Confirmed with Link: Ducks extend Adam Henrique

[Vipers31]

I don't get it. Our window is closed these are the kinds of contracts we should avoid

Why? I get that kind of thinking for a tanking team handing out retirement contracts that include NMCs, but we're not tanking and signed a guy through his solid UFA years for little above market value (IMO) without any trade restrictions. Losing him for nothing would have been much worse asset management, regardless of the team's ambitions.

 

[Lyons71]

This contract is “we are paying you for the role you will be filling.” With kesler gone (and possibly never to return to form), Adam now is one of our top pk guys and the only lefty that shoots on the pp.

 

[KaseMeOutside]

Why? I get that kind of thinking for a tanking team handing out retirement contracts that include NMCs, but we're not tanking and signed a guy through his solid UFA years for little above market value (IMO) without any trade restrictions. Losing him for nothing would have been much worse asset management, regardless of the team's ambitions.

I get we're not tanking my POV is more about what we should do. When your window is closed and you keep making win now moves you tend to just set your franchise back more, by not being honest with yourself about your team

 

[Vipers31]

I get we're not tanking my POV is more about what we should do. When your window is closed and you keep making win now moves you tend to just set your franchise back more, by not being honest with yourself about your team

I think these windows are pretty exaggerated. Nobody even thought Vegas' window would open for 5+ years. I hate some things about what direction we've taken, but realistically, we're much closer to contending than to tanking, and even in between, we've got to be equally honest about the Anaheim market, in that we can't afford to be apathetic enough about winning a few more games and making the playoffs, and maybe win a round, through moves like this to not make them.

 

[Kalv]

I think these windows are pretty exaggerated. Nobody even thought Vegas' window would open for 5+ years. I hate some things about what direction we've taken, but realistically, we're much closer to contending than to tanking, and even in between, we've got to be equally honest about the Anaheim market, in that we can't afford to be apathetic enough about winning a few more games and making the playoffs, and maybe win a round, through moves like this to not make them.

Another example is Washington whom everyone (me included) thought will enter the downfall period. Well yeah they had a worse regular season, that`s true. Playoffs were ok for them
That`s why experienced players say - everything can happen in the playoffs. And I also think we are gonna be a playoff team for a while and we have many good pieces.
I was more optimistic a couple of years ago though

 

[duckpuck]

Henrique's contract strikes me as a pretty reasonable deal. Not worried about the long term aspects (like i was the minute Kesler's contract was announced). If Henrique is on the bottom line during the final 2 years of the contract, that won't be a killer and he'll almost certainly be much better than that. He also offers a lot of flexibility - i.e., can be moved to the wing and plays special teams.

If the ducks eventually go into full tank/rebuild mode, Henrique can be traded. No doubt a playoff team will be looking to pick up a 32-34 year old center at that salary.

The contract I still don't understand is/was Cogliano's extension with the no-trade protections. Great glue type of player, but that signing basically guarantees that Silfverberg will be let go (most likely traded). I would have preferred to keep Silf.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

The thing is, there was no way Henrique would get the A immediately after the trade. There was no debate to be made then that Henrique should get it over Fowler.. But now that he’s been on the team for almost a full season, do you put him above Fowler?

So much has been said about Henrique’s character and he already has 3(?) years experience wearing the A in NJ.. To me, that’s what puts him above Fowler. On the other hand, I do see the benefit of having a defenseman with one of the letters, but is that enough to put Fowler over Henrique? Fowler over Perry? Easily, but Henrique just seems like the perfect candidate for an A.

As Paul said above, if Manson keeps going as he’s going, I could see him with an A some day too. It would probably take a lot to put him in front of Fowler though.. (In the organizations eyes.)

You never know, Carlyle especially has never been afraid to give a brand new player a letter(even once taking one away from a player of prominent stature), but yeah, you're probably right about that. I guess I was just more saying that no matter what, the team seems to believe in Cam the most and he'll be next in line. And honestly, while it's fun to speculate, none of us are there and don't really know a whole lot about what goes on in the room, it's probably not fair for any of us to have hard opinions on who should wear letters(and IMO they really don't matter a whole lot, especially the As).

