Dylan Larkin looks good so far

[Ezekial]

Is it out of line to suggest that Larkin deserves some Selke consideration? I know his +/- sits at -1 but damn...top 5 in takeaways, best D zone faceoff %....best SH faceoff %...20:00 min/ game against top players

Nope, with Bergeron out, Kopitar and the Kings under performing, and his consistent play it's looking like he's going to get some votes this season.

 

[Heaton]

Nope, with Bergeron out, Kopitar and the Kings under performing, and his consistent play it's looking like he's going to get some votes this season.

He definitely should, but I feel it's Point's to lose.

 

[Pavels Dog]

He definitely should, but I feel it's Point's to lose.

It really shouldn't be. Point doesn't take nearly as many faceoffs, and doesn't win nearly as many. He also doesn't PK.
Selke really shouldn't be about who scores the most points while being good defensively. A player who isn't used in a defensive capacity shouldn't win the award.

 

[Henkka]

Is it out of line to suggest that Larkin deserves some Selke consideration? I know his +/- sits at -1 but damn...top 5 in takeaways, best D zone faceoff %....best SH faceoff %...20:00 min/ game against top players

That's interesting when looking deeper on his faceoffs stats.

Superb percentages on PP (62%), PK (71%) and Def.Zone (66%).

Critical areas on winning hockey. Weak percentages (53%, not bad either) on more meaningless faceoff areas.

Guy is becoming a winner.

 

[Inspiration]

Last year Larkin had 14 secondary assists at 5v5; this year he has 1. Detroit is only shooting 5.77% when Larkin is on the ice this year, compared to 7.92% in the first three years of his career. You could make a very good case that Larkin's point totals understate just how good he has been. Superb season so far.

 

[Flowah]

Take whatever group of players you think are the top, elite centers in the game. Larkin is, even now, just a step below. I don't expect him to take the next step but I won't be surprised if he does. He's a serious kid, works his ass off, and has the right attitude to keep learning and improving. I always thought he'd be a lesser version of Toews, with a simple, responsible game and only decently productive. He's proving me wrong for sure. Way to go, kid.

 

[newfy]

It really shouldn't be. Point doesn't take nearly as many faceoffs, and doesn't win nearly as many. He also doesn't PK.
Selke really shouldn't be about who scores the most points while being good defensively. A player who isn't used in a defensive capacity shouldn't win the award.

Yeah penalty kill should be a big factor in the selke. You dont PK you dont deserve it. Forget where I saw them but Larkins PK goals against is at an elite level as well. Point on the other hand is below league average on faceoffs in every situation and doesnt penalty kill. Point is really good defensively but its those little things that should put it in Larkins favour

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Yeah penalty kill should be a big factor in the selke. You dont PK you dont deserve it. Forget where I saw them but Larkins PK goals against is at an elite level as well. Point on the other hand is below league average on faceoffs in every situation and doesnt penalty kill. Point is really good defensively but its those little things that should put it in Larkins favour

I like Point a lot. But he is a guy that went from underrated to overrated without hitting the right ground for even a moment in my opinion.

Give Larkin his teammates and watch the numbers he would pile up. Though I have brought this up with Larkin before and something Point has done to increase his numbers is excel in the bumper role on the PP in Tampa. Hopefully Larkin can do that. I think that is the best spot for him. We just need more talent on the team so we can have a better looking unit. You figure Zadina should have one of the half walls. I am not sure if Mantha will hold off this years draft pick but if you got a Dach man would that be an insane unit.

Ras​

Dach - Larkin - Zadina

Cholo​

Then you still have

Hronek, Mantha, AA and remains to be seen running your second unit.

But what makes Tampa's and Washington's PP so lethal are Oshie and Point in the middle, we need to figure that guy out. Yes Stammer and Ovie hammer the puck but you see a dip in the unit for instance when Oshie is out. It is a huge weakness on our PP, Nyquist excelled in it for a minute when both Zetterberg and Datsyuk held the box apart a little better but it is a huge weakness on this team and has been for a few years. I would love to see Larkin take ownership of it. The way he competes and works I think it is the ideal spot to turn him into a impact PP player.

 

[TheMule93]

Larkin is already two goals shy of his goal total from last season....

 

[raymond23]

I like Point a lot. But he is a guy that went from underrated to overrated without hitting the right ground for even a moment in my opinion.

Give Larkin his teammates and watch the numbers he would pile up. Though I have brought this up with Larkin before and something Point has done to increase his numbers is excel in the bumper role on the PP in Tampa. Hopefully Larkin can do that. I think that is the best spot for him. We just need more talent on the team so we can have a better looking unit. You figure Zadina should have one of the half walls. I am not sure if Mantha will hold off this years draft pick but if you got a Dach man would that be an insane unit.

