Decision on Blashill coming up?

[RedWingzz]

Every day that goes by without an announcement makes it more likely that he's back. It seems inevitable at this point, just make the decision so we can all move on. Bringing Blashill back every yer now is reminding me of the Danny Cleary saga. A guy who has stayed far beyond his welcome, that keeps being brought back.

Ridiculous in my opinion that he's gonna be back after 5 losing seasons. Move on, get a new voice. I'd like to see a system where players aren't punoshed for taking chances offensively, but I guess I have to keep dreaming. Get ready for another season of 3-2 and 2-1 losses, with a couple 2-1 and 3-1 wins sprinkled in.

Of course, I haven't heard anything, and this is purely me speculating, but I would bet a lot of money that he's back next year.

 

[Hen Kolland]

Okay, thanks for the response.

I don't agree on this point:

Blashill knew the predicament he was taking on when he was offered the job with the Wings and he agreed to it. So, if you accept that premise, what were our expectations of him at that point?

Well, not necessarily winning, but I think ideally we wanted more than a stopgap. And I think Jeff can be a good coach in certain situations, but I think we learned that he wasn't the kind of coach who could have a lot of success in a rebuild at this level. And that's exactly what we needed him to be when he signed the contract. -That was what would decide whether he was really successful here, not whether he could come into a bad situation and just kinda tread water.

I don't want to put words in your moth, but it seems like you're kinda saying the situation was bad and that's more or less the whole story on him as an NHL coach. I think we both agree that the situation was bad. What I'm saying is we needed a guy who can make the best of a bad situation and he was not that person.

For me, he has to optimize the situation, he has to own it and make it into something good in some way, not just point to the fact of the team sucking and say I can't do anything with this mess. For me the terms of success are that he needs to be able to do something with this mess.

I think when you reach a point where you have to trade away pieces of the rebuild, like Mantha, rather than are able to turn those pieces into big successes by having them reach their full potential, then it's time to reassess.

Part of it could be that he was learning extemporaneously and maybe he'll do better in the future elsewhere. But I think when you hear the cliche "We just needed a fresh face," it has something to do with the "face" in question. Why do we need a fresh face? What do we need that isn't happening? Etc.

I understand where you are coming from, but I think the question is what is achievable in this bad situation? I obviously don't think he is taking the defeatist attitude and throwing his hands up like "I can't do anything with this."

As it relates to Mantha, how much of that is the fault of Blashill vs. management's ability to deliver decent players? Look at the past decade's "relevant" drafted players who played some games with Detroit. Honestly, we overachieved draft position with Larkin, Bertuzzi, and Hronek. Overachieved with Mantha and Athanasiou as well, but they are no longer here.

2010: Sheahan, Pulkkinen, Mrazek
2011: Jurco, Ouellet, Sproul, Marchenko
2012: Frk, Athanasiou
2013: Mantha, Bertuzzi
2014: Larkin, Ehn
2015: Svechnikov
2016: Cholowski, Smith, Hronek
2017: Rasmussen, Lindstrom
2018: Zadina, soon Veleno, Berggren, maybe McIsaac
2019: soon Seider, maybe Johansson
2020: soon Raymond

We tried to transition from Datsyuk and Zetterberg to Nyquist and Tatar. Can't replace some of your all time greats with generic top 6 wingers. And if you do try to do that, you can't swing and miss or give away your top picks for the next 3 years. There was nothing to support Nyquist and Tatar, and then there was nothing to support Mantha Bert and Larkin. You escape the bottom by either getting lucky in the lottery and getting a franchise altering player, or you need to hit on multiple quality NHL players in every single draft. Year after year after year. We can't afford a misstep right now because we still haven't hit a franchise altering player. Even a team like Vancouver is proving that finding your diamond in the rough like Pettersson isn't worth shit if you fail repeatedly to keep getting more and more talent. You can't have a drafting track record that looks like what I posted above and call that a rebuild.

I think Blashill has done "something" with this job, and that is been the lightning rod for criticism from fans that can't fully comprehend what a nasty rebuild looks like. This is what a failure to manage the team for the long term looks like. He might not get the nod moving forward out of the rebuild, but he absolutely endured the shittiest possible part of the life cycle of an organization. His name goes on the ledger as the coach who ended the playoff streak. His name is associated with all time levels of futility, and much of it is nothing that he had a snowball's chance in hell to prevent from happening. It was the unstoppable force vs. the most easily moved object.

