Does anyone still think Marner is better than Matthews?

[ACC1224]

marner is the person to blame for the fan reaction to him. He took it personally. Which I get, but If he is so obtuse that he can’t see that


1.) hiring the most confrontational agent in the league
2.) having his father be a mouthpeice on the radio comparing him to Mcdavid
3.) having dreger report he was considering offer sheets.

was not going to affect his image he is nuts. I wonder if it’s long term. I mean time heals most wounds. But they made numerous references to how he was with the fanbase. He may end up wanting out.

who knows. We will have paid half his contract by whatever version of July 1 is this year....


Maybe he gets his wish and goes to Columbus

Unfortunately, most seem to have a mixed up opinion.

Goal scorers are not automatically better than play makers.

Play makers create more goals for their team than goal scorers.

Mitch is a team player and a winner.

The same can not be said for auston.

 

[Menzinger]

marner is the person to blame for the fan reaction to him. He took it personally. Which I get, but If he is so obtuse that he can’t see that


1.) hiring the most confrontational agent in the league
2.) having his father be a mouthpeice on the radio comparing him to Mcdavid
3.) having dreger report he was considering offer sheets.

was not going to affect his image he is nuts. I wonder if it’s long term. I mean time heals most wounds. But they made numerous references to how he was with the fanbase. He may end up wanting out.

who knows. We will have paid half his contract by whatever version of July 1 is this year....


Maybe he gets his wish and goes to Columbus

I dont disagree that Marner (like any of the main guys) have to deal.with the consequences of asking for such bug money consequences so ultimately he will.need to 'suck it up'.

I just think its a safer bet that he manages to put things together next season than not

 

[Legion34]

I dont disagree that Marner (like any of the main guys) have to deal.with the consequences of asking for such bug money consequences so ultimately he will.need to 'suck it up'.

I just think its a safer bet that he manages to put things together next season than not

he will skill wise. He just seems to come from very stubborn stock that holds grudges.


His dad was upset talking about views of junior players 5-10’tears ago.

I can see this being an issue for the family for a long time. They seem delusional and can’t let things go.
Great player. Not as great as Matthews or mcdavid

 

[Bomber0104]

So soft!

 

[kesleaf]

Who gives a f*** anymore

I just want hockey back and Corona gone

 

[member 300185]

So last summer a fair number were claiming Marner was better than Auston when the contract numbers came out. I'm curious now that Auston has had his breakout season if opinions have changed. Full disclosure I am a Matthews man.

Marner does

 

[Legion34]

Who gives a f*** anymore

I just want hockey back and Corona gone

then why did you come to post

 

[SlpLessInMuskoka18]

Matthew's is making way more than 700,000 man.. He's going to get that extra year on a new contract most likely somewhere in the 15-18m range.

 

[hamzarocks]

he will skill wise. He just seems to come from very stubborn stock that holds grudges.


His dad was upset talking about views of junior players 5-10’tears ago.

I can see this being an issue for the family for a long time. They seem delusional and can’t let things go.
Great player. Not as great as Matthews or mcdavid

Gap b/w marner and matthews is smaller than gap b/w matthews and McDavid. Matthews still needs to improve if he wants to justify the deal he got. He does not take as much heat as marner or nylander did because he signed his deal midway through the year and did not give us offseason of dread like 88 and 16 but his production hasnt been good enough to be paid 11.634 yet.

 

[Legion34]

Gap b/w marner and matthews is smaller than gap b/w matthews and McDavid. Matthews still needs to improve if he wants to justify the deal he got. He does not take as much heat as marner or nylander did because he signed his deal midway through the year and did not give us offseason of dread like 88 and 16 but his production hasnt been good enough to be paid 11.634 yet.

Oh agreed. I’m not saying Matthews is mcdavid level. I’m saying marners dad and agent have compared him to both.

Matthews signed at 14% of the expected cap x 5 that is in line with historical comparables.

