Expansion Draft Discussion

[EspenK]

I am not clear on one aspect of the secret lists.

Will our front office know the lists of the other teams?

I'd think league wide there'd be a lot of interest in having the lists and Las Vegas would benefit as an intermediary.

Legally I don't think so. Practically a whole lot will know a whole lot. An dif you really think about it we all could probably "know" a team's list to within a guy or two.

 

[spintheblackcircle]

I'm seeing more than one person saying Vegas will take JMFJ.

 

[The Jones Zone]

I'm seeing more than one person saying Vegas will take JMFJ.

it wouldn't surprise me, except He would be an UFA after 1 year with them

 

[Xoggz22]

it wouldn't surprise me, except He would be an UFA after 1 year with them

Would be a great trade deadline asset next year for them. That's one reason I suggested it earlier in thread.

 

[EspenK]

Although it could hurt next year I'm not sure that he isn't the best choice for us to lose.

Murray-Savard as the 2nd pair

re-signed Quincey-Nuti 3rd pair

Harrington 7th D

and we keep all our F's + Korpi.

Sign me up for LV taking JJ.

 

[EspenK]

Hartnell doesn't waive.

Who do you leave unprotected? Jenner or Anderson? Decision made a lot tougher by Jenner's recent play.

I say Anderson. He is younger, more cost controlled, bigger, faster and I think has a higher consistent ceiling.

 

[CalBuckeyeRob]

Would be a great trade deadline asset next year for them. That's one reason I suggested it earlier in thread.

It is one of the important considerations for LV. The expansion draft will not allow them to be an instant playoff team and once it is over, they are in the same position as every other lower tier franchise, fighting for access to good young talent in the draft. I see them looking for tradeable vets that will allow them to extend the impact of the expansion draft and to try to trade for expansion excluded young players and future picks in return for passing on a player that might be more valuable in the short term.

 

[major major]

Although it could hurt next year I'm not sure that he isn't the best choice for us to lose.

Murray-Savard as the 2nd pair

re-signed Quincey-Nuti 3rd pair

Harrington 7th D

and we keep all our F's + Korpi.

Sign me up for LV taking JJ.

Either way, JJ isn't in the long term plans (unless Murray is traded).

JJ's played well but Savard is the reason that pair has been dominating.

I think the pairings long term should be:

Werenski - Savard
Murray - Jones

Things could change but so far we've seen that Murray plays much better with Jones than with Savard. And Werenski - Savard was our best pairing when Jones was injured.

I think this set up gives us two top pairs, and the other set up, only one (the horror!).

 

[KJ Dangler]

After watching yesterday's game , if we lose Wild Bill to expansion, I think Sedlak takes over without us missing a beat . To me this is idea scenario

 

[KJ Dangler]

Hartnell doesn't waive.

Who do you leave unprotected? Jenner or Anderson? Decision made a lot tougher by Jenner's recent play.

I say Anderson. He is younger, more cost controlled, bigger, faster and I think has a higher consistent ceiling.

You make a trade and aquire another protected spot . No way I let Boone or Anderson walk.

 

[Nanabijou]

You make a trade and aquire another protected spot . No way I let Boone or Anderson walk.

Can you elaborate on an example trade that would open up a protected spot and would be a decent deal for the CBJ?

One doesn't easily spring to my mind.

Buying out Hartnell might be the best option, but that's not a trade. Otherwise you have to be talking about trading Saad, Wennberg or Atkinson for rookies/prospects/draft choices.

 

[CBJfan4evr]

I'm betting Hartnell waives

my top 3 LV targets

Wild Bill
Korpi
Nuti (longshot)

I could see Jarmo putting together a package that would include Milano, + to protect current roster

 

[major major]

I'm betting Hartnell waives

my top 3 LV targets

Wild Bill
Korpi
Nuti (longshot)

I could see Jarmo putting together a package that would include Milano, + to protect current roster

The way Karlsson has played I take Seds (if I was LV). Karlsson is a solid defensive C but I think they're looking for something with long term upside, and that's not Karlsson. I don't think Nuti is eligible.

