Devils 2016-17 team discussion (players news & notes) Part III

[Ripshot 43]

Complain to the person who brought it up then, not me...

Yep, complaining was definitely what I was doing.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

Yep, complaining was definitely what I was doing.

I don't see the purpose of your comment if not to complain. What was it supposed to contribute to the conversation?

 

[Ripshot 43]

I don't see the purpose of your comment if not to complain. What was it supposed to contribute to the conversation?

It was contributing that you guys were joining a circle that was already lapped quite a few times.

No need to get testy. Just pointing out what may not be obvious

 

[RSeen]

I don't think the Oilers would be willing to give us two of their first overalls, no. You clearly do, and blame Shero for us not having Hall and Yakupov, and the only reason people around here were interested in Yakupov is the first overall label, so let's not act as if that has zero bearing. If Yakupov was a third round pick, I doubt fans around here would be mad that Shero didn't acquire him.

Wow you really seem to like arguing...

I don't blame Shero for not acquiring Yakupov, the whole league knew his value was a 3rd. It actually does have zero bearing in a trade scenario, Yak is not highly valued, he is what he is and that is reflected in the return he brought from the Blues. I would would have preferred to acquire him over the 3rd round pick from Gelinas but it isn't a big deal to me.

I still find it laughable you cite the two being 1st overall picks, the Oilers were clearly desperate to get D and would have still paid Hall to get Larsson, considering Gelinas is terrible.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

It was contributing that you guys were joining a circle that was already lapped quite a few times.

No need to get testy. Just pointing out what may not be obvious

Most conversations around here are repeats. I think most of us have figured that out. Very rarely is anything new brought up.

 

[JK3]

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

Wow you really seem to like arguing...

I don't blame Shero for not acquiring Yakupov, the whole league knew his value was a 3rd. It actually does have zero bearing in a trade scenario, Yak is not highly valued, he is what he is and that is reflected in the return he brought from the Blues. I would would have preferred to acquire him over the 3rd round pick from Gelinas but it isn't a big deal to me.

I still find it laughable you cite the two being 1st overall picks, the Oilers were clearly desperate to get D and would have still paid Hall to get Larsson, considering Gelinas is terrible.

I think both the Hall trade and the Yakupov trade have the potential to make the Oilers GM look like a fool. I'm not sure he wants to have his pocket picked by the same GM twice in a few months span, but, at this point, think whatever you want, it's not going to make Yakupov a Devil.

 

[RSeen]

I think both the Hall trade and the Yakupov trade have the potential to make the Oilers GM look like a fool. I'm not sure he wants to have his pocket picked by the same GM twice in a few months span, but, at this point, think whatever you want, it's not going to make Yakupov a Devil.

What is this suppose to mean? I'm not upset about it but you keep acting like I am.

If the players end up making him look foolish for trading them, it won't matter if it is to separate GMs or the same one.

 

[britdevil]

About time. Wood needs to stew in the minors.

I think Speers will be sent back this week.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

What is this suppose to mean? I'm not upset about it but you keep acting like I am.

If the players end up making him look foolish for trading them, it won't matter if it is to separate GMs or the same one.

It means that you can believe the rumors about how we could have acquired Yakupov--and disregard the ones that also mention the Oilers GM having a disingenuous habit of upping the price for Yakupov at the last minute, so it's rather convenient to believe that the price for Yakupov would really have just been Gelinas or whatever--but at the end of the day, we didn't. The reality is we don't have Yakupov, and since Shero is actually good at trading, I think he has a reason why the trade didn't happen--either because the trade would have been too expensive or because it would have negatively impacted his long-term negotiations with the Oilers (and Shero's comments after the Hall trade make it clear to me that he was in long-term discussions with the Oilers throughout last season)--and so I base my opinion on that rather than click bait rumors. Whether or not you are upset doesn't change the reality that we have no Yakupov. You can come up with whatever explanation you like to deal with that reality. I have mine. You have yours that is grounded in connect-the-dots rumors. That's fine. Whatever makes sense to you.

 

[Zippy316]

It means that you can believe the rumors about how we could have acquired Yakupov--and disregard the ones that also mention the Oilers GM having a disingenuous habit of upping the price for Yakupov at the last minute, so it's rather convenient to believe that the price for Yakupov would really have just been Gelinas or whatever--but at the end of the day, we didn't. The reality is we don't have Yakupov, and since Shero is actually good at trading, I think he has a reason why the trade didn't happen--either because the trade would have been too expensive or because it would have negatively impacted his long-term negotiations with the Oilers (and Shero's comments after the Hall trade make it clear to me that he was in long-term discussions with the Oilers throughout last season)--and so I base my opinion on that rather than click bait rumors. Whether or not you are upset doesn't change the reality that we have no Yakupov. You can come up with whatever explanation you like to deal with that reality. I have mine. You have yours that is grounded in connect-the-dots rumors. That's fine. Whatever makes sense to you.