 

[Paul4587]

Another example is Washington whom everyone (me included) thought will enter the downfall period. Well yeah they had a worse regular season, that`s true. Playoffs were ok for them
That`s why experienced players say - everything can happen in the playoffs. And I also think we are gonna be a playoff team for a while and we have many good pieces.
I was more optimistic a couple of years ago though

Difference between us and Washington is that their superstars are still producing at a rate that justifies their contracts (and in Backstroms case his contract is a flat out steal). Two out of three of our big contracts up front are absolute anchors.

That said I do believe so long as Getzlaf is elite we are closer to contender than pretender. But I also believe the window has shut and that it shut the day Carlyle was rehired.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

Another example is Washington whom everyone (me included) thought will enter the downfall period. Well yeah they had a worse regular season, that`s true. Playoffs were ok for them
That`s why experienced players say - everything can happen in the playoffs. And I also think we are gonna be a playoff team for a while and we have many good pieces.
I was more optimistic a couple of years ago though

People also forget that both finalists in 2016 were teams that a lot of people gave up on, especially San Jose. The last three years every finalist has been one of these teams, the defending champs or a Cinderella story(I dont know if Nashville should qualify, but they were the second wild card and barely made the playoffs).

This league is so wide open that it really doesn't take much to have a good shot at it. Just have a couple strong features and get hot, that's really about it.

 

[Elvs]

I don't get it. Our window is closed these are the kinds of contracts we should avoid

Even in a rebuild you need to hit the cap floor. The Devils were rolling with Henrique and Zajac as their top two centers for a few years. Arizona did it with Hanzal and Vermette. Soon enough Henrique might be our top line center.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Henrique got a modified NTC which allows him to submit a 10 team no trade list. It appears that his salary stays consistent throughout the five year term based on what capfriendly is showing at the moment.

 

[TesseracT]

Henrique posted this a little while ago. Thought it was pretty funny seeing him as a little kid sporting some Mighty Ducks gear.

 

[Duck Off]

Too high for my liking. Similar overpayment as Kes and Cam got. With our current center situation though, he sort of had Murray by the balls. Hard not to like Rico, glad he's sticking around, but that probably means Silf is gone.

It's higher than I would have liked as well, but I don't think it's comparable to the Kesler deal at all. The Kesler signing was Murray being Murray and rushing something because he doesn't like potential UFA's "hanging over his head". He rushed that one, and it cost him. I don't think there was much risk at all of Kesler playing more that following year and increasing his value (whereas Henrique, I do see that potential). Kesler's deal also didn't start until he was 32 (Rico's starts when he's 29), and Kesler had a lot more "mileage" on him than Rico because of the way Kesler plays. Hindsight is 20/20 but thinking back about it, the Kesler signing was much worse than most realized when it happened. At the time, I didn't hate it, but I did mention I thought Murray rushed it, and it definitely hurt him/us.

Fowler's deal is a little more similar, but I understand Murray's logic on that one. Cam had taken a step that year and I think Murray expected he'd at least perform at that level again. Instead he regressed last year, which is obviously unfortunate for us all. I don't think Cam's deal is bad though. I think he's still a #2 and 6.5 for those isn't bad at all IMO.

As for my thoughts on the Rico signing: I was expecting 5.5 for 6 years because quite simply, centers get paid. Ideally this would have been lower, but this is pretty much spot on with Murray and UFAs though. Most of the time they're thought of as "high, but not awful". Exactly where I'd label this one.

 

[Duck Off]

Henrique got a modified NTC which allows him to submit a 10 team no trade list. It appears that his salary stays consistent throughout the five year term based on what capfriendly is showing at the moment.

I'm a little worried about this. CapFriendly has it as a modified NTC, but whoever mentioned it originally said it was a modified NMC which, I believe, would make him a must be protected for any ED. Hopefully that's not the case. I imagine we'd protect him anyway, but if gets hurt or something and isn't same player, ideally we're not in a Perry like scenario where we're using a slot on a player we dang sure wouldn't mind losing for nothing.

