Dylan McIlrath Pt. II

[SnowblindNYR]

True but which asset would you trade?

I wouldn't mess with fate. Fate got this franchise to two CF, and a full 2013 season possibly a third.

There's no guarantee that drafting a Fowler or Tarasenko would have resulted in better results.

The pick sucked. The issue I have is not trading it sooner. He should have been moved after Boyle was signed.

Now, his value is plummeting. He sucks in the AHL, every GM saw the tarasenko goal (albeit not entirely his fault) and front offices saw guys like Kostka, Hunwick and Allen promoted ahead of a 10th overall pick from five years ago.

I'm patient enough to wait until the deadline. If he's not moved after that then I can only chalk his stability in this organization to Sather's hubris.

Except we didn't win the cup, so what fate? Maybe one of those two guys helps us win a cup.

 

[TheTakedown]

I think he needs NHL coaching in my opinion... He is just getting redundant on the pack, and his game is not growing any further...
I feel like he's reached a point similar to Miller where the pack is simply stagnating his game... We all know Kenny G isn't the greatest coach either

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Except we didn't win the cup, so what fate? Maybe one of those two guys helps us win a cup.

They didnt help their current teams get past the 2nd round.

Why should we assume a Rangers team with Fowler was good enough to beat the Kings?
Fowler on the Ducks couldnt beat the Kings.

Why should we assume a Rangers team with Tarasenko wins the SCF when his team lost to the Kings in 2013 and lost to the team who lost to the Kings a year alter?

Having Tarasenko means you remove a RW.

Who are you removing from a year ago? Nash? MSL? MZA?

People need to stop with the "what ifs" with Tarasenko. He's not some missing piece to a puzzle. The Rangers have clearly proved they dont need him.

 

[Riche16]

They didnt help their current teams get past the 2nd round.

Why should we assume a Rangers team with Fowler was good enough to beat the Kings?
Fowler on the Ducks couldnt beat the Kings.

Why should we assume a Rangers team with Tarasenko wins the SCF when his team lost to the Kings in 2013 and lost to the team who lost to the Kings a year alter?

Having Tarasenko means you remove a RW.

Who are you removing from a year ago? Nash? MSL? MZA?

People need to stop with the "what ifs" with Tarasenko. He's not some missing piece to a puzzle. The Rangers have clearly proved they dont need him.

Trying to rewrite history with all those hypotheticals is insane... but if Tara scored more than Nash did... there's a chance we could have. Right?

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Trying to rewrite history with all those hypotheticals is insane... but if Tara scored more than Nash did... there's a chance we could have. Right?

So now no Rick Nash?

Thats what I'm getting at. The cards have been dealt. Deal with them.

Goal scoring was not the problem against the Kings.

 

[LeetchisGod]

So now no Rick Nash?

Thats what I'm getting at. The cards have been dealt. Deal with them.

Goal scoring was not the problem against the Kings.

Clutch goal scoring was a big problem against the Kings.

 

[Riche16]

So now no Rick Nash?

Thats what I'm getting at. The cards have been dealt. Deal with them.

Goal scoring was not the problem against the Kings.

Well I was just playing devils advocate.

Partially agreeing with you, since if you draft Tara, do you trade for Nash still? Do you deal Cally and 2 1sts to Tampa? All ridiculous hypotheticals with a ton of variables that create more variables depending on the answer to each subsequent question(s)

 

[offdacrossbar]

Well I was just playing devils advocate.

Partially agreeing with you, since if you draft Tara, do you trade for Nash still? Do you deal Cally and 2 1sts to Tampa? All ridiculous hypotheticals with a ton of variables that create more variables depending on the answer to each subsequent question(s)

with a guy like vlad and his skills, you find room.

hes a bull with a lethal shot. very north american type player who happens to be russian.

wish we had him here.

 

[Mac n Gs]

I'm still under the impression he was drafted with the expectation of thriving in Torts' system. He'd be the perfect type of defenseman for it.

I was at the Pack game on Saturday. He's definitely not slow like some have claimed, but he still took a pretty bad penalty while on the PK and wasn't making good passes through the neutral zone, although he did have a nice assist on a 2-on-1. He really just needs to keep it simple instead of trying to do too much. We know he can flatten people at will, but he needs to pick his spots better. Having Ulf coach him would help a lot.

 

[NYRangerFan*]

I don't mean to keep harping on you but I don't understand what a PMD or the lack thereof has to do with McIlrath and Y we shouldn't have selected him. He's not a PMD. Never was supposed to be.

My point was we were set at D for the foreseeable future, especially stay at home types and DESPERATELY needed offense. We had a chance at #10 to go out and get something that would help the team. We didn't.

The fact that Del Z, Sangs and Sauer didn't turn out the way we wanted is irrelevant. Del Z turned into Klein... do you have any issue with that? I sure don't. Would it be better if Del Z realized his potential and was our PMD and PP QB? Of course. That would mean Boyle isn't here. Would it be better if Sauer hadn't sustained a career ending concussion? OF COURSE. Just as it would have been better if we selected Tarasenko instead of McIlrath.

All you keep saying is what every other NYR fan on this planet has been saying since that night and it's tiring. Management must have been extremely high on him if they picked him before those other names and they were dead wrong. I'm not sure what you are getting at here. All i said was that our defense wasn't set like we though it was. The 2010 draft is going on 5 years ago, we reached the ECF and the SCF without getting anything out of the 2010 1st round and we might go back so hopefully people let it go

 

[TheTakedown]

I think the idea is that if we draft Tarasenko, we don't trade for one of Nash or MSL... take your pick...

