F Seth Jarvis - Portland Winterhawks, WHL (2020, 13th, CAR)

[FlyguyOX]

I think EDM is fine with Holloway falling to them instead of Jarvis, Mercer is going to be a player, Amirov and Guhle looked vg at the WJC's. They are all significantly bigger and stronger than Jarvis.

You could say that all of them have higher floors than Jarvis, but CAR is gambling on Jarvis's skill being able to translate to the NHL.

None of those players compare to Jarvis’s skill/skating/compete ability and combination. Holloway specifically lacks hockey IQ. Jarvis has a higher upside than all of them

 

[snipes]

None of those players compare to Jarvis’s skill/skating/compete ability and combination. Holloway specifically lacks hockey IQ. Jarvis has a higher upside than all of them

Fake news.

As for the skating and compete comments, just lol at that as well.

 

[bishop12]

Which GM’s ? He was picked 13th overall.

Buffalo, New Jersey etc

 

[bishop12]

Holloway is a 3rd liner in the NHLer.

 

[Zahra Starker]

None of those players compare to Jarvis’s skill/skating/compete ability and combination. Holloway specifically lacks hockey IQ. Jarvis has a higher upside than all of them

Im a habs fan and ive watched Caufield/Wisconsin play since after the world Juniors and you're so wrong is hilarious. Holloway is a great player. He's a good skater with good speed and size. No he doesn't have Crosby's hockey IQ but its still good. Guhle and Amirov or probably already better players than Jarvis but Jarvis has a higher upside but also a lower floor.

 

[Artorius Horus T]

Im a habs fan and ive watched Caufield/Wisconsin play since after the world Juniors and you're so wrong is hilarious. Holloway is a great player. He's a good skater with good speed and size. No he doesn't have Crosby's hockey IQ but its still good. Guhle and Amirov or probably already better players than Jarvis but Jarvis has a higher upside but also a lower floor.

Aha ha ha ha ha, but excuse you.....

 

[Frolov 6'3]

Buffalo, New Jersey etc

If Holtz wasnt picked up by New Jersey than he would by the next GM.

Love the “etc” too.

 

[Zahra Starker]

Aha ha ha ha ha, but excuse you.....

I believe Guhle is physically more ready for the NHL than Jarvis even tough he is a defenceman. Jarvis obviously has the higher upside. Then again you seem to know absolutely everything about Hockey so why argue? Im surprised you dont have a job in the NHL.

 

[Zaddy]

Which GM’s ? He was picked 13th overall.

Time will tell, but I had Jarvis ranked ahead of everyone picked ahead of him except Lafreniere, Stützle and Raymond I believe. I think he'll at the very least likely be better than Rossi, Holtz and Quinn.

 

[John Mandalorian]

Fake news.

As for the skating and compete comments, just lol at that as well.

The IQ questions are fair. He’s off to a hot start , no doubt, but it’s only 12 games into his season. Maybe you should wait a little longer to see how the season goes?

Last year he had less than a half a pt per game in 35 games. Maybe he wasn’t really as bad as sub .5 ppl player but maybe he’s also not a 2 ppg player? This 12 games could be a correction and he could cool off? But I see a lot of Oilers fans getting carried away over 12 games.

 

[Draiskull]

No need to talk Holloway here especially if commenting on GMs who passed up on Jarvis. EDM picked after CAR so werent one of the teams.
Great start for Jarvis in AHL. Best of luck to the kid.

 

[Frolov 6'3]

Time will tell, but I had Jarvis ranked ahead of everyone picked ahead of him except Lafreniere, Stützle and Raymond I believe. I think he'll at the very least likely be better than Rossi, Holtz and Quinn.

A bit like your opinion about Cozens 37 days ago, all tools but no toolbox ? No offense.

If you think Jarvis was the 5th best player, good for you but thats why there are scouts. At least 12 thought otherwise. They can be terribly wrong but not as bad as the armchair scouts on this site.

 

[North]

The IQ questions are fair. He’s off to a hot start , no doubt, but it’s only 12 games into his season. Maybe you should wait a little longer to see how the season goes?

Last year he had less than a half a pt per game in 35 games. Maybe he wasn’t really as bad as sub .5 ppl player but maybe he’s also not a 2 ppg player? This 12 games could be a correction and he could cool off? But I see a lot of Oilers fans getting carried away over 12 games.

Actually Holloway was playing behind Turcotte, etc and was one of the youngest guys playing in the NCAA. He ended last season with 9 points in 10 games.

He’s getting opportunities this season that he didn’t get last season and he’s taking advantage of it.

But this is the Jarvis thread do might as well return to him. I think Jarvis is a great prospect too.

 

[Zaddy]

A bit like your opinion about Cozens 37 days ago, all tools but no toolbox ? No offense.

