News Article: Don Cherry Fired

[coladin]

Two things

1. We're in a different (I'd say better) place than we were in 20 or even 10 years ago. Back then he was treated as your racist uncle at Thanksgiving that everyone tries their best to ignore. That's not going to fly anymore.

2. Sportsnet just saved themselves a ton of money by dumping their highest salary on HNIC. This might have just been the excuse they needed.

1. I will agree that we are in a “different” place. Better? Not so sure about that. The rest I disagree with completely. Discrimination/racism has always been unacceptable. The racist uncle analogy is terrible.

2. Yes, but on top of the fact that Budweiser most likely gave Sportsnet an ultimatum is most likely. It’s all about the money.

But Twitter is making this moment into some sort of nation-building watershed moment. CTV News started those f***ing broadcast with this story as they stepped on dead veterans graves to push out a sensationalistic story. That is reprehensible in my view , which brings me back to your point 1. Better times?

 

[jbeck5]

Go out to the grocery store or mall or downtown of a city or whatever public place with many people today...and start picking out the immigrants. Just do it internally, no need to point at them and yell "immigrant!", jusy try to identify who is an "immigrant" and who is not, and then come back to me and tell me how many you find.

I understand on the surface it seems like a "but everyone can be an immigrant, how is he racist" and then put yourself in Don's mind and ask yourself how he came to the conclusion that those who he saw the past few days not wearing a poppy are also people who "come here to enjoy our milk and honey"? You really think he noticed that white guy from Denmark who just immigrated here filling up gas and thought "put on a poppy immigrant!".

Well I work in the public and see more white immigrants than dark skinned immigrants. What I look for, is usually a heavy accent. You can't tell what an immigrant looks like alone. You can have a white person who moved here last month from Poland, and you can have someone who is very black, and has been here for 6 generations...

My point is immigrant doesn't carry any weight with it. Maybe I'm looking at the geography of it but immigrant simply means someone from one of the other 200 countries that comes to your country.

I guess I'd rather argue what he said, instead of throwing words in his mouth.

I just heard an argument where a theist kept saying an atheist believes there is no god when the atheist kept saying disbelief in God is not the same as a belief that there is no god. Basically, argue the actual words, not what you think they mean.

We can assume cherry is racist, and we can assume he was thinking racist things, but if he doesn't mention races in a specific comment, you can't use that specific comment as an argument that he's racist. You could use it in an argument for nationalism as he makes reference to non Canadians who come to Canada.

 

[pzeeman]

1. I will agree that we are in a “different” place. Better? Not so sure about that. The rest I disagree with completely. Discrimination/racism has always been unacceptable. The racist uncle analogy is terrible.

2. Yes, but on top of the fact that Budweiser most likely gave Sportsnet an ultimatum is most likely. It’s all about the money.

But Twitter is making this moment into some sort of nation-building watershed moment. CTV News started those ****ing broadcast with this story as they stepped on dead veterans graves to push out a sensationalistic story. That is reprehensible in my view , which brings me back to your point 1. Better times?

1. A text-based forum is such a terrible way to try to express nuance that spoken word does with effiicency. He was tolerated with rolling eyes because tradition and he brought the CBC money and attention. And can you imagine the FREE SPEECH outrage if a crown corporation fired him over something like this? Racism and discrimination have always been wrong, yes. But we've only recently become brave enough as a society to push back when it's demonstrated by the influential. That's progress.

2. I won't try to answer for the cesspool that Twitter can be, nor for the editorial decisions of CTV.

 

[TheDebater]

Well I work in the public and see more white immigrants than dark skinned immigrants. What I look for, is usually a heavy accent. You can't tell what an immigrant looks like alone. You can have a white person who moved here last month from Poland, and you can have someone who is very black, and has been here for 6 generations...

Exactly, which is why Cherry brushing all immigrants with one stroke is wrong and the fact he thinks he can identify immigrants from Canadian citizens is prejudice. Why did he not call out all the non-immigrants who do not wear a poppy? I could make the argument that more Canadians don't wear poppies than immigrants yet he felt the need to remind those who came here "that they should be more appreciative" to the sacrifices of the military.


I disagree with that last part of your post though, the meaning behind the words is much more indicative of racism than simply "mis-speaking" and saying something that might have "sounded" racist but knowing who or why the person said it could determine if what they said was meant to be racist or not.

Some black people call eachother the N-word day and night, does that make them racist? Or is it just a bad habit they developed into their vernacular?

And I am not sure what you meant by "immigrants can be identified by their accents", does that make someone who becomes a canadian citizen less Canadian than someone born here and speaks english fluently?

You are implying the same thing as Cherry, by suggesting that "you know" who is an immigrant and who is a Canadian citizen and who was born in Canada and that somehow only the ones "who came here and enjoy our way of life" are the ones not wearing poppies.

