Speculation: Does Green last the season?

[Fatass]

Green's systems suck.

We're forced to dump and chase, while we just give them our blueline all game.
The dmen need help getting out, but the forwards blow the zone all the time, then the dmen have no passing options and they just throw it out to center - assuming they don't turn it over first.
Players also have no idea who their man is on the backcheck, even when guys are pointing at opposing players they still screw it up.

I was lurking the Jets board before our game against them, and I watched a video in which Paul Maurice said the Canucks Dmen are the most aggressive in the league - IIRC he was talking about them pinching along the boards in the offensive zone, and just "up in the play" in general. Maybe a lot of the problem lies there: Guys are trying to play more aggressively which is "forcing" bad reads and leading to bad turnovers and odd-man rushes where the D are caught out of position. Green might not have "the horses", but I think a good coach would adapt to his roster.

I would give Green some time to turn things around, but probably not more than 10-15 games of this. I'm pretty frustrated with the way this team is losing. Part of it is that the other team is playing well, but a good portion of it is us practically tripping over our own feet. It's like the whole team's IQ dropped over the offseason.

Green is so screwed over this year by Benning. Not resigning Marky, Tanev, and Tofu put him into a hole. Plus, he’s got no contract for next year. It’s like Benning said, “Here’s a much lesser roster, and let’s see you win with it, and earn another contract.”

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

Green is culpable for his input into personnel decisions.

I would also like someone to make a convincing statistical/metrics argument that Green is a good coach.

Other than their PP and PK from time to time over the last 4 years, I know of no statistical/metrics argument supporting him while metrics like scoring chances against and possession numbers are generally damning.

The players like him and while referring to all the media Gnomes by their first names, he is apparently a Media 'darling ' of some sort, but the teams he has coached over the past 4 years have hung on for dear life defensively and the eye test continue to show this: The numbers back up what your eyes see: Canucks' defence is a big problem | The Journal Pioneer

 

[vanuck]

The team has an abundance of wingers but instead of trying Miller at 3C where we might *actually* have a chance to roll 3 solid lines and sort out some of our depth issues, we should definitely put Mr. Little Things back in the top 6. From the press box to the top 6 you go, Loui - go get 'em boy!

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

...No, a team is only composed of a Top 6 and a Bottom 6 and never the twain shall meet. It is forbidden.

 

[bossram]

I am not saying Green is the problem. I am saying that the team is not listening to him because he is a lame duck coach. He is a lame duck coach because the owner isn't willing to pay him. I am also saying that there is a coaching problem, because of that.

I believe the team has enough talent to play a lot better than it has. Everyone wants to blame Benning. Go ahead. Fire him. You will still have the same underachieving guys who are not playing up to their potential. Coaches are supposed to get the most of players and build a structure for the team to be successful. That's not happening.

There is enough talent on this team to make the playoffs this year, and we've seen bits of it this year. Have a look at the team that played in the bubble and knocked out Minnesota and St.Louis. Most of that team is still here and a few pieces have been added to keep this team competitivre.

The team has a limited ceiling. And that's because of roster construction. That's on Benning. Sure, the team does have enough talent to make the playoffs if everything goes right, but they're not contenders. And they're not going to be contenders regardless of the coach, because the roster is what it is. Maybe you can win a round if you get some puck luck (like last year). That's it.

Benning's horrific mismanagement means they'll have to run back the same, limited roster next season. No coach is salvaging this team.

I don't think players are actively thinking "oh lol Green doesn't have a contract I'm just not gonna try and we'll miss the playoffs, that'll be great for my career too lol". Guys like Miller came out being explicitly angry at Bennings moves. I really don't think it's the coach, and I'm not even a Green fan.

 

[Lindgren]

I think Green will last the season, and so will Benning.

I expect the team's play to begin to improve now that the most condensed part of the schedule is wrapping up. They'll have more time to rest and more time to practice, while some of the other teams that have had lighter loads to this point will be playing more often and facing the same issues that the Canucks have been dealing with. The goaltending will be better as well.