Lol what? I am proven wrong on Cozens 9 games into his NHL career, is that what you're saying? Seems reasonable. I've never said that he was going to bust btw, just that I don't think he'll be a 1st liner / true impact player that you'd expect from a high pick.

If you think Jarvis was the 5th best player, good for you but thats why there are scouts. At least 12 thought otherwise. They can be terribly wrong but not as bad as the armchair scouts on this site.

"That's why there are scouts", yeah like scouts who thought Puljujärvi was 3rd best in 2016 and Yakupov the best in 2012, just to name two of a myriad of examples of scouts getting extremely highly ranked players wrong. These guys gets it wrong just as much as anyone else who is dedicated to posting about prospects on this site.

 

[MatthewFlames]

They are all significantly bigger and stronger than Jarvis.

This doesn't matter one bit - just watch the highlights of Jarvis scoring this weekend. Despite his size he's in the crease battling and winning against men already. Do you think bigger/stronger players than Pat Kane should have gone before him even though he's way better?

 

[Frolov 6'3]

Lol what? I am proven wrong on Cozens 9 games into his NHL career, is that what you're saying? Seems reasonable. I've never said that he was going to bust btw, just that I don't think he'll be a 1st liner / true impact player that you'd expect from a high pick.

The odds you are wrong is quite substantial yes. Thats is why i am not very interested in lists from posters.

"That's why there are scouts", yeah like scouts who thought Puljujärvi was 3rd best in 2016 and Yakupov the best in 2012, just to name two of a myriad of examples of scouts getting extremely highly ranked players wrong. These guys gets it wrong just as much as anyone else who is dedicated to posting about prospects on this site.

Its no exact science, thats what i said already. No idea why you missed that part.

If you think these guys gets it wrong as much as anyone else here who is dedicated, than we can better stop the discussion yes.

 

[Zaddy]

The odds you are wrong is quite substantial yes. Thats is why i am not very interested in lists from posters.

Yeah? Based on what? Because he was ranked high and picked 7th?

Anyway you're not the first to give me flak for my opinions. I heard much worse in 2016 when I said similar things about Puljujärvi's future potential. Turns out scouts do get it very wrong, a lot. Remember 2015? Who thought it was a good idea to draft Lawson Crouse ahead of Barzal? I had Barzal 6th that year, ahead of Strome, Zacha, Crouse, Guryanov, Zboril, DeBrusk, Senyshyn, all of whom were picked ahead of him by these genius scouts you mention yet are worse players six years post-draft.

Maybe the same will happen with Jarvis, maybe not, but as I said I think at least a couple of players drafted ahead of him will have worse careers than him. It's not particularly outrageous to suggest that.

If you think these guys gets it wrong as much as anyone else here who is dedicated, than we can better stop the discussion yes.

Not sure if you're aware but there are plenty of knowledgeable posters on this site, some of whom have gone on to scout (or adjacent role) professionally. I'm not talking about the average guy with a hot take, I'm talking the guys that have been here for years and know their stuff.

Also if we're talking a single guy vs an entire NHL scouting staff then yes, it would be a damn shame if those guys weren't able to outperform a single guy, yet the Canucks scouting staff was outdrafted by a potato at one point so...not sure why you put these guys on a pedestal.

 

[Frolov 6'3]

Yeah? Based on what? Because he was ranked high and picked 7th?

Anyway you're not the first to give me flak for my opinions. I heard much worse in 2016 when I said similar things about Puljujärvi's future potential. Turns out scouts do get it very wrong, a lot. Remember 2015? Who thought it was a good idea to draft Lawson Crouse ahead of Barzal? I had Barzal 6th that year, ahead of Strome, Zacha, Crouse, Guryanov, Zboril, DeBrusk, Senyshyn, all of whom were picked ahead of him by these genius scouts you mention yet are worse players six years post-draft.

Maybe the same will happen with Jarvis, maybe not, but as I said I think at least a couple of players drafted ahead of him will have worse careers than him. It's not particularly outrageous to suggest that.


Not sure if you're aware but there are plenty of knowledgeable posters on this site, some of whom have gone on to scout (or adjacent role) professionally. I'm not talking about the average guy with a hot take, I'm talking the guys that have been here for years and know their stuff.

Also if we're talking a single guy vs an entire NHL scouting staff then yes, it would be a damn shame if those guys weren't able to outperform a single guy, yet the Canucks scouting staff was outdrafted by a potato at one point so...not sure why you put these guys on a pedestal.

Summary;
Poster; Many GMs will regret passing on Jarvis.
Me; Why, he was picked pretty high already (between the lines: no real reaches & everyone who is playing is doing fine).
You; I had him ahead of everyone except Lafreniere, Stützle and Raymond.