 

[Tighthead]

Two things

1. We're in a different (I'd say better) place than we were in 20 or even 10 years ago. Back then he was treated as your racist uncle at Thanksgiving that everyone tries their best to ignore. That's not going to fly anymore.

2. Sportsnet just saved themselves a ton of money by dumping their highest salary on HNIC. This might have just been the excuse they needed.

It's possible they are still paying him out. We may never learn the arrangement they made with him. Severance does take it off the books as an operating expense though, which is why they are paying Bob McCown to stay home.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

It's 2019. Figure it out and fall in line or get booted. Boo hoo. He chose to make his hockey platform an avenue to communicate his own prejudices regularly and now he's paid the price.

I can get on board that cancel culture has taken things a bit far, but considering prejudice was so accepted for so long, even as recent as the 90's and 2000's, it's fine to see the pendulum swing a bit too much the other way imo.

It's about time these guys that try to bulldoze a room with their outdated opinions are told to sit down and shut up.

 

[Masked]

It is not so much identifying white vs non-white. It is the process often referred to as 'othering'. It is the basic tenet of racism. The insinuation is that 'you people' are not 'us'. It is the drawing of a line in the sand and placing groups of people on the other side and saying 'I don't identify with you. You are other.' As some have pointed out, it is by design divisive and is also often used in politics to play on people's fear of the unknown. Designating people as 'other' is the necessary first step in many, many, many terrible outcomes.
It is important to note that Don Cherry never said 'Hey folks, I notice a lot of 'us' aren't wearing poppies so much. I think it would be great if more of 'us' wore poppies to show our support and pay respect to 'those of us' that fought in died to protect freedom'.
Instead, he said “You people … love our way of life, you love our milk and honey. At least you could pay a couple of bucks for a poppy.” He then began pointing his finger at the camera, “These guys paid for your way of life, the life you enjoy in Canada. These guys paid the biggest price.”
The distinction is clear. The implied message is that 'You' are not 'us'. This is 'our' way of life and 'we' paid for it and are only allowing 'you' to be here. That kind of thinking is absolute nonsense.

I don't think Don is too happy with anyone who doesn't wear a poppy. But from his point of view at least the immigrants might have an excuse for why they aren't wearing one and he's just stressing the significance.

One thing I'll note that I've not seen mentioned anywhere is that Don married an immigrant. But, yeah, keeping spreading the Cherry hates immigrants view.

 

[Larionov]

Some have said that Rogers should have nudged Cherry to a graceful retirement before this happened. I think the odds of Cherry gracefully retiring were slim to none, and Slim just left town. He's 85 - if he was going to retire, why didn't he do it ten years ago? He doesn't need the money, after all. He was going to hang on until they forced him to go. That's how he wanted it, and that's how it ended up...

 

[JonnyMacSen]

So the CHL Top Prospects game every year has a team named after Cherry and a Team named after Orr, will they change that now I wonder?

 

[OttawaSenators11]

I hope Rogers suffers even more - Don was the only reason i tuned in personally to HNIC.

Hopefully Cherry ends up somewhere.

 

[jbeck5]

Exactly, which is why Cherry brushing all immigrants with one stroke is wrong and the fact he thinks he can identify immigrants from Canadian citizens is prejudice. Why did he not call out all the non-immigrants who do not wear a poppy? I could make the argument that more Canadians don't wear poppies than immigrants yet he felt the need to remind those who came here "that they should be more appreciative" to the sacrifices of the military.


I disagree with that last part of your post though, the meaning behind the words is much more indicative of racism than simply "mis-speaking" and saying something that might have "sounded" racist but knowing who or why the person said it could determine if what they said was meant to be racist or not.

Some black people call eachother the N-word day and night, does that make them racist? Or is it just a bad habit they developed into their vernacular?

And I am not sure what you meant by "immigrants can be identified by their accents", does that make someone who becomes a canadian citizen less Canadian than someone born here and speaks english fluently?


You are implying the same thing as Cherry, by suggesting that "you know" who is an immigrant and who is a Canadian citizen and who was born in Canada and that somehow only the ones "who came here and enjoy our way of life" are the ones not wearing poppies.

You say "I could make the argument that more Canadians don't wear poppies than immigrants" yet blast him for sharing his own opinion of his experience.

If you can tell the difference between a Canadian and an immigrant, why is it racist if he does it?

You asked if someone who comes to Canada is less Canadian than someone who was born here. No, no, no, no. Where did I say that? Someone who comes here is more of an immigrant than someone who lived here, but is not less Canadian. You're Canadian once you have your citizenship. That's pretty black and white. You're also an immigrant when you come to a new country. Why are you having such difficulty with terms?

How am I being racist when I recognize a heavy German accent?? You make no sense...