In other words, they'll be mediocre.

That is, of course, as long as they stay more-or-less healthy ...

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

But if you are bad at your job (and the evidence overwhelming supports this conclusion regarding Green and Benning and Weisbrod), don't you get let go and they hire 'Dave' the temp.

In this scene, Dave the temp is played by Stan the Smyl.

 

[chaputonyou]

I think Green will last the season, and so will Benning.

I expect the team's play to begin to improve now that the most condensed part of the schedule is wrapping up. They'll have more time to rest and more time to practice, while some of the other teams that have had lighter loads to this point will be playing more often and facing the same issues that the Canucks have been dealing with. The goaltending will be better as well.

In other words, they'll be mediocre.

That is, of course, as long as they stay more-or-less healthy ...

I agree with you. I don't think Benning is going to get canned during this season. Same with Green (though not sure if Green will be re-signed). I think Francesco gave the directive to Benning to spend as little money as possible and consider this season a write-off. There are no fans in the stands and if there is a time to cut costs, it's now for Francesco. There is no one in the stands that will have 'fire Benning or Green posters' for Hockey Night in Canada to show on TV.

The Canucks have barely had time to practice, or beat up on a rebuilding Anaheim or LA...or an old and worn-out San Jose....I do think they will get it together. I also agree - more time with Ian Clark will help Demko and Holtby (especially Holtby). I also think Hamonic is getting reps while on LTIR and will return to the team far better than what he looked like after missing training camp and having 2-3 practices before opening night for the Canucks.

Lot of ifs above. Not saying they will be amazing, but they need time off to just practice and get their sh@t together.

Chaput

 

[racerjoe]

I agree with you. I don't think Benning is going to get canned during this season. Same with Green (though not sure if Green will be re-signed). I think Francesco gave the directive to Benning to spend as little money as possible and consider this season a write-off. There are no fans in the stands and if there is a time to cut costs, it's now for Francesco. There is no one in the stands that will have 'fire Benning or Green posters' for Hockey Night in Canada to show on TV.

The Canucks have barely had time to practice, or beat up on a rebuilding Anaheim or LA...or an old and worn-out San Jose....I do think they will get it together. I also agree - more time with Ian Clark will help Demko and Holtby (especially Holtby). I also think Hamonic is getting reps while on LTIR and will return to the team far better than what he looked like after missing training camp and having 2-3 practices before opening night for the Canucks.

Lot of ifs above. Not saying they will be amazing, but they need time off to just practice and get their sh@t together.

Chaput

except they are still a cap team and brought in a dman with a huge deal... your statement is clearly false.

 

[VanJack]

Said it before....for a whole host of reasons (mostly revenue related) the Canuck owners are basically 'meh' about this season. If the team falls apart, the time for changes is at the end of the year not in the middle of a COVID-riddled season.

 

[Cogburn]

I hope to hear on after hours that he's been sacked, after a huge blow out.

 

[Hammer79]

They will probably ride it out. The Canucks are bleeding cash right now, I doubt they want to pay Green to stay home.

 

[chaputonyou]

except they are still a cap team and brought in a dman with a huge deal... your statement is clearly false.

It's not clearly false. Other teams have done buyouts. Zero buyouts for Sutter or Eriksson. Everyone points to the Canucks as having the only players that should have had buyouts or moved bad contracts. This isn't uniquely a Canucks issue, though Benning has made some bad ones.

Have a look at the team. They have massively cut payroll. Their hockey ops department is one of the smallest in the league. This is not a team that Francesco is spending any money on during COVID. Green hasn't been re-signed either.

 

[4Twenty]

It's not clearly false. Other teams have done buyouts. Zero buyouts for Sutter or Eriksson. Everyone points to the Canucks as having the only players that should have had buyouts or moved bad contracts. This isn't uniquely a Canucks issue, though Benning has made some bad ones.