Ras​

Dach - Larkin - Zadina

Cholo​

Then you still have

Hronek, Mantha, AA and remains to be seen running your second unit.

But what makes Tampa's and Washington's PP so lethal are Oshie and Point in the middle, we need to figure that guy out. Yes Stammer and Ovie hammer the puck but you see a dip in the unit for instance when Oshie is out. It is a huge weakness on our PP, Nyquist excelled in it for a minute when both Zetterberg and Datsyuk held the box apart a little better but it is a huge weakness on this team and has been for a few years. I would love to see Larkin take ownership of it. The way he competes and works I think it is the ideal spot to turn him into a impact PP player.

Imagine being a bumper with Kucherov and Stamkos on your wings. Or Ovechkin and Backstrom. That shit is just unfair.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Imagine being a bumper with Kucherov and Stamkos on your wings. Or Ovechkin and Backstrom. That **** is just unfair.

Marchand - Pasta (Bergeron's the bumper)

I can't remember I think it is Kadri in Toronto with Matthews and Marner flanking him.

Scheifiele in Winnipeg with Laine and Wheeler

Pavalski has been in that role for years in San Jose. He fits the mold of the guys that lineup in that role is a part of the intrigue with Larkin for me.

But you can get a lot done. That is how you build a great unit. But Oshie, Bergeron, Point, Scheifiele and Kadri keep the puck alive a lot and they disrupt the box. They are important, yes I know there is great talent on the perimeter but I just don't see Larkin as one of those exterior pieces, I think his future needs to lie in the middle. He needs to work on a quick one-timer in that role, but I like his ability to support both sides of the ice from that role, I think that is something we are overlooking, that player needs to be good at those puck battles (Nyquist's flaw) but ideally needs more speed (Bertuzzis' flaw) to cover the appropriate real estate ice wise in my opinion.

Zadina should be an offensive machine on the PP once he settles in. We have one of those in our system. I really do believe that. Do we get the other flank covered in the draft, I hope so.

 

[Inspiration]

Larkin is already two goals shy of his goal total from last season....

It looks fairly sustainable too, given that he is only shooting 11.6% which isn't too far off from his career average. He is in the top-10 in the league in shots and on pace for 301 shots total, which would be the most by a Red Wing since Zetterberg's 306 in 2010-2011.

 

[TheMule93]

Marchand - Pasta (Bergeron's the bumper)

I can't remember I think it is Kadri in Toronto with Matthews and Marner flanking him.

Scheifiele in Winnipeg with Laine and Wheeler

Pavalski has been in that role for years in San Jose. He fits the mold of the guys that lineup in that role is a part of the intrigue with Larkin for me.

But you can get a lot done. That is how you build a great unit. But Oshie, Bergeron, Point, Scheifiele and Kadri keep the puck alive a lot and they disrupt the box. They are important, yes I know there is great talent on the perimeter but I just don't see Larkin as one of those exterior pieces, I think his future needs to lie in the middle. He needs to work on a quick one-timer in that role, but I like his ability to support both sides of the ice from that role, I think that is something we are overlooking, that player needs to be good at those puck battles (Nyquist's flaw) but ideally needs more speed (Bertuzzis' flaw) to cover the appropriate real estate ice wise in my opinion.

Zadina should be an offensive machine on the PP once he settles in. We have one of those in our system. I really do believe that. Do we get the other flank covered in the draft, I hope so.

U should email this to Blashill or Bylsma

 

[Ghost of Ethan Hunt]

I like Point a lot. But he is a guy that went from underrated to overrated without hitting the right ground for even a moment in my opinion.

Give Larkin his teammates and watch the numbers he would pile up.....

Ras​

Dach - Larkin - Zadina

Cholo​

Then you still have

Hronek, Mantha, AA and remains to be seen running your second unit....

Bert
Mantha - Nielsen/Veleno - AA
Hronek

Nielsen is bumper til Veleno is ready for the role, so ~ 1.5 seasons from today. I think Joe V makes the team next year, along with Zadina. Hronek may be here to stay with our D injuries.

 

[Frk It]

I like Point a lot. But he is a guy that went from underrated to overrated without hitting the right ground for even a moment in my opinion.

Give Larkin his teammates and watch the numbers he would pile up. Though I have brought this up with Larkin before and something Point has done to increase his numbers is excel in the bumper role on the PP in Tampa. Hopefully Larkin can do that. I think that is the best spot for him. We just need more talent on the team so we can have a better looking unit. You figure Zadina should have one of the half walls. I am not sure if Mantha will hold off this years draft pick but if you got a Dach man would that be an insane unit.

Ras​

Dach - Larkin - Zadina

Cholo​

Then you still have

Hronek, Mantha, AA and remains to be seen running your second unit.

