Devils 2020-21 team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part III

[Spoiled Bratt]

If you can only sign one - Gusev or Palms, who are you signing?

Palmieri and it’s not even close. Gusev is great but we need what Palmieri brings to the table more so then what Gusev can give us.

 

[My3Sons]

If you can only sign one - Gusev or Palms, who are you signing?

My current thought is that Palms makes more sense and will likely cost a bit less. I expect that Gusev has a great season next year and he looks for a top top dollar deal. My expectation is he plays to a roughly 70 point pace if he’s healthy. If he achieves that he could return a late first at the deadline if he doesn’t want to agree to a shorter term deal with NJ.

 

[Devils731]

My current thought is that Palms makes more sense and will likely cost a bit less. I expect that Gusev has a great season next year and he looks for a top top dollar deal. My expectation is he plays to a roughly 70 point pace if he’s healthy. If he achieves that he could return a late first at the deadline if he doesn’t want to agree to a shorter term deal with NJ.

Im thinking the Devils trade one of Palmieri or Gusev at the deadline and we can’t know which one yet.

Either way, I’m hoping the Devils can juice the return by picking up half that players contract. Salary caps are going to be so tight that either guy at an annualized ~$2.3 million may make them the best player teams can fit into their cap structure.

Fingers crossed that Gusev has a big year and then I’d imagine he’ll be way better than anyone else you could get for his dollars and there will be a fight to get him.

 

[R8Devs]

My current thought is that Palms makes more sense and will likely cost a bit less. I expect that Gusev has a great season next year and he looks for a top top dollar deal. My expectation is he plays to a roughly 70 point pace if he’s healthy. If he achieves that he could return a late first at the deadline if he doesn’t want to agree to a shorter term deal with NJ.

I'd be pretty surprised if Palms didn't get the bigger deal (or at least longer) as he has more of a track record in the NHL. If Gusev puts up as many points as you're expecting that seems like a player the Devils should keep. But I think Gusev would be cheaper than Palmieri (as of right now), doesn't have to be protected in the expansion draft, and would return less in a trade than Palmieri. That's why I would keep Gusev -- more flexibility come expansion draft could open up even more options.

 

[MartyOwns]

My current thought is that Palms makes more sense and will likely cost a bit less. I expect that Gusev has a great season next year and he looks for a top top dollar deal. My expectation is he plays to a roughly 70 point pace if he’s healthy. If he achieves that he could return a late first at the deadline if he doesn’t want to agree to a shorter term deal with NJ.

maybe we shouldn’t be trading 70 point guys though? i would like to see us keep both

 

[Fourier]

Im thinking the Devils trade one of Palmieri or Gusev at the deadline and we can’t know which one yet.

Either way, I’m hoping the Devils can juice the return by picking up half that players contract. Salary caps are going to be so tight that either guy at an annualized ~$2.3 million may make them the best player teams can fit into their cap structure.

Fingers crossed that Gusev has a big year and then I’d imagine he’ll be way better than anyone else you could get for his dollars and there will be a fight to get him.

As an Oiler Fan I was hoping to ask a couple of questions.

1) What interest would there be in getting Larsson back...I am actually one of the guys on the Oiler board that values Larsson's play. When he is healthy he can still be a force defensively and he was playing very well this year down the stretch. But with only one year left he might be the guy the team chooses to move on from to make room for some of the young prospects down the line. But I suspect he would be willing to resign with NJ and my guess is that he won't be all that expensive given his lack of offensive production. He may be a great mentor for a kid like Ty Smith who will eventually be a very good NHL defender I expect. If there is interest what sort of return would be available?

2) If the Oilers were interested in Zacha and or Gusev what would be the cost? How would Larsson fit into a deal for either of these two if at all?

Thank you in advance for any thoughts you might have.

 

[Billdo]

As an Oiler Fan I was hoping to ask a couple of questions.

1) What interest would there be in getting Larsson back...I am actually one of the guys on the Oiler board that values Larsson's play. When he is healthy he can still be a force defensively and he was playing very well this year down the stretch. But with only one year left he might be the guy the team chooses to move on from to make room for some of the young prospects down the line. But I suspect he would be willing to resign with NJ and my guess is that he won't be all that expensive given his lack of offensive production. He may be a great mentor for a kid like Ty Smith who will eventually be a very good NHL defender I expect. If there is interest what sort of return would be available?

2) If the Oilers were interested in Zacha and or Gusev what would be the cost? How would Larsson fit into a deal for either of these two if at all?

Thank you in advance for any thoughts you might have.

I don't think Larsson brings back either of those players tbh. I would take him back, I feel like I'm probably in the minority on that, but not at the cost of Zacha or Gusev.

 

[Devils731]

I don't think Larsson brings back either of those players tbh. I would take him back, I feel like I'm probably in the minority on that, but not at the cost of Zacha or Gusev.