I would absolutely take Tarasenko over MSL... and quite frankly I think that would have done us the same last year... Tarasenko is a beast...

but again, we don't get Brassard if we don't trade for Nash... so tell me what you'd rather have... because there's a good chance Anisimov and Dubinsky are our #2 and #3 Centermen

 

[BleedBlue32]

bust. can't skate and acts like a meathead. I really wanted him to do well.

 

[NYRangerFan*]

Way too many what if's there. We can go back and say what if we picked Jure Penko instead of Hank, no point in going back and saying what if we did this or what if we did that because we will go all the way back to the very first season of NYR hockey

 

[TheTakedown]

Way too many what if's there. We can go back and say what if we picked Jure Penko instead of Hank, no point in going back and saying what if we did this or what if we did that because we will go all the way back to the very first season of NYR hockey

obviously you want to be realistic...

Back on topic, trading McIlrath would not be equivalent to trading MDZ or Moore only because he has like 3 games of NHL experience.

Like I said above, I think he needs NHL coaching

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Trade a struggling McIlrath for a 3rd or 4th round pick, use the pick the draft the best remaining Russian scoring winger regardless, or draft the best available American offensive defenseman.

 

[TheTakedown]

Trade a struggling McIlrath for a 3rd or 4th round pick, use the pick the draft the best remaining Russian scoring winger regardless, or draft the best available American offensive defenseman.

I'd be OK with that...

 

[haveandare]

I'd be OK with that...

That is terrible asset management. Trade a guy who you took at 10 at his absolute lowest value for a bad pick that you'd use based solely on nationality.

 

[NYRangerFan*]

obviously you want to be realistic...

Back on topic, trading McIlrath would not be equivalent to trading MDZ or Moore only because he has like 3 games of NHL experience.

Like I said above, I think he needs NHL coaching

Well, why not be realistic? How can you use what ifs to make a point? What ifs never happened so how do you do it? I can easily say what if we drafted Tarasenko and Matt Cooke was in a bad mood one night and gave him a career ending concussion in his first game?

I agree. I would hold onto Mcilrath an really try to get through to him somehow.

 

[Raspewtin]

That is terrible asset management. Trade a guy who you took at 10 at his absolute lowest value for a bad pick that you'd use based solely on nationality.

It's not like his value is going up.

 

[haveandare]

It's not like his value is going up.

It's more likely going up than down in the immediate future. It's very low now.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

That is terrible asset management. Trade a guy who you took at 10 at his absolute lowest value for a bad pick that you'd use based solely on nationality.

It was a joke about getting another chance to draft a Tarasenko or Fowler type.

And the "asset management" ship as sailed. He's done. Only thing worse is losing him to waivers. The best thing is to get any asset in return. Anything.

And "terrible asset management" is overrated. The Kings won two Cups despite getting no contributions from the return of the 4th overall, 11th overall and 12th overall.

 

[haveandare]

It was a joke about getting another chance to draft a Tarasenko or Fowler type.

And the "asset management" ship as sailed. He's done. Only thing worse is losing him to waivers. The best thing is to get any asset in return. Anything.

And "terrible asset management" is overrated. The Kings won two Cups despite getting no contributions from the return of the 4th overall, 11th overall and 12th overall.

A good team managing assets poorly doesn't mean that nobody has to care about losing value needlessly. Plenty of bad teams manage assets poorly too, and they end up sucking. LA won twice despite some high picks not panning out. Good for them. Someone probably won the lottery today despite the odds being terrible - doesn't mean I'm buying a ticket.

Say value is on a 0 to 100 scale just to make it easy. After the draft, let's say McI was a 30. Last year, a 20. Now, a 10. I'd rather take the risk of losing a 10 player for nothing later if it means holding on to the idea that he might be able to get higher before a potential trade. The potential loss if he turns to nothing is smaller than the potential gain if he improves.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

A good team managing assets poorly doesn't mean that nobody has to care about losing value needlessly. Plenty of bad teams manage assets poorly too, and they end up sucking. LA won twice despite some high picks not panning out. Good for them. Someone probably won the lottery today despite the odds being terrible - doesn't mean I'm buying a ticket.

Say value is on a 0 to 100 scale just to make it easy. After the draft, let's say McI was a 30. Last year, a 20. Now, a 10. I'd rather take the risk of losing a 10 player for nothing later if it means holding on to the idea that he might be able to get higher before a potential trade. The potential loss if he turns to nothing is smaller than the potential gain if he improves.

What are you basing your hope on? His draft position or the way he's played this season? Or something else. Girardi getting hit by a car? Klein pulling a Ricky Williams?

The kid will not get a chance to prove his worth. Barring a mumps run over the defense, he's going to stay in Hartford and continue to struggle.

 

[haveandare]

What are you basing your hope on? His draft position or the way he's played this season? Or something else. Girardi getting hit by a car? Klein pulling a Ricky Williams?

The kid will not get a chance to prove his worth. Barring a mumps run over the defense, he's going to stay in Hartford and continue to struggle.

On the fact that he's 22 and lost a year to injury. Do players in their young 20s never get better with time, especially big defenders?

He can also stay in Hartford, improve, and be worth more than he is now down there struggling. It's not like NHL pro scouts don't pay any attention to the development league that is run in their backyard.

 

[NYRangerFan*]

Clutch goal scoring was a big problem against the Kings.

Actually, scoring a PP goal was a problem. We had numerous powerplays in OT and couldn't score. I guess you can call that clutch scoring but if we had a shooter on D, it might have been different.