 

[SirKillalot]

After the first 10 games, the team played almost .500 hockey for the rest of the season. How much better does people expect a coach is supposed to get out of the current roster (which btw is as it is because of tactical reasons, a part of the Yzerplan).

Problem is too many fans are rosy red romantic in how Red Wings were before and compare it with that.
I would rather be here than be a bubble team bouncing out 1-4 in the 1st round of the playoffs.

 

[Ricelund]

I've heard some pretty big praise for Blashill from Yzerman, McCarty, Draper, Osgood, etc. in relatively candid contexts. I really couldn't care less what the fanbase thinks of him. We have no idea how the guys in the room feel about him and that's what matters.

The same Wings bloggers/podcasters who were saying "OMG you could've traded down!" when Yzerman picked Seider are Blashill's most vocal critics.

 

[DetroitRed]

I understand where you are coming from, but I think the question is what is achievable in this bad situation? I obviously don't think he is taking the defeatist attitude and throwing his hands up like "I can't do anything with this."

As it relates to Mantha, how much of that is the fault of Blashill vs. management's ability to deliver decent players? Look at the past decade's "relevant" drafted players who played some games with Detroit. Honestly, we overachieved draft position with Larkin, Bertuzzi, and Hronek. Overachieved with Mantha and Athanasiou as well, but they are no longer here.

2010: Sheahan, Pulkkinen, Mrazek
2011: Jurco, Ouellet, Sproul, Marchenko
2012: Frk, Athanasiou
2013: Mantha, Bertuzzi
2014: Larkin, Ehn
2015: Svechnikov
2016: Cholowski, Smith, Hronek
2017: Rasmussen, Lindstrom
2018: Zadina, soon Veleno, Berggren, maybe McIsaac
2019: soon Seider, maybe Johansson
2020: soon Raymond

We tried to transition from Datsyuk and Zetterberg to Nyquist and Tatar. Can't replace some of your all time greats with generic top 6 wingers. And if you do try to do that, you can't swing and miss or give away your top picks for the next 3 years. There was nothing to support Nyquist and Tatar, and then there was nothing to support Mantha Bert and Larkin. You escape the bottom by either getting lucky in the lottery and getting a franchise altering player, or you need to hit on multiple quality NHL players in every single draft. Year after year after year. We can't afford a misstep right now because we still haven't hit a franchise altering player. Even a team like Vancouver is proving that finding your diamond in the rough like Pettersson isn't worth shit if you fail repeatedly to keep getting more and more talent. You can't have a drafting track record that looks like what I posted above and call that a rebuild.

I think Blashill has done "something" with this job, and that is been the lightning rod for criticism from fans that can't fully comprehend what a nasty rebuild looks like. This is what a failure to manage the team for the long term looks like. He might not get the nod moving forward out of the rebuild, but he absolutely endured the shittiest possible part of the life cycle of an organization. His name goes on the ledger as the coach who ended the playoff streak. His name is associated with all time levels of futility, and much of it is nothing that he had a snowball's chance in hell to prevent from happening. It was the unstoppable force vs. the most easily moved object.

He isn't just throwing his hands up, that's not what I meant to convey, but I think you are doing that for him if you're saying that the situation for Jeff was so bad that not much can really be expected of him.

Actually, when I see Blash talking about the prospect of returning, it's like he's trying to find silver linings, not throwing his hands up, but I don't see where any of the things he lists are really a result of his coaching. For example, he recently mentioned the team finished better this year than last. Well, it was a given that they would improve a little over last season because they got some goaltending. We all said they would get more points.

Hronek always was the sort of player that he is and I like him, but he's standing out so much now in part because other guys on the team are not doing very well. Bertuzzi aside, but Tyler is a human wrecking ball who is going to play his ass of in any situation and no coach good or bad is going to change that. Larkin is having issues even after becoming captain, but remember Larkin came into the league a stud just automatically.