I’ll second Billdo.

I obviously didn’t see Larsson play much this year but it’s concerning that his ice time and short handed time went down.

I think Larsson can play but he’s probably not a guy I would look to acquire. If he does make it to free agency I wouldn’t be opposed to seeing what contract he was looking for.

 

[My3Sons]

maybe we shouldn’t be trading 70 point guys though? i would like to see us keep both

I don’t see it lasting for Gusev. I sort of see him peaking with his year of experience and then he will start to decline. I’m not against extending him but only if it makes sense. I think Palms ages a bit more gracefully But it’s just a guess. I don’t claim any insight. Palms may have some reason to want to play in NJ. What’s Gusev’s reason to accept anything from NJ other than the longest biggest money deal? You have to sign contracts with an eye towards value until you know who your core is and get them locked up (just my thought).

I just don’t see NJ being good enough to really move forward until the defense gets sorted out. Hopefully that’s just a player or two.

 

[Fourier]

I don't think Larsson brings back either of those players tbh. I would take him back, I feel like I'm probably in the minority on that, but not at the cost of Zacha or Gusev.

I’ll second Billdo.

I obviously didn’t see Larsson play much this year but it’s concerning that his ice time and short handed time went down.

I think Larsson can play but he’s probably not a guy I would look to acquire. If he does make it to free agency I wouldn’t be opposed to seeing what contract he was looking for.

Thanks.

Larsson actually played very well over the last half of the season. In fact for the last 15 or so games he looked very much like the guy the Oilers got in his first year. that player was a rock, especially in the playoffs. But his time in Edmonton has been mixed with injuries and the death of his father. I can appreciate the valuation from your side but I was just curious to see how much value he might have as a mentor for your young defensemen. He supposedly had a very positive influence on Broberg, who had a fantastic mini camp.

 

[Forge]

1) What interest would there be in getting Larsson back

None from me.

2) If the Oilers were interested in Zacha and or Gusev what would be the cost? How would Larsson fit into a deal for either of these two if at all?

Gusev, if dealt, is a rental so that probably means a futures package and would likely be dependent on how he's playing. If's he's doing what he did under Nas, it'll be a top notch rental. Think anywhere from a first rounder + meh prospect to second round pick + pretty good prospect (think Taffoli deal for that second one). That's assuming a deadline deal, of course.

Zacha I'm amenable to dealing, but it needs to make sense and really be a hockey trade and I want no piece of Larsson, so I think that probably makes the two teams bad trading partners.

 

[MartyOwns]

I just don’t see NJ being good enough to really move forward until the defense gets sorted out. Hopefully that’s just a player or two.

fair enough. i’m usually the token pessimist, but i really don’t think we’re as far off as some here do

 

[Pitaya]

If we dont see a signing of a guy like Dillon or a trade for a guy like Nurse, players of that level and make-up, the defense is in BIG trouble on the left side.

 

[Billdo]

He supposedly had a very positive influence on Broberg, who had a fantastic mini camp.

Outside of Smith we really don't have any guys who are young enough to require a mentor. With how barren out left side is, if Larsson was left handed I'd be more interested but he'd be playing 3rd pairing RD which would either push Smith out of the lineup entirely or push Smith to LD when he's played predominantly on the right.

 

[glenwo2]

from your mouth to tom's ears

And from Tom's ears to Mr. Devil's butt.

Though I'd prefer a long-term deal for Bratt instead of a 2-year bridge contract.

 

[Fourier]

Outside of Smith we really don't have any guys who are young enough to require a mentor. With how barren out left side is, if Larsson was left handed I'd be more interested but he'd be playing 3rd pairing RD which would either push Smith out of the lineup entirely or push Smith to LD when he's played predominantly on the right.

That's interesting that Smith has mostly played on the right. I followed Spokane quite a bit for two years and I know he is a lefty but since I mostly listened on the radio I'll confess I can't say I can really remember what side he was on. I would have thought that with Subban and Severson on the right side he would have been a natural for playing on the left.

The Oilers have a lot of left handed defensemen but I am not sure that any would make sense to the Devils right now. Nurse and Klefbom are likely not going anywhere. Jones looked great at times including his short stint in the playoffs, but he is very raw so he is likely worth more to the Oilers than they would get in a deal. Broberg took a major step forward in the mini camp. Shocked me to tell the truth. Its hard to believe a guy that big can skate like that at his age. But we will see how the rest of his game plays out.

 

[Bleedred]

Connor Chatham. He'll be with the big club soon.