But what makes Tampa's and Washington's PP so lethal are Oshie and Point in the middle, we need to figure that guy out. Yes Stammer and Ovie hammer the puck but you see a dip in the unit for instance when Oshie is out. It is a huge weakness on our PP, Nyquist excelled in it for a minute when both Zetterberg and Datsyuk held the box apart a little better but it is a huge weakness on this team and has been for a few years. I would love to see Larkin take ownership of it. The way he competes and works I think it is the ideal spot to turn him into a impact PP player.

In that particular setup I actually think Cozens would be a better option for Larkin, but I get what you are going for there.

It sucks all the USNTP forwards are LH, I like those guys a lot.

 

[Ezekial]

He definitely should, but I feel it's Point's to lose.

I don't think he's the Selke winner, but finalist or top 5 finisher - for sure,

I do like TZE's response, though. If Point were to win the Selke I would be kinda disappointed in their definition of the award. It's like only awarding the Norris to the D with the most points at that point.

E: Also 14 of his 41 points are on the PP, what's Selke about that? Larkin has 26 ES pionts, Point has 27

 

[cjm502]

Watching Larkin become a true leader this season has been one of the coolest things Wings fans have got to enjoy in a while imo

 

[Steve Yzerlland]

Watching Larkin become a true leader this season has been one of the coolest things Wings fans have got to enjoy in a while imo

One of the very few bright spots this year

 

[HIFE]

Watching Larkin become a true leader this season has been one of the coolest things Wings fans have got to enjoy in a while imo

I can't imagine how terrible the Wings would be without Larkin. That pick makes Holland/Wright look like geniuses. There aren't many players in the league I would trade for Dylan right now.

Does anyone else think in a future re-draft Larkin takes the #1 spot above Draisaitl and Ekblad?

 

[Pavels Dog]

Last year Larkin had 14 secondary assists at 5v5; this year he has 1. Detroit is only shooting 5.77% when Larkin is on the ice this year, compared to 7.92% in the first three years of his career. You could make a very good case that Larkin's point totals understate just how good he has been. Superb season so far.

To continue the comparison with Brayden Point, his on-ice sh% is 12.2. Highest among Tampa forwards and 10th highest in the league for players with 30+ games. And of course Point's own sh% is unsustainable at 24%.
Long term you would expect Point's numbers to drop off considerably while Larkin's numbers might even improve he continues to play this way while he gets more scoring support around him.

I can't imagine how terrible the Wings would be without Larkin. That pick makes Holland/Wright look like geniuses. There aren't many players in the league I would trade for Dylan right now.

Does anyone else think in a future re-draft Larkin takes the #1 spot above Draisaitl and Ekblad?

Pasta is #1 in a re-draft. Behind him though, I'm not sure I take anyone else over Larkin currently.

 

[Heaton]

Some players just have a really high S%, they don't always drop. See: Mark Scheifele.

I don't think we need to denigrate Point to prop up Larkin, makes us look petty. They're both great players. Point will probably finish with ~40 goals and ~85 points this year. Larkin might hit 70.

I still probably wouldn't trade Larkin for Point, even if Point is better offensively by a bit.

 

[Heaton]

I don't think he's the Selke winner, but finalist or top 5 finisher - for sure,

I do like TZE's response, though. If Point were to win the Selke I would be kinda disappointed in their definition of the award. It's like only awarding the Norris to the D with the most points at that point.

E: Also 14 of his 41 points are on the PP, what's Selke about that? Larkin has 26 ES pionts, Point has 27

I didn't realize Point rarely plays on the PK. I still think he's very good defensively. I also didn't realize scoring on the PP means you're bad defensively.

 

[Ezekial]

I didn't realize Point rarely plays on the PK. I still think he's very good defensively. I also didn't realize scoring on the PP means you're bad defensively.

That's not what I was implying at all.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Some players just have a really high S%, they don't always drop. See: Mark Scheifele.

I don't think we need to denigrate Point to prop up Larkin, makes us look petty. They're both great players. Point will probably finish with ~40 goals and ~85 points this year. Larkin might hit 70.

I still probably wouldn't trade Larkin for Point, even if Point is better offensively by a bit.

He probably has a bit more raw offensive talent than Larkin but it's still worth taking into account that the underlying numbers indicate Point is one of the luckiest players in the league so far this season. And in defensive statistics, Point is not even comparable to Larkin this season.

Takeaways:
Point - 13
Larkin - 41

Blocks:
Point - 13
Larkin - 22

Faceoffs:
Points - 321
Larkin - 662

Faceoff%:
Point - 48.6%
Larkin - 55.4%

On top of that Point doesn't PK while Larkin not only PKs, but is near the top of the league in many statistics in that area. Such as shorthanded points, shorthanded shots, shorthanded FOW% etc. It would be really disappointing if voters gave the nod to Point instead of Larkin for an award like the Selke.

 

[Heaton]

That's not what I was implying at all.

Then I don't understand the statement 'what's Selke about that?'.