We agree the team is bad and we agree it would be nice to turn it around. So, whether Jeff was just a stopgap or whether we hired him to turn it around, it's just time to try someone else and enter a new phase. That's my opinion. The other thing I basically said somewhere in some post above is that Yzerman is probably going to want to put his own coach in there rather than live in the world that Ken Holland built. I don't think Stevie will be content to live or die according to what Ken has in place and not arbitrarily, but because we probably can improve in the coaching department.

 

[OgeeOgelthorpe]

After the first 10 games, the team played almost .500 hockey for the rest of the season. How much better does people expect a coach is supposed to get out of the current roster (which btw is as it is because of tactical reasons, a part of the Yzerplan).

Problem is too many fans are rosy red romantic in how Red Wings were before and compare it with that.
I would rather be here than be a bubble team bouncing out 1-4 in the 1st round of the playoffs.

You don't go from historically bad to true Stanley Cup contender overnight most of the time. We're going to hit a phase where we are a bubble team. We might even hit that phase next year if Veleno, Seider, Berggren and Zadina start to be impact players.

 

[Roomba With a Bauer]

If it wasn't for the fact that the Wings have a chance at a transformational off-season, I would be fine with keeping Blashill.

The Wings have a huge cap advantage, shit tons of draft picks, and good, respected prospects coming in. Because of the pandemic and cap crunch lots of players are going to hit free agency who normally wouldnt. Passing up on all of that would be willful malpractice and keeping Blashill would be a sign to me that this team is not serious about building or fielding a winning roster, and a sure sign that Chris Ilitch is the second coming of "Dollar Bill" Wirtz, running a storied franchise into the ground.

I could see Chris Ilitch holding onto the team and running it like shit simply for the amount of good will the history buys him with the city.

 

[Hoog]

I really think Steve did himself a disservice by saying he would evaluate Blash quickly. It put unneeded pressure or I guess media scrutiny on him to make a decision. I actually think he is playing his hand out to see what happens as playoff teams exit. Maybe a good coach gets released by an impatient owner? Maybe someone out of the blue becomes available to him that he didn't plan on? I think he should wait until something like this happens or June 30th, when he HAS to make the call. Doesn't hurt to wait but what he said has people very impatient right now.

 

[drw02]

Every day that goes by without an announcement makes it more likely that he's back. It seems inevitable at this point, just make the decision so we can all move on. Bringing Blashill back every yer now is reminding me of the Danny Cleary saga. A guy who has stayed far beyond his welcome, that keeps being brought back.

Ridiculous in my opinion that he's gonna be back after 5 losing seasons. Move on, get a new voice. I'd like to see a system where players aren't punoshed for taking chances offensively, but I guess I have to keep dreaming. Get ready for another season of 3-2 and 2-1 losses, with a couple 2-1 and 3-1 wins sprinkled in.

Of course, I haven't heard anything, and this is purely me speculating, but I would bet a lot of money that he's back next year.

I figured it was the opposite. The longer it goes on the more I think they're pondering a change. Maybe at least want to wait to reach out and gauge the interest of some coaches they like who they can't talk to yet. Feel like if they really wanted him back why wouldn't it be done already? Not like Blashill has any other NHL jobs to consider.

 

[RedWingzz]

After the first 10 games, the team played almost .500 hockey for the rest of the season. How much better does people expect a coach is supposed to get out of the current roster (which btw is as it is because of tactical reasons, a part of the Yzerplan).

Problem is too many fans are rosy red romantic in how Red Wings were before and compare it with that.
I would rather be here than be a bubble team bouncing out 1-4 in the 1st round of the playoffs.

I can only speak for myself, but I just want to watch a more exciting brand of hockey for the time being. Wether we play with Blashill's current system, where the focus is on defensive responsibility and limiting offensive risks, or we hire a new coach with a new system, we are still nowhere near a playoff team yet.

I would rather watch exciting 4-3 games, maybe win some games 4-2 and 4-3, as opposed to trying to shut the door defensively, only to lose 2-1 or 3-1. I am ready to see some goals. It's been too many years of bland/boring hockey.

Also, why not make a change? Don't you think a new voice behind the bench would be a breath of fresh air for some of these guys? I get what Blashill tries to do, and sure he has made a few of our players become more complete players..BUT we didn't draft Zadina to be a defensive specialist...