Have a look at the team. They have massively cut payroll. Their hockey ops department is one of the smallest in the league. This is not a team that Francesco is spending any money on during COVID. Green hasn't been re-signed either.

Buyouts save you 2/3 cash. You’re wrong to assume this is cost cutting.

Where is this massive cut to payroll?

They pay more this year than last year.

For some reason you don’t want any blame thrown on the GM. The arguments defending it are weak.

Paid big $$$ for a player you hope is a backup and gets claimed in expansion.

Took on $30m for 5 years of a 29 year old.

 

[Fatass]

Buyouts save you 2/3 cash. You’re wrong to assume this is cost cutting.

Where is this massive cut to payroll?

They pay more this year than last year.

For some reason you don’t want any blame thrown on the GM. The arguments defending it are weak.

Paid big $$$ for a player you hope is a backup and gets claimed in expansion.

Took on $30m for 5 years of a 29 year old.

Isn’t 4 years of Tanev at 4 mil better than 5 years of Schmidt at 6 mil? We could have Tanev and Tofu right now instead of Schmidt and Jake (considering cap costs) no? And then how much more is Marky than Holtby; a Sutter buyout? Is my math way off?

 

[Fatass]

They will probably ride it out. The Canucks are bleeding cash right now, I doubt they want to pay Green to stay home.

Promote Jarvis from within to interim head coach, and will that cost much more? Still have to pay Green for the remainder of the season, but the total dollars out should be very similar, no?

 

[iceburg]

I actually don't get the hyper criticism of Green. No doubt he is not nearly perfect. They should have been able to implement a system that reduces the number of shots per game. But he's not responsible for a top 6 D that includes Benn and Chatfield. He's not responsible for losing 4 key players for nothing in return. He's not responsible for around 50% of their cap tied up in players filling the bottom of the line-up/press box/minors.

 

[coastalview]

Buyouts save you 2/3 cash. You’re wrong to assume this is cost cutting.

Where is this massive cut to payroll?

They pay more this year than last year.

For some reason you don’t want any blame thrown on the GM. The arguments defending it are weak.

Paid big $$$ for a player you hope is a backup and gets claimed in expansion.

Took on $30m for 5 years of a 29 year old.

the nucks are not spending like they did last year
they are paying approximately 61 million to their active roster
about 5.5 million to injured players
about 3.5 million to spooner and baerschi
loungo is a penalty that lowers the cap for the nucks - nothing is paid to him
capfriendly shows their salary expenditures this season are a shade under 70 million
maple leafs are paying 91 million this year in salary by comparison

 

[Green Blank Stare]

I actually don't get the hyper criticism of Green. No doubt he is not nearly perfect. They should have been able to implement a system that reduces the number of shots per game. But he's not responsible for a top 6 D that includes Benn and Chatfield. He's not responsible for losing 4 key players for nothing in return. He's not responsible for around 50% of their cap tied up in players filling the bottom of the line-up/press box/minors.

Because their defensive play right now is no different than when they had a better roster last season. His "system" BLEEDS high opportunity shots for their opponents and relies on the goalie to stand on his head. Basically, his "system" is the rope-a-dope. He is an awful coach.

 

[iceburg]

Because their defensive play right now is no different than when they had a better roster last season. His "system" BLEEDS high opportunity shots for their opponents and relies on the goalie to stand on his head. Basically, his "system" is the rope-a-dope. He is an awful coach.

Yeah. I pine for the dead puck era too...

 

[Kreator]

hes fukkin brutal

 

[Siludin]

Sooooo... what's Gerard Gallant up to these days?

 

[Breakers]

Tuesday is my guess.

Let them get back into town with a two day break.

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

Nope they are scapegoating Jake for not playing well in the press box.

Green and Benning are apparently teflon.

 

[I am toxic]

"Give your head a shake"