Sorry thats too much for me. How can I say this politely .... ok nice but who cares: 12 teams with a full scouting staff are probably extremely happy with their pick and I can see that. Even when a team is not, than I have a hard time to believe eight teams have made a “mistake” with players like Sanderson, Bustfield, Dysdale, Lundell etc in front of him.

 

[Zaddy]

Summary;
Poster; Many GMs will regret passing on Jarvis.
Me; Why, he was picked pretty high already (between the lines: no real reaches & everyone who is playing is doing fine).
You; I had him ahead of everyone except Lafreniere, Stützle and Raymond.

Sorry thats too much for me. How can I say this politely .... ok nice but who cares: 12 teams with a full scouting staff are probably extremely happy with their pick and I can see that. Even when a team is not, than I have a hard time to believe eight teams have made a “mistake” with players like Sanderson, Bustfield, Dysdale, Lundell etc in front of him.

I said "time will tell", I didn't say everyone who picked someone else ahead of him are idiots or that every GM who passed on him would regret it. I only said where I personally had him ranked, indicating that I'm a big fan of the player. Then I said, very reasonably, that I believe at least Jarvis will be better than Holtz, Quinn and Rossi. I didn't say anything about the other guys.

If you read my post in detail you'd see there is nothing to get upset about. Yet somehow you took it as an invitation to try and dunk on me by posting about Cozens (completely irrelevant in this thread), and even in doing so you just dodged my question and the only thing you are doing is engaging in appeal to authority arguments rather than having any type of original thought.

 

[majormajor]

I also had Jarvis crazy high on my personal list. Not that I really think I have much expertise here, but when I made a list based on what I saw, I had to put him 4th.

I had Lafreniere, Stutzle, Rossi ahead of him. Obviously Jarvis having a good start in the A doesn't mean much, and I'm sure my list will be way off.

 

[Frolov 6'3]

I said "time will tell", I didn't say everyone who picked someone else ahead of him are idiots or that every GM who passed on him would regret it. I only said where I personally had him ranked, indicating that I'm a big fan of the player. Then I said, very reasonably, that I believe at least Jarvis will be better than Holtz, Quinn and Rossi. I didn't say anything about the other guys.

If you read my post in detail you'd see there is nothing to get upset about. Yet somehow you took it as an invitation to try and dunk on me by posting about Cozens (completely irrelevant in this thread), and even in doing so you just dodged my question and the only thing you are doing is engaging in appeal to authority arguments rather than having any type of original thought.

Yes too many people think they can say anything about a prospect without any type of original thought. You did so too with Cozens. Somehow popular to do so but terribly annoying imo, I am not upset.

If Jarvis was picked somewhere late 1st round/early 2nd round, you had not heard me. Now I think it was just another one liner without any reasonable thought.

I am also getting tired to constantly read about the usual suspects like Rossi, Holtz, Quinn, just because of the WJC. Its so simple. After the WJC, these players have become outcasts on this site.

 

[John Mandalorian]

A bit like your opinion about Cozens 37 days ago, all tools but no toolbox ? No offense.

If you think Jarvis was the 5th best player, good for you but thats why there are scouts. At least 12 thought otherwise. They can be terribly wrong but not as bad as the armchair scouts on this site.

Actually the Draft Dynasty guy (YSP), who has been hired by the Canadiens as a video scout, had him at #6.

 

[GoldiFox]

Actually the Draft Dynasty guy (YSP), who has been hired by the Canadiens as a video scout, had him at #6.

He had Jarvis at #4

Spoiler

 

[Zaddy]

Yes too many people think they can say anything about a prospect without any type of original thought. You did so too with Cozens. Somehow popular to do so but terribly annoying imo, I am not upset.

Then you don't know me at all. I've posted about Cozens since his draft year with extended thoughts on what I don't like about his game, providing multiple examples in the form of video clips. So that is a completely inaccurate claim. I've done the same for many other prospects, including Jarvis by the way. I didn't put him high on my list for nothing, you know.

If Jarvis was picked somewhere late 1st round/early 2nd round, you had not heard me. Now I think it was just another one liner without any reasonable thought.

I genuinely don't understand what you're saying here. Can you clarify?

I am also getting tired to constantly read about the usual suspects like Rossi, Holtz, Quinn, just because of the WJC. Its so simple. After the WJC, these players have become outcasts on this site.

My opinion on any of those guys haven't changed because of the WJC. You can easily find my posts on those guys from before the draft if you search for it. I was never a fan of Rossi, I was always a bit skeptical of Holtz and while I've always believed Quinn and Jarvis to be really close as prospects I've always thought that Jarvis has the higher ceiling. Quinn had a very disappointing WJC relative to my expectations which has made me cool off on him ever so slightly but I still really like him long-term. I just don't think he'll be as good as Jarvis.

 

[John Mandalorian]

He had Jarvis at #4

Spoiler

Ok, thanks for the clarification. I was too lazy to look it up but knew it was in that ballpark.