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

Just to toss my two cents in this thread, Blashill strikes me as a bright guy and a solid dude, and I think there are clearly worse coaches out there. At the same time, there are also pretty clearly better coaches out there.

Are we in a position to attract a better coach right now? Maybe not. But if Blashill is back, which I presume he is at this point, I need to start seeing signs of what a competitive team under Blashill would look like. I understand that the philosophy this year was essentially to trap teams out and avoid blowouts, and I think he was mostly successful in that goal. But at the same time, the point totals from our top players were really troubling. The powerplay was, frankly, disgraceful. I know we don't have the best players in the NHL, and I know that special teams are usually delegated to assistant coaches, but ultimately I think Blashill has to shoulder some responsibility for that as well.

I think the "bad roster" excuse has certainly been true for most of his tenure, but at the same time plenty of coaches have been let go with the same excuse. As Yzerman continues to add competent FAs and ease in good prospects, I do need to see growth from Blashill. I don't mind competitive, two-way hockey. Frankly, when you look at our core pieces, like Larkin and Seider, it makes sense that we'd prioritize physicality and defense over some expansive, free-flowing system. But if Blashill comes back I think he has to find a way to start incrementally improving the offense and powerplay without leaking a ton of goals. I don't think that's an insane ask for one of the longest tenured coaches in the league.

 

[RedWingzz]

I figured it was the opposite. The longer it goes on the more I think they're pondering a change. Maybe at least want to wait to reach out and gauge the interest of some coaches they like who they can't talk to yet. Feel like if they really wanted him back why wouldn't it be done already? Not like Blashill has any other NHL jobs to consider.

Yeah but traditionally, teams that make a change at the end of the season don't tend to wait. If Yzerman knows he's going in another direction, what is he waiting for? Surely, he knows what he is gonna do by now, so just do it.

I dunno, I could be wrong, I hope I'm wrong, but I just don't see it. I'm not a Blashill hater either. I respect him as a man, seems like a real nice person, who really does want the best for the players. Unfortunately, I don't think he's a great coach at the NHL level.

 

[Frk It]

Just to toss my two cents in this thread, Blashill strikes me as a bright guy and a solid dude, and I think there are clearly worse coaches out there. At the same time, there are also pretty clearly better coaches out there.

Are we in a position to attract a better coach right now? Maybe not. But if Blashill is back, which I presume he is at this point, I need to start seeing signs of what a competitive team under Blashill would look like. I understand that the philosophy this year was essentially to trap teams out and avoid blowouts, and I think he was mostly successful in that goal. But at the same time, the point totals from our top players were really troubling. The powerplay was, frankly, disgraceful. I know we don't have the best players in the NHL, and I know that special teams are usually delegated to assistant coaches, but ultimately I think Blashill has to shoulder some responsibility for that as well.

I think the "bad roster" excuse has certainly been true for most of his tenure, but at the same time plenty of coaches have been let go with the same excuse. As Yzerman continues to add competent FAs and ease in good prospects, I do need to see growth from Blashill. I don't mind competitive, two-way hockey. Frankly, when you look at our core pieces, like Larkin and Seider, it makes sense that we'd prioritize physicality and defense over some expansive, free-flowing system. But if Blashill comes back I think he has to find a way to start incrementally improving the offense and powerplay without leaking a ton of goals. I don't think that's an insane ask for one of the longest tenured coaches in the league.

Usually you want to keep continuity when you are good. Weird to me that we would want to keep continuity when we are bad. Usually teams tear everything apart when they are bad, especially when it's sustained badness.

 

[Ed Ned and Leddy]

Usually you want to keep continuity when you are good. Weird to me that we would want to keep continuity when we are bad. Usually teams tear everything apart when they are bad, especially when it's sustained badness.

I mean I don't disagree, my preference would probably be to try someone new and that's been the case since last summer. But I'm viewing it from the perspective that Blashill is most likely going to be here next regardless of my preferences, so I try to set realistic benchmarks for what next year should look like assuming that Blashill is still here.