 

[db2011]

I'm going to demonstrate some of my ignorance here, but I was wondering- the expansion draft rules stipulate that if a player has 2 years of pro-level play, they are eligible for the expansion draft, which means they don't distinguish between the NHL-level and the AHL. I'm wondering what might be the reason for this? Is it primarily because the Knights are also drafting for their AHL team?

Would it have made any sense to distinguish between the leagues, like by stipulating a >2 years cutoff for the NHL and >3 years for any other pro league?

 

[Forepar]

I'm going to demonstrate some of my ignorance here, but I was wondering- the expansion draft rules stipulate that if a player has 2 years of pro-level play, they are eligible for the expansion draft, which means they don't distinguish between the NHL-level and the AHL. I'm wondering what might be the reason for this? Is it primarily because the Knights are also drafting for their AHL team?

Would it have made any sense to distinguish between the leagues, like by stipulating a >2 years cutoff for the NHL and >3 years for any other pro league?

You want to bring logic into this? It's the NHL.
LOL.
I understand your point. I guess it is what it is.

 

[JacketFanInFL]

What would make Las Vegas want to take Karlsson?

I could see them picking up Jenner and trying to shoehorn him onto the first line.

 

[JacketFanInFL]

I'm betting Hartnell waives

my top 3 LV targets

Wild Bill
Korpi
Nuti (longshot)

I could see Jarmo putting together a package that would include Milano, + to protect current roster

Why would he waive to go rot in Las Vegas or be on a contender in Columbus? I'm genuinely curious why folks think he will waive his NTC.

 

[Old Guy]

I'm going to demonstrate some of my ignorance here, but I was wondering- the expansion draft rules stipulate that if a player has 2 years of pro-level play, they are eligible for the expansion draft, which means they don't distinguish between the NHL-level and the AHL. I'm wondering what might be the reason for this? Is it primarily because the Knights are also drafting for their AHL team?

Would it have made any sense to distinguish between the leagues, like by stipulating a >2 years cutoff for the NHL and >3 years for any other pro league?

I'm going to attempt to answer your question, but before I do allow me to admit I don't know why they did it, but I will offer what I think (opinion only).

When Nashville, Atlanta, Minnesota and Columbus entered the league, each team paid $80 million. That meant that the owners got ($320 million / 26) each. For $12.3 million each, they each lost 4 players.

The Golden Knights knowing how it worked last time, and how long it took those teams to become competitive, negotiated a better deal. The asking price for a franchise was $500 million. They negotiated the entry draft rules with the NHL in exchange for their $500 entry fee. Now, in exchange for giving up one player, the owners get $16.7 million.

VGK were just unwilling to part with $500,000,000 plus all other startup costs unless they had a better shot of being competitive sooner.

As for stipulating between service times in certain leagues, that really wouldn't work as teams would be stuffing certain Josh Anderson types in the AHL to not expose him (or vice versa). That had to do it with an eye toward the Collective Bargaining Agreement. After all, the NHLPA is getting 23 (or more) new dues paying members next year. Forepar is correct, that's just the way it is. But hopefully it helps you understand the why.

 

[DarkandStormy]

I doubt Vegas would want to pay a 35-year old Hartnell for two more seasons. The thought could be, "Hey, waive your NMC so we can keep Anderson around. Don't worry, Vegas won't waste your time with you." Don't know if Hartnell would buy it, but I don't think he's a player Vegas would seriously consider if he's available.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

I doubt Vegas would want to pay a 35-year old Hartnell for two more seasons. The thought could be, "Hey, waive your NMC so we can keep Anderson around. Don't worry, Vegas won't waste your time with you." Don't know if Hartnell would buy it, but I don't think he's a player Vegas would seriously consider if he's available.

