MoeBartoli]

Well, Montreal wasn’t all that patient. They just fired Julien per The Athletic.

 

[InfiniteElement]

Well, Montreal wasn’t all that patient. They just fired Julien per The Athletic.

 

[MAHJ71]

Well, Montreal wasn’t all that patient. They just fired Julien per The Athletic.

Woah.

 

[MoeBartoli]

Just reporting a firing in Montreal.....not a commentary on Blue Jackets situation.

 

[Viqsi]

Well, Montreal wasn’t all that patient. They just fired Julien per The Athletic.

I still prefer holding on to Tortorella. But anyone else who peeks at the Preds board now and again may have noticed that I've started dropping hints over there.

 

[DarkandStormy]

Well, Montreal wasn’t all that patient. They just fired Julien per The Athletic.

That's what happens when you go 2-4-2 and lose back-to-back games to Ottawa.

 

[DarkandStormy]

Hmmm, sounds like Columbus.

 

[koteka]

That is crazy. I was just looking at Montreal’s stats this morning. Everyone here is focused on Anderson’s goals, but do you know who leads that team in goals and points? Tyler freaking Toffoli. Jeff Petry is 2nd on the team in points. Seems like a huge overreaction to losing to Ottawa. Unless there is something else like he has been sending out pics of his dong.