 

[drw02]

Yeah but traditionally, teams that make a change at the end of the season don't tend to wait. If Yzerman knows he's going in another direction, what is he waiting for? Surely, he knows what he is gonna do by now, so just do it.

I dunno, I could be wrong, I hope I'm wrong, but I just don't see it. I'm not a Blashill hater either. I respect him as a man, seems like a real nice person, who really does want the best for the players. Unfortunately, I don't think he's a great coach at the NHL level.

That's generally true but Yzerman doesn't seem to rush any decisions. I'm sure he has a good idea what he wants to do but wanted to wait and talk to Blash, get his perspective and talk to all the players to see what they think of him. Also classier to not fire a guy right after season ends, like you're blaming him solely for the team not being good.

Agree tho, he seems like a good guy and all but don't think he's the right coach to lead this team into the future

 

[cjeagle]

There are many ways to build a team from scratch.

The Vegas Golden Knights showed that you could build a competitive successful team fairly quickly with the right coaches, staff and players in place.

They have made the playoffs since they started 4 years ago most of them under former Redwing Gerald Gallant.

We could just keep on meandering by with Blashill who managed to keep his team out of the playoffs for 6 straight years or start anew with someone like Gallant which coached a team built from expansion leftovers and draft picks and led them to the Stanley Cup final.

We shouldn't be blinded by the fact that the Redwings better record this year was built mostly on the shoulders of both our goaltenders without which Blashill would have looked the inept coach he has been the past 6 years.

Steve could use the budget he has to add a few skilled players to the young promising core they already have in place. They just need a winning coach with a proven NHL track record to develop a competitive team.

 

[Hen Kolland]

There are many ways to build a team from scratch.

The Vegas Golden Knights showed that you could build a competitive successful team fairly quickly with the right coaches, staff and players in place.

They have made the playoffs since they started 4 years ago most of them under former Redwing Gerald Gallant.

We could just keep on meandering by with Blashill who managed to keep his team out of the playoffs for 6 straight years or start anew with someone like Gallant which coached a team built from expansion leftovers and draft picks and led them to the Stanley Cup final.

We shouldn't be blinded by the fact that the Redwings better record this year was built mostly on the shoulders of both our goaltenders without which Blashill would have looked the inept coach he has been the past 6 years.

Steve could use the budget he has to add a few skilled players to the young promising core they already have in place. They just need a winning coach with a proven NHL track record to develop a competitive team.

If only the Red Wings could hit the reset button and just get rid of all the players they have and start over new. Then they could just win. It should be that easy considering the example you are trying to use.

 

[better Red than Dead]

I've heard some pretty big praise for Blashill from Yzerman, McCarty, Draper, Osgood, etc. in relatively candid contexts. I really couldn't care less what the fanbase thinks of him. We have no idea how the guys in the room feel about him and that's what matters.

The same Wings bloggers/podcasters who were saying "OMG you could've traded down!" when Yzerman picked Seider are Blashill's most vocal critics.

Agreed! Blashill is well respected around the league and he has not lost the locker room which is important.

 

[better Red than Dead]

seriously though he's probably planning on bringing him back but holding out hope that Cooper gets let go if Tampa gets swept in the first round or something

dudes as bad as Holland with the Coach crushes

I wish there was an “unlike” button I could use for this post. Yzerman has shown that he takes emotion out of any decision he makes, unlike Holland, ask Lecavalier or St Louis if Yzerman is sentimental.

 

[Rzombo4 prez]

There are many ways to build a team from scratch.

The Vegas Golden Knights showed that you could build a competitive successful team fairly quickly with the right coaches, staff and players in place.

They have made the playoffs since they started 4 years ago most of them under former Redwing Gerald Gallant.

We could just keep on meandering by with Blashill who managed to keep his team out of the playoffs for 6 straight years or start anew with someone like Gallant which coached a team built from expansion leftovers and draft picks to the Stanley Cup final.

Steve could use the budget he has to add a few skilled players to the young promising core they already have in place. They just need a winning coach to develop a competitive team.