 

[My3Sons]

fair enough. i’m usually the token pessimist, but i really don’t think we’re as far off as some here do

I'm not down on the future of the team, far from it. I just think that you have to look two or three years down the road to see the team take a big jump up the standings and deals signed in the next year or two should take that into account. I think MBW is a good goalie. That said, I've never met him and have no idea what he's like. If he's a smart kid and hard worker, like Nico, I'd just as soon pay him and make him a putative part of the core for the next six or seven years. I expect Jack to get better and I like Bratt and realize he's small and gets hurt but he's smart and skilled and quietly feisty and I'd sign him to a six or seven year deal also. I'm confident that one other forward prospect will pan out to be a core player even if we don't know who that might be right now.

Unfortunately, I just don't see anyone beyond Severson and Smith on defense right now I'd want on the team in three years (Maybe one of Bahl or the other guys drafted last year pan out but I don't know enough about any of them). I'd move Butcher and Mueller and I hope PK bounces back but I don't see keeping him beyond a one or two year deal after his current one expires assuming he even finds his overall game again. If one of Bahl or the other young defenders develops into at least a mid pair guy and they sign or trade for a guy who can break even on the top pair then the team can at least start having a semblance of a stable defense.

In retrospect, Shero probably needed to set fire to everything in 2015 and 2016 rather than the team having to do that this year, five years after he took over. I think he might have been fooled by getting Hall into thinking the team was better than it was. They haven't

 

[glenwo2]

I mean if we get Drysdale at 7 and a top forward slips to 11 or maybe if we get a top forward at 7 and Sanderson is there at 11 it could be a debate. But I’m not wasting Blackwood if all the top guys are gone and we’re just picking a McLeod level player.

Plus I’d rather just keep a guy who’s a young NHL player, we have enough picks and needs without creating another.

11?

Are we getting the 11th pick?

The Yotes were eliminated in the REAL 1st round.

 

[NJDevs26]

11?

Are we getting the 11th pick?

It was a hypothetical suggested by someone to trade Blackwood for the 11OA

 

[glenwo2]

It was a hypothetical suggested by someone to trade Blackwood for the 11OA

Oh I see.

It makes me upset knowing that Hynes screwed the Devils over with his incompetent Coaching even when he is on another team.

 

[Pitaya]

I really do think, if no better deals are available, a Minnesota/Nashville/Florida will trade back and we can get the pick of the litter including guys like Jarvis Guhle Schneider Mercer Lundell Quinn

But theyd have to love the prospect they are trading up for - though in reality that is always more comforting than just making a pick (knowing the scouts loved the guy so much they traded up for him)

 

[Pitaya]

Oh I see.

It makes me upset knowing that Hynes screwed the Devils over with his incompetent Coaching even when he is on another team.

I do think now that its said and done the Devils will have the 3rd upgraded to a 2nd in arbitration. Arizona got destroyed and our pick suffered because of covid - not because of their play. Idk how many other teams lost that much draft stock from the covid situation

 

[glenwo2]

I'm not down on the future of the team, far from it. I just think that you have to look two or three years down the road to see the team take a big jump up the standings and deals signed in the next year or two should take that into account. I think MBW is a good goalie. That said, I've never met him and have no idea what he's like. If he's a smart kid and hard worker, like Nico, I'd just as soon pay him and make him a putative part of the core for the next six or seven years. I expect Jack to get better and I like Bratt and realize he's small and gets hurt but he's smart and skilled and quietly feisty and I'd sign him to a six or seven year deal also. I'm confident that one other forward prospect will pan out to be a core player even if we don't know who that might be right now.

Unfortunately, I just don't see anyone beyond Severson and Smith on defense right now I'd want on the team in three years (Maybe one of Bahl or the other guys drafted last year pan out but I don't know enough about any of them). I'd move Butcher and Mueller and I hope PK bounces back but I don't see keeping him beyond a one or two year deal after his current one expires assuming he even finds his overall game again. If one of Bahl or the other young defenders develops into at least a mid pair guy and they sign or trade for a guy who can break even on the top pair then the team can at least start having a semblance of a stable defense.

In retrospect, Shero probably needed to set fire to everything in 2015 and 2016 rather than the team having to do that this year, five years after he took over. I think he might have been fooled by getting Hall into thinking the team was better than it was. They haven't

Bratt was hurt a total of TWO times(If I recall correctly).

Once when some friggin' Journeyman idiot whose first name is Drew, broke Jesper's jaw with a slapshot in practice.

The other where Bratt blocked a shot with his foot and was out for an extended period.


Aside from that, I don't recall any other time he got hurt unless you count him being healthy-scratched.

 

[Bleedred]

It was a hypothetical suggested by someone to trade Blackwood for the 11OA

I think both us and the other team would be stupid to trade Blackwood for the 11th overall.

No team should trade the 11th overall for him, as he’s not quite proven enough yet and we really can’t afford to do that because we already have some serious goalie depth issues behind Blackwood.

I mean, we would be incredibly stupid to sign Holtby and trading for someone like Jake Allen would also be terrible, as he’s been a bad goalie for several years (had a good year this season) even in St. Louis.