On the Yakupov trade, the timeline of events make that trade deadline day rather interesting.

Gelinas was traded around 1:30 to Colorado. Stempniak was traded right at 3 to Boston and Matteau/DSP was not announced until I believe 3:30.

To me, that leaves a lot of unanswered questions. Did Shero take the asset over Yakupov after giving up on the playoffs and deciding to trade Stempniak? Did Shero rather get DSP for Matteau than add Yakupov? The interesting thing in all of this is Shero traded Gelinas for a 3rd round pick two drafts from the deadline rather than (supposedly) add value to get Yakupov. I find it hard to believe Yakupov isn't worth more than a third round pick in 2016 for a team that was starving for offense at the time. It's quite possible that Shero preferred the flexibility an extra third round pick offered him

There had to be a reason Shero did not want Yakupov. I believe he was again offered for the third round pick Shero traded to Pittsburgh for Bennett. If Shero had his eyes set on Hall all along, then he is an absolute wizard, but I doubt he could've expected that formulating like it did.

 

[Cheddabombs]

who cares about Yakupov tho?

 

[britdevil]

Kings are in a real goalie crisis. I wonder if there's a trade there for Shero?

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

On the Yakupov trade, the timeline of events make that trade deadline day rather interesting.

Gelinas was traded around 1:30 to Colorado. Stempniak was traded right at 3 to Boston and Matteau/DSP was not announced until I believe 3:30.

To me, that leaves a lot of unanswered questions. Did Shero take the asset over Yakupov after giving up on the playoffs and deciding to trade Stempniak? Did Shero rather get DSP for Matteau than add Yakupov? The interesting thing in all of this is Shero traded Gelinas for a 3rd round pick two drafts from the deadline rather than (supposedly) add value to get Yakupov. I find it hard to believe Yakupov isn't worth more than a third round pick in 2016 for a team that was starving for offense at the time. It's quite possible that Shero preferred the flexibility an extra third round pick offered him

There had to be a reason Shero did not want Yakupov. I believe he was again offered for the third round pick Shero traded to Pittsburgh for Bennett. If Shero had his eyes set on Hall all along, then he is an absolute wizard, but I doubt he could've expected that formulating like it did.

You raise some good points, especially the last paragraph is intriguing to me, where you suggest Shero may not have wanted Yakupov for a reason. We know that the Devils had scouts watching Oilers games, so perhaps the scouts did not like what they saw from Yakupov.

Either way, there are a lot of questions, like you say, which is why I personally believe Shero had a good reason for his decision at trade deadline.

 

[RSeen]

It means that you can believe the rumors about how we could have acquired Yakupov--and disregard the ones that also mention the Oilers GM having a disingenuous habit of upping the price for Yakupov at the last minute, so it's rather convenient to believe that the price for Yakupov would really have just been Gelinas or whatever--but at the end of the day, we didn't. The reality is we don't have Yakupov, and since Shero is actually good at trading, I think he has a reason why the trade didn't happen--either because the trade would have been too expensive or because it would have negatively impacted his long-term negotiations with the Oilers (and Shero's comments after the Hall trade make it clear to me that he was in long-term discussions with the Oilers throughout last season)--and so I base my opinion on that rather than click bait rumors. Whether or not you are upset doesn't change the reality that we have no Yakupov. You can come up with whatever explanation you like to deal with that reality. I have mine. You have yours that is grounded in connect-the-dots rumors. That's fine. Whatever makes sense to you.

I believe Friedman had it in once of his 30 thoughts articles, so yeah he is about as reliable as you can get, so maybe don't assume the source is clickbait or poor before you go ranting.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

I believe Friedman had it in once of his 30 thoughts articles, so yeah he is about as reliable as you can get, so maybe don't assume the source is clickbait or poor before you go ranting.

I don't believe everything Friedman reports, sorry. I trust Shero over Friedman. Shero had a reason for what he did.

 

[Zippy316]

Kings are in a real goalie crisis. I wonder if there's a trade there for Shero?

For what?

The most we'd be able to get for a guy like Kinkaid/Wedgewood would be a depth forward, a mid-round pick, or probably a tweener forward ala Sislo. I don't think the Kings would be willing to give up enough value for either one of our goalies. Kinkaid and Wedgewood are not that much different than just running with Budaj at this point.