Not the best contract. But far from the worst RFA deal. Matthews was top 10 in goals. Goal per game. Points points per game over his ELC compared to every player in past 20 years

The deal he got was justifiable money wise, with no discount at all.

if the 16x7 offer sheet that was waiting for him as Friedman reported and he took this deal, he did is a favour by asking for a justifiable rate instead of squeezing for an albatross deal.

 

[Wafflewhipper]

marner is the person to blame for the fan reaction to him. He took it personally. Which I get, but If he is so obtuse that he can’t see that


1.) hiring the most confrontational agent in the league
2.) having his father be a mouthpeice on the radio comparing him to Mcdavid
3.) having dreger report he was considering offer sheets.

was not going to affect his image he is nuts. I wonder if it’s long term. I mean time heals most wounds. But they made numerous references to how he was with the fanbase. He may end up wanting out.

who knows. We will have paid half his contract by whatever version of July 1 is this year....


Maybe he gets his wish and goes to Columbus

I don’t think he wants out. His father mouthing off is who he should be p!ssed at not the fans. Fans were entertained by the cost of the contract, Ferris’s confrontational approach and the dad. Plus he comes out not looking like the same player as last year in terms of consistency in play( points aside) he didn’t have that jump and enthusiasm of past years.

Then adds another layer by exposing Babcocks antics with rating players as a rookie. Then the fan hate and family hate eyc. Its been a sh!tshow year he will be glad is over.

I don’t know if he wants out. He wants this darn year over! Pressure is on him like it was on Willy, it can be to much for players as we have seen in many others crumbling sonewhat to different reality’s that go with huge money.

For me its not about the money as long as the management doesn’t box themselves in by being up against the cap to hard. We seen that also with pridham working the impossible at times.

Best part is next year or this playoff it could all change back to icon status for any leaf player with a excellent work ethic and successful playoff.

Lots of different influences from different areas annoyed fans this year. Many of the angry opinions were directed at a player that had many outside influences making it look bad on him. Great kid gets a big degree of the blame. I don’t think it’s totally fair but he has to man up and do everything in his play that he can to make us forget this year.

I think he has been off but far from bad. Matthews absolutely is this years best player. I don’t believe the value of both to the team is much a difference.

 

[stickty111]

Matthews is a generational goal scorer and has shown immense growth defensively. Thats very good for 11.67.

 

[kb]

Marner drops in a 2015 redraft.

Redrafting 2015: McDavid and Eichel still go 1-2, Strome's out at No. 3

 

[Wafflewhipper]

Marner drops in a 2015 redraft.

Redrafting 2015: McDavid and Eichel still go 1-2, Strome's out at No. 3

That re draft is bad is really bad ha. Reminds why i stay away from the score

 

[ACC1224]

Marner drops in a 2015 redraft.

Redrafting 2015: McDavid and Eichel still go 1-2, Strome's out at No. 3

Interesting opinion, not sure I agree with it.

 

[stickty111]

Marner drops in a 2015 redraft.

Redrafting 2015: McDavid and Eichel still go 1-2, Strome's out at No. 3

I'm not certain about Barzal but Aho I would take over Marner. As someone who thought Marner could be better then Eichel, thats not the case now. Eichel is better.
At worst, Marner is #5.

 

[rent free]

matthews was wicked this season. i can't wait till he hits his prime

 

[hamzarocks]

I'm not certain about Barzal but Aho I would take over Marner. As someone who thought Marner could be better then Eichel, thats not the case now. Eichel is better.
At worst, Marner is #5.

Marner is 3 at worst and at best 2. Marner is slightly worse than eichel who is slightly worse than matthews. People tend to value centers more but marner career wise has basically the same ppg as those guys and has shown to be a decent defensive player.

He blows barzal out of the water who is not a top 10 pick in a redraft and is still ahead of Aho who plays on a stacked line of svechnikov and TT and is still below ppg.

The top 10 should be this imo

1. McDavid
2. Eichel
3. Marner
4. Rantanen
5. Aho
6. Connor
7. Werenski
8. Koencny
9. Provorov
10. Barzal/Boesor

 

[hamzarocks]

Matthews is a generational goal scorer and has shown immense growth defensively. Thats very good for 11.67.