Sadly, that roster of expansion draft leftovers is exponentially more talented than the trash we run out every night. Personally, I think it is time to move on from Blashill. I know that Yzerman really likes him, and I know that he wants to project that he is a manager with realistic expectations, but he has had the job long enough and a new voice is a reasonable ask at this point. He hasn't been awful or great, just somewhere in the middle. Coaches don't exactly motivate players at the professional level, but they are directly responsible for the working environment and making the rink a fun place to come to every day. I think a new voice goes a long way in that regard and with the rebuild getting longer in the tooth, I think this is very important.

That said, I do not expect our next coach to have materially different results for the next two or three seasons. We aren't getting out of the bottom without an influx of talent. Players play hockey, not coaches. I also think that our next coach will do many of the things that Blash does that people bitch about on a nightly basis. We will continue to play very defensive hockey until we have the talent to press the pace from the backend on a more consistent basis. Our next coach is also likely to stress the need for young players to be defensively accountable and will emphasize 200ft hockey over pseudo-offense. People bitch about this, but this is what actual player development looks like in the NHL.

Anyways, it is time for a change, but not necessarily for the reasons that most think. If we hired Gallant tomorrow (which we won't) we will still suck and will still be at the bottom of the standings next year.

Blash will get another NHL coaching job in the future if he wants it. Everyone around the league knows how bad his rosters have been over the last couple of years.

 

[MBH]

I've heard some pretty big praise for Blashill from Yzerman, McCarty, Draper, Osgood, etc. in relatively candid contexts. I really couldn't care less what the fanbase thinks of him. We have no idea how the guys in the room feel about him and that's what matters.

The same Wings bloggers/podcasters who were saying "OMG you could've traded down!" when Yzerman picked Seider are Blashill's most vocal critics.

LOL.
McCarty? Douchebag who's stoned more often than not.
Osgood? He's a paid shill.
Draper? Paid by the Red Wings.

Your "appeal to authority" fallacy is just more of the same hometown logic that's plagued this organization for more than a decade now, that plagues virtually all sports fan communities.

 

[MBH]

Agreed! Blashill is well respected around the league and he has not lost the locker room which is important.

He has not lost the locker room?
Who is there to lose?

Did he lose Mantha this year?
What about Larkin?

 

[Winger98]

After the first 10 games, the team played almost .500 hockey for the rest of the season. How much better does people expect a coach is supposed to get out of the current roster (which btw is as it is because of tactical reasons, a part of the Yzerplan).

Problem is too many fans are rosy red romantic in how Red Wings were before and compare it with that.
I would rather be here than be a bubble team bouncing out 1-4 in the 1st round of the playoffs.

And folks have been unhappy because it's "boring" (and netting us points we wouldn't get playing exciting hockey while getting thumped 6-2).

I think there is more to be upbeat about Blashill now than last off-season. Until this season he didn't show the ability to change his system to fit his players, instead trying to shoehorn them into that "exciting" system that people prefer but with disastrous results. Now, as Blashill (hopefully) gets more talent can he blend the styles a bit, keeping these guys defensively responsible and organized while also putting them into positions to transfer to the other end of the ice and press the attack? I don't know, but hopefully.

 

[MBH]

If Blashill returns this year, he'll be one of 3 coaches in NHL history to return for a 6th season after missing the playoffs for five straight years.

Frank Boucher, who coached the Rangers to the Cup in 1940, missed the playoffs five straight years during World War II and the 40s, and kept his job.
Boucher made the playoffs in that sixth year.

Barry Trotz missed the playoffs with Nashville in their first five years after expansion. He made the playoffs in Year 6.


In terms of the Red Wings, they've never had a coach miss the playoffs three years in a row before Blashill.

 

[MBH]

And folks have been unhappy because it's "boring" (and netting us points we wouldn't get playing exciting hockey while getting thumped 6-2).

I think there is more to be upbeat about Blashill now than last off-season. Until this season he didn't show the ability to change his system to fit his players, instead trying to shoehorn them into that "exciting" system that people prefer but with disastrous results. Now, as Blashill (hopefully) gets more talent can he blend the styles a bit, keeping these guys defensively responsible and organized while also putting them into positions to transfer to the other end of the ice and press the attack? I don't know, but hopefully.

Blashill hasn't changed anything.
The Red Wings upgraded on Howard.
This was the second-worst season of Blashill's disgraceful tenure.
Let's throw a party for him.