From a Devils perspective, after Kinkaid/Wedgwood, we have a 21 year old goalie who spent the majority of last year in the ECHL and a 19 year old rookie yet to play a pro game. It would be very risky to run with those two for the entire year in Albany; Wedgewood is a nice insulator in that regard being the veteran goalie in Albany.

The best we would get is a guy like Jordan Nolan for Kinkaid or at the most a third round pick. Kings aren't really in a position to be giving away depth players or picks right now either.

 

[Zippy316]

I don't believe everything Friedman reports, sorry.

It depends how he words it.

I don't believe everything he says, but I do believe that his perspective on some of the rumors/speculation has a very strong base behind it.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

It depends how he words it.

I don't believe everything he says, but I do believe that his perspective on some of the rumors/speculation has a very strong base behind it.

Unless he's hacking phones, I doubt he knows the exact deals that are being offered.

 

[Triumph]

Yakupov for Gelinas came out of the Edmonton media, and Edmonton leaks stuff to the press all the time. Mark Spector has also reported that deal as almost happening. My guess is that the Devils were about to do it and then backed out when they got DSP offered for Matteau. Makes little sense to get both guys.

 

[Zippy316]

Unless he's hacking phones, I doubt he knows the exact deals that are being offered.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/30-thought-ducks-lindholm-oilers-leafs-100-flames-gaudreau/

Just read his articles. A lot of it is speculation, but I doubt he would put out actual numbers, as he did about Lindholm, if he didn't have a reliable source to do so.

A lot of it is who you know and what they will tell you and the rest of it is likely putting some pieces together and speculating. But you can usually tell the former from the latter when he posts stuff.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/30-thought-ducks-lindholm-oilers-leafs-100-flames-gaudreau/

Just read his articles. A lot of it is speculation, but I doubt he would put out actual numbers, as he did about Lindholm, if he didn't have a reliable source to do so.

A lot of it is who you know and what they will tell you and the rest of it is likely putting some pieces together and speculating. But you can usually tell the former from the latter when he posts stuff.

Where's his article about Yakupov? When I Google search "Yakupov," "Devils," and "Friedman," it doesn't come up. I'd wonder if his source would be an Oilers executive--who probably wouldn't mention trying to drive up price at last minute, which might very well have happened, since reports suggested that was a factor on draft day--or with the Devils. I doubt he's making stuff up, but his source probably has an agenda. Explanations about why something didn't happen are hard to verify.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

http://news.nationalpost.com/sports...lers-forward-nail-yakupovs-trade-value-so-low

We keep forgetting that the Oilers will almost surely trade Yakupov at the draft, and here’s what was proposed at the trade deadline: Yak to New Jersey for their No. 7 D-man Eric Gelinas. Gelinas was subsequently traded to Colorado for a third-round draft pick. Yak’s a good kid, works hard. Is that all he’s worth?

 

[Zippy316]

Where's his article about Yakupov? When I Google search "Yakupov," "Devils," and "Friedman," it doesn't come up. I'd wonder if his source would be an Oilers executive--who probably wouldn't mention trying to drive up price at last minute, which might very well have happened, since reports suggested that was a factor on draft day--or with the Devils. I doubt he's making stuff up, but his source probably has an agenda. Explanations about why something didn't happen are hard to verify.

I'm not really sure where this argument started about Yakupov, so I'm not going to comment on that.

I'm just saying with regards to Friedmann, I wouldn't dismiss him as just posting clickbait articles. While it's inevitable some people may have different agendas when they release information to him, he usually shows a fine line between reporting the facts and reporting the speculation.

Granted sometimes that speculation gets spun as facts, but that's not his fault -- namely when he said that there were NHL executives that think that Lou would love to have Zajac on the Leafs.

 

[ForeverJerseyGirl]

I'm not really sure where this argument started about Yakupov, so I'm not going to comment on that.

I'm just saying with regards to Friedmann, I wouldn't dismiss him as just posting clickbait articles. While it's inevitable some people may have different agendas when they release information to him, he usually shows a fine line between reporting the facts and reporting the speculation.

Granted sometimes that speculation gets spun as facts, but that's not his fault -- namely when he said that there were NHL executives that think that Lou would love to have Zajac on the Leafs.

You might be right about Friedman. I don't read too many speculative articles or rumors, because so rarely do the things mentioned in those articles come to pass. However I do think the burden of proof should be on those believing the rumors rather than those questioning them, but, as I also said, proof is hard to come by when you are talking about why something didn't happen. All I'm really suggesting is that Shero probably made a better informed decision with regard to the Yakupov trade than any of us around here (including myself) know.