I don't think so either. But playing Devils advocate here...

If I am Scott Hartnell, do I want to have ANY CHANCE to play for an expansion franchise with probably 0 chance to win a cup during my time there? I wouldn't. I don't have any extra attachment to Columbus other than my contractual obligations, but I like it here and we have a chance to make many runs. Why risk that? Even if theres a .5% chance, its not a chance I would take unless the CBJ made a deal with Vegas with the promise they wouldn't pick me. In that case I would waive to keep Anderson around.

 

[Xoggz22]

I'm betting Hartnell waives

my top 3 LV targets

Wild Bill
Korpi
Nuti (longshot)

I could see Jarmo putting together a package that would include Milano, + to protect current roster

99% sure Nuti is exempt and there is a clause that might put Korpi into that group as well. Something about not offering his tender until after the expansion draft. I saw something in here about it - I'm not directly familiar with it.

 

[EspenK]

99% sure Nuti is exempt and there is a clause that might put Korpi into that group as well. Something about not offering his tender until after the expansion draft. I saw something in here about it - I'm not directly familiar with it.

I too thought that "loophole" could be used on Korpi but it can't. What the folks here educated us on is that if you only offer one G and that person is an RFA then they have to have received a qualifying offer. Since we will be leaving Korpi and Forsberg unprotected, I presume one will have to have received a qualifying offer. Not having a qualifying offer would theoretically make it a bit less desirable for LV but not unmanageable since I don't think either of our G's are arbitration eligible. But bottom line is that either could be picked.

 

[db2011]

I'm going to attempt to answer your question, but before I do allow me to admit I don't know why they did it, but I will offer what I think (opinion only).

When Nashville, Atlanta, Minnesota and Columbus entered the league, each team paid $80 million. That meant that the owners got ($320 million / 26) each. For $12.3 million each, they each lost 4 players.

The Golden Knights knowing how it worked last time, and how long it took those teams to become competitive, negotiated a better deal. The asking price for a franchise was $500 million. They negotiated the entry draft rules with the NHL in exchange for their $500 entry fee. Now, in exchange for giving up one player, the owners get $16.7 million.

VGK were just unwilling to part with $500,000,000 plus all other startup costs unless they had a better shot of being competitive sooner.

As for stipulating between service times in certain leagues, that really wouldn't work as teams would be stuffing certain Josh Anderson types in the AHL to not expose him (or vice versa). That had to do it with an eye toward the Collective Bargaining Agreement. After all, the NHLPA is getting 23 (or more) new dues paying members next year. Forepar is correct, that's just the way it is. But hopefully it helps you understand the why.

thanks old man. that clears it up a bit. it also muddies it because i wasn't thinking about it monetarily much at all.

as far as stipulating between leagues, I was thinking along the lines of a certain number of games played in the NHL disqualifies a player from the >3 status, like the 10-game sliding status rule.

 

[JacketsDavid]

I doubt Vegas would want to pay a 35-year old Hartnell for two more seasons. The thought could be, "Hey, waive your NMC so we can keep Anderson around. Don't worry, Vegas won't waste your time with you." Don't know if Hartnell would buy it, but I don't think he's a player Vegas would seriously consider if he's available.

We don't know if Vegas will be building for the future or if they will be looking for players they can flip for future assets.
I totally agree no reason for them to take Hartnell, but they could pick him play him for 55 games and trade him for a good draft pick (likely a 2nd, maybe even more).

Also Vegas will have to take a few guys with decent contracts to reach salary floor. So depending on talent available a guy like Hartnell could make sense to take and trade at a later date.

Now if I'm Vegas I would take JJ over Hartnell (IMO a better player now) if they want a vet they could potentially flip.

 

[DarkandStormy]

Also Vegas will have to take a few guys with decent contracts to reach salary floor.

Probably not. Run through a quick mock. They'll have no problem getting to the floor.