 

[Neil Patrick Harris]

I don't think Don is too happy with anyone who doesn't wear a poppy. But from his point of view at least the immigrants might have an excuse for why they aren't wearing one and he's just stressing the significance.

One thing I'll note that I've not seen mentioned anywhere is that Don married an immigrant. But, yeah, keeping spreading the Cherry hates immigrants view.

I mean, now we're just getting into "I can't be racist because I have black friends" territory with qualifiers like that.

And since we brought up his wife, I think this quote is pretty relevant to the discussion:

“Don never said new (Canadians) and he never said immigrants,” said Luba.

“He explained this to Bart (Yabsley). When he said you people he was talking about everyone that had come into Canada over the years, every nationality."

That seems to establish pretty clearly that Cherry was making a comment on immigrants, one way or another.

If we really want to split hairs on it, it'd say it's more an issue of xenophobia than outright racism.

 

[Icelevel]

I hope Rogers suffers even more - Don was the only reason i tuned in personally to HNIC.

Hopefully Cherry ends up somewhere.

Don’t think younger people like him at all. And I’m with them. Better options all over the place. He makes it uncomfortable for people he works with not to mention offending a huge portion of viewers. That’s horrible.

 

[OttawaSenators11]

Don’t think younger people like him at all. And I’m with them. Better options all over the place. He makes it uncomfortable for people he works with not to mention offending a huge portion of viewers. That’s horrible.

I am young and i love him find His bluntness to be awesome. It's very subjective in the end with regards to the better options all over the place comment.
Everyone likes different media personalities.

 

[OttawaSenators11]

Calling out immigration isn't racist at all.

You can be white and be an immigrant.

 

[BondraTime]

Calling out immigration isn't racist at all.

You can be white and be an immigrant.

He's never been racist.

He's been a bigoted xenophobe his whole career, this was just another example of it

 

[OttawaSenators11]

He's never been racist.

He's been a bigoted xenophobe his whole career, this was just another example of it

I'll give you that - Just wish people would stop claiming racism its very foolish.

 

[coladin]

What I found interesting is in his interview, with Barb Bi Giulio, was Ron Maclean. I mean, he does look like a weasel. But anyways, he said that off air, that he was oblivious and that Ron did not mention anything to him, and then saw him apologize on air afterwards. He said to Joe Warmington that Maclean threw him under the bus, but would only say to Barb that he was "disappointed" and left it at that. He did try to imply that Ron likes getting paid. I have heard that they are close friends so an interesting twist if you will

 

[slamigo]

I don't think Don is too happy with anyone who doesn't wear a poppy. But from his point of view at least the immigrants might have an excuse for why they aren't wearing one and he's just stressing the significance.

One thing I'll note that I've not seen mentioned anywhere is that Don married an immigrant. But, yeah, keeping spreading the Cherry hates immigrants view.

Honestly, I don't think you read my post and are replying to a sentiment that is trending through this thread. My post didn't even mention immigration. My post outlined the use of 'othering'.

 

[slamigo]

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

I don't think Don is too happy with anyone who doesn't wear a poppy. But from his point of view at least the immigrants might have an excuse for why they aren't wearing one and he's just stressing the significance.

One thing I'll note that I've not seen mentioned anywhere is that Don married an immigrant. But, yeah, keeping spreading the Cherry hates immigrants view.

I am trying to think of a certain someone who is also married to an immigrant but doesnt like immigrants....I am drawing a blank.

It's pretty common for bigots to not make much sense.

 

[Masked]

I am trying to think of a certain someone who is also married to an immigrant but doesnt like immigrants....I am drawing a blank.

It's pretty common for bigots to not make much sense.

Are you sure they don't like immigrants or is it just illegal aliens they don't like? And is that their personal view or just representing the views of those that elected them?

 

[PeterSidorkiewicz]

Are you sure they don't like immigrants or is it just illegal aliens they don't like? And is that their personal view or just representing the views of those that elected them?

They don't like immigrants from certain parts of the world. You can guess what parts (hint: it's based on looks) Asylum seekers are not illegal.

 

[Tuna99]

Some have said that Rogers should have nudged Cherry to a graceful retirement before this happened. I think the odds of Cherry gracefully retiring were slim to none, and Slim just left town. He's 85 - if he was going to retire, why didn't he do it ten years ago? He doesn't need the money, after all. He was going to hang on until they forced him to go. That's how he wanted it, and that's how it ended up...

Interesting, they were commenting on the radio last night that this is the perfect ending for him, fired on Remembrance Day about poppies.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Are you sure they don't like immigrants or is it just illegal aliens they don't like? And is that their personal view or just representing the views of those that elected them?

This is the danger of the way they speak. Their language comes off as if it includes them all and gets assumed as such. It's important not to leave it to the public to decipher what you mean, because they will assume the worst.