 

[duxfan1101]

I'm a little worried about this. CapFriendly has it as a modified NTC, but whoever mentioned it originally said it was a modified NMC which, I believe, would make him a must be protected for any ED. Hopefully that's not the case. I imagine we'd protect him anyway, but if gets hurt or something and isn't same player, ideally we're not in a Perry like scenario where we're using a slot on a player we dang sure wouldn't mind losing for nothing.

There is no such thing as a Modified NMC. Henrique has a 10 team no trade list, he doesn't have to be protected.

 

[paine]

I get we're not tanking my POV is more about what we should do. When your window is closed and you keep making win now moves you tend to just set your franchise back more, by not being honest with yourself about your team

Not in a market that can support a rebuild. The owners want to compete every year.

 

[Getzmonster]

It's higher than I would have liked as well, but I don't think it's comparable to the Kesler deal at all. The Kesler signing was Murray being Murray and rushing something because he doesn't like potential UFA's "hanging over his head". He rushed that one, and it cost him. I don't think there was much risk at all of Kesler playing more that following year and increasing his value (whereas Henrique, I do see that potential). Kesler's deal also didn't start until he was 32 (Rico's starts when he's 29), and Kesler had a lot more "mileage" on him than Rico because of the way Kesler plays. Hindsight is 20/20 but thinking back about it, the Kesler signing was much worse than most realized when it happened. At the time, I didn't hate it, but I did mention I thought Murray rushed it, and it definitely hurt him/us.

Fowler's deal is a little more similar, but I understand Murray's logic on that one. Cam had taken a step that year and I think Murray expected he'd at least perform at that level again. Instead he regressed last year, which is obviously unfortunate for us all. I don't think Cam's deal is bad though. I think he's still a #2 and 6.5 for those isn't bad at all IMO.

As for my thoughts on the Rico signing: I was expecting 5.5 for 6 years because quite simply, centers get paid. Ideally this would have been lower, but this is pretty much spot on with Murray and UFAs though. Most of the time they're thought of as "high, but not awful". Exactly where I'd label this one.

I disagree on a few points, but it doesn't matter, the only comparison I was drawing was that they all were guys I was expecting/hoping for some sort of discount, but got what I felt was full market value.

I agree about signing Kes too early, but otherwise I was okay with it because there was no doubt he would be a high end number two for us with intangibles galore. He was the perfect 1-2 punch with Getz.

Henrique on the other hand, is a pretty vanilla number two guy, streaky at that, and even if he plays the role of clear number two I don't see it as enough punch to get us anywhere. He's expensive now if he ends up as the #3 or 2B, which also doesn't thrill me.

I don't mean to sound so negative, I love me some Rico and there was no way Murray could risk losing him given our situation. Also, I know it would have cost us more to replace him.

tldr; The signing is fine, I like whining.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

It's higher than I would have liked as well, but I don't think it's comparable to the Kesler deal at all. The Kesler signing was Murray being Murray and rushing something because he doesn't like potential UFA's "hanging over his head". He rushed that one, and it cost him. I don't think there was much risk at all of Kesler playing more that following year and increasing his value (whereas Henrique, I do see that potential). Kesler's deal also didn't start until he was 32 (Rico's starts when he's 29), and Kesler had a lot more "mileage" on him than Rico because of the way Kesler plays. Hindsight is 20/20 but thinking back about it, the Kesler signing was much worse than most realized when it happened. At the time, I didn't hate it, but I did mention I thought Murray rushed it, and it definitely hurt him/us.

Fowler's deal is a little more similar, but I understand Murray's logic on that one. Cam had taken a step that year and I think Murray expected he'd at least perform at that level again. Instead he regressed last year, which is obviously unfortunate for us all. I don't think Cam's deal is bad though. I think he's still a #2 and 6.5 for those isn't bad at all IMO.

As for my thoughts on the Rico signing: I was expecting 5.5 for 6 years because quite simply, centers get paid. Ideally this would have been lower, but this is pretty much spot on with Murray and UFAs though. Most of the time they're thought of as "high, but not awful". Exactly where I'd label this one.

Um, that did happen, though. He signed it coming off that playoff run, but he was better in the 2016 season and had a Selke nomination, that probably would've meant an increase. I get what you're saying but dont think this is a great example of that in any way.