No it's not good for 11.67 at all. He is still not playing up to that contract despite being our best player. He needs to become an elite point producer to justify his deal. Being a 95 point player wont make him being the 2nd highest AAV a fair deal. He is a fringe top 10 player right now so still has to grow to make the deal fair.

 

[stickty111]

No it's not good for 11.67 at all. He is still not playing up to that contract despite being our best player. He needs to become an elite point producer to justify his deal. Being a 95 point player wont make him being the 2nd highest AAV a fair deal. He is a fringe top 10 player right now so still has to grow to make the deal fair.

You have already shown what your stance is on Matthews and Marner so I'm not going to be chaging that. Matthews is solid value at 11.67. Marner's contract is near disaster level at 10.9.
Marner needs to be a whole lot better to justify his contract. Matthews is fine for the way he played this season. He was our MVP this season.

 

[stickty111]

Marner is 3 at worst and at best 2. Marner is slightly worse than eichel who is slightly worse than matthews. People tend to value centers more but marner career wise has basically the same ppg as those guys and has shown to be a decent defensive player.

He blows barzal out of the water who is not a top 10 pick in a redraft and is still ahead of Aho who plays on a stacked line of svechnikov and TT and is still below ppg.

The top 10 should be this imo

1. McDavid
2. Eichel
3. Marner
4. Rantanen
5. Aho
6. Connor
7. Werenski
8. Koencny
9. Provorov
10. Barzal/Boesor

And Marner played with 2 elite centres this season. Lets not overrate Marner even more.
Aho is a centre who is much better defensively and his production is also strong. Give me Aho everytime.

 

[stickty111]

Marner better not overrate himself like the fans do or we have a problem. All though it looks he does.

 

[hamzarocks]

You have already shown what your stance is on Matthews and Marner so I'm not going to be chaging that. Matthews is solid value at 11.67. Marner's contract is near disaster level at 10.9.
Marner needs to be a whole lot better to justify his contract. Matthews is fine for the way he played this season. He was our MVP this season.

Near disaster is a hyperbole. 95 point player who is making 10.9 he is h/w 1-1.5 million overpaid while Matthews 634k overpaid but sadly his contract is very low on term. Being our MVP of a fringe playoff team is not that great. Matthews was again way to inconsistent (as was marner) and simply did not produce enough offense to justify the deal he got. He started out poorly on the defensive side before tightening up and becoming a strong defensive player the least 30 games or so.

If matthews does not grow his contract will never be fair. He has 4 seasons to become a top 5 player in the league. Right now he would not have been on either all NHL teams or been top 5 in hart/lindsay voting.

 

[rent free]

Near disaster is a hyperbole. 95 point player who is making 10.9 he is h/w 1-1.5 million overpaid while Matthews 634k overpaid but sadly his contract is very low on term. Being our MVP of a fringe playoff team is not that great. Matthews was again way to inconsistent (as was marner) and simply did not produce enough offense to justify the deal he got. He started out poorly on the defensive side before tightening up and becoming a strong defensive player the least 30 games or so.

If matthews does not grow his contract will never be fair. He has 4 seasons to become a top 5 player in the league. Right now he would not have been on either all NHL teams or been top 5 in hart/lindsay voting.

this is pretty spot on. idk why the dubas stans just won't admit he's overpaid

 

[hamzarocks]

And Marner played with 2 elite centres this season. Lets not overrate Marner even more.
Aho is a centre who is much better defensively and his production is also strong. Give me Aho everytime.

Marner has already shown to be the better player between JT and him. HT saw his production decline with Marner while marner is still at the same offensive output. Aho plays in one of the best defensive systems in the league. He has an elite defensive core and a group of defensive minded forwards on his team. His defense being elite and much better than marners is a narrative being pushed. Marner has been a strong defensive player this year at time and has had moments where he looks lost (same case with matthews, and nylander). Our teams defensive structure is often so undisciplined we find our star players put in unfavourable defensive positions very often. None of our star players are elite defensively. However playing the system we play hurts there numbers as we are a high offensive team who does not play a tight/defensive game.