 

[QuackinQuaker]

You never know, Carlyle especially has never been afraid to give a brand new player a letter(even once taking one away from a player of prominent stature), but yeah, you're probably right about that. I guess I was just more saying that no matter what, the team seems to believe in Cam the most and he'll be next in line. And honestly, while it's fun to speculate, none of us are there and don't really know a whole lot about what goes on in the room, it's probably not fair for any of us to have hard opinions on who should wear letters(and IMO they really don't matter a whole lot, especially the As).

Yeah, this is just fun off-season speculation. I do think it's a storyline to watch. Probably has something to do with me never really respecting Perry as an A. He's always been a great player, but he has a "this is easy for me" kind of vibe as opposed to a "blue collar/put in the work" type of vibe that I think is important in leaders.

I've always been curious as to how much the A's do behind the scenes. I'm sure it's mostly a "follow my example" kind of thing and it probably only makes a subtle difference. On the other hand, I like to imagine that the right leadership core can take the team to the next level. Generally speaking.. I'm sure some players wear the A with more of a sense of duty towards the team than others. If you catch my drift..

 

[Duck Off]

Um, that did happen, though. He signed it coming off that playoff run, but he was better in the 2016 season and had a Selke nomination, that probably would've meant an increase. I get what you're saying but dont think this is a great example of that in any way.

you're right, my bad. I forgot about that. There's definitely a strong argument that it could have raised his price tag.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

Yeah, this is just fun off-season speculation. I do think it's a storyline to watch. Probably has something to do with me never really respecting Perry as an A. He's always been a great player, but he has a "this is easy for me" kind of vibe as opposed to a "blue collar/put in the work" type of vibe that I think is important in leaders.

I've always been curious as to how much the A's do behind the scenes. I'm sure it's mostly a "follow my example" kind of thing and it probably only makes a subtle difference. On the other hand, I like to imagine that the right leadership core can take the team to the next level. Generally speaking.. I'm sure some players wear the A with more of a sense of duty towards the team than others. If you catch my drift..

Yeah I always got the same vibes from Perry. You never know and he did captain Canada to a WHC, but he didn't even wear a letter in London when they won the Mem Cup. That's kind of wild, but you're probably right about only some guys actually leading with them and some guys getting them because they're one of the teams top players, which is probably Perry to a T.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

you're right, my bad. I forgot about that. There's definitely a strong argument that it could have raised his price tag.

A good example for you is probably Despres. Sure there was a ton of bad luck involved and if he would've continued to play like he did it would've been well worth it and maybe even a pretty nice contract, but did they really need to lock him up that quickly? Seems like they could've waited a bit.

 

[cheesymc]

I don’t like this deal... I like Rico and his intangibles but he didn’t offer a discount for the term and his offensive upside is low, likely a 20g 30a guy that might have one more high 20 goal season. He is really a 4.75-5M guy at best on a contending team. I would have preferred them tradeding for prospects and going with a minor rebuild, or pay a bit more to offer sheet a player like Wild Bill who is 4 years younger and has more speed.

This signing makes it likely someone like Silver is traded before year end.

 

[Masch78]

I don’t like this deal... I like Rico and his intangibles but he didn’t offer a discount for the term and his offensive upside is low, likely a 20g 30a guy that might have one more high 20 goal season. He is really a 4.75-5M guy at best on a contending team. I would have preferred them tradeding for prospects and going with a minor rebuild, or pay a bit more to offer sheet a player like Wild Bill who is 4 years younger and has more speed.

This signing makes it likely someone like Silver is traded before year end.

Offersheet a player like Wild Bill. Why would he sign? He fits so well in LV and will get paid there. But lets assume he would. It means losing 4 1st round picks likely at a 7y deal on what 8m? And you prefer that over Henrique at that contract? Wild Bill had one great year on a team that overachieved. There is no evidence he is more than Henrique.

I also don't understand why players have to give discounts. It is a market value contract and that's fine.

 

[mightyquack]

Offer sheet Karlsson? The contract that would be required would especially sting when his shooting percentage drops by 10% next season.