Dahlin what?

[hizzoner]

There has to be a trade off between the risk of injury or some career damaging event or severe economic downturn/playing in your comfort zone with players you know and hopefully like/a figure that maintains your status in the hockey community/that will set you and your family up for life. 8 x 10.5 to 11 does all that. The Sabres want cost certainty at a level they can afford and which fits their overall cap. That fits too. So get on with it...

 

[sabremike]

You cannot just give Dahlin whatever he wants. You just signed Tage, Cozens, and Sammy to team friendly long term commitment to winning contracts. They created room to ensure money available to keep talent level high and win. If you now let Dahlin bend you over and give him all the extra created by Tage ,Sammy, and Cozens, you have a lockeroom problem.

Yes, all those high character guys who desperately want to win are going to toss their toys out of the pram if Dahlin gets paid.

 

[Bendium]

You wanted to trade hi, many times not so long ago and that’s a fact. Or have you already forgotten?

Whatever he wants within reason. Yes, Adams has no choice and he will give Dahlin everything he wants, you’ll see for yourself soon. I doubt that it will be 14-15 million for 4 years, but we will see.

My attacks are justified, since you have always been biased towards Dahlin, you do not even notice the facts that I say. You may not even consider Dahlin a top 10 NHL defenseman, even though statistics say he is a top 3 NHL defenseman.

Hypocritical people like you just infuriate me, I guess we can stop there.

First point. Agreed, there have been times where I said I would trade him for the right return. Hell, I said it in this thread, that if he went to RFA next year and got a 14 AAV offer sheet (another posters premise), I would take the four first round picks and the cap space. No doubt. That doesn't mean I am advocating shopping him. If he will only sign for 14 AAV? Then I am shopping him. If he wants a 4 year contract? Covering his remaining control years? Then I offer you 8.5 AAV, and likely trade him in the last year of it for a boatload.

Second point. Its hard to say, "whatever he wants" and also "within reason" in the same sentence. Which is it? I don't believe you should break the team cap over one player. Its too high a risk. I would rather spread the money out across the lineup to have a greater average level of talent on the ice.

Third point. Attacking people on a message board, especially ones that were not even addressing or quoting you is just plain not justifiable. Debate the post all you want, but attacking people for having an opinion different than yours is bully behavior, and the poorest use of the right to free speech some of us fought for you to have.

 

[Havok89]

Dahlin seemingly taking the Austin Matthews route of extracting as much money as possible?

 

[ZemgusWho]

Dahlin seemingly taking the Austin Matthews route of extracting as much money as possible?

Why so much hate for Auston Matthews making the most of his short career. Do you want to be locked into your current salary for 8 years, while inflation rages on and your company’s revenue steadily rises?

There’s got to be some middle ground where a guy can invest in himself and not be a villain for not eagerly jumping at 8 years at 75% of their actual value.

Guys like Thompson and their constant appearance on best value lists (and message boards where we gush about what a great contract it is) are exactly why Dahlin and Matthews are saying “nope”

 

[valet]

Dahlin seemingly taking the Austin Matthews route of extracting as much money as possible?

i mean, if you were getting paid less then you knew you were worth, don't you think it would bleed out into other aspects of your life? his contract isn't going to be cheap, but it will be justified. we don't need to lowball guys, especially guys like dahlin.

 

[SabresFan26]

I probably have Dahlin in the Top 5 or 6 defenseman now with potential to be the top defenseman.

Cale Makar
6 Years 9 million per

Erik Karlsson
8 years 11.5 million per

Quinn Hughes
6 years 7.85 million per

Victor Hedman
8 year 7.85 million per

Mikahil Sergachev
8 years 8.5 million per

Dougie Hamilton
7 Years 9 million per

Roman Josi
8 Years 9.059 million per

Charlie McAvoy
8 years 9.5 million per

Adam Fox
7 years 9.5 million per

Seth Jones
8 years 9.5 million per

Zach Werenski
6 years 9.583 million per

Miro Heiskanen
8 years 8.45 million per



I think 7-8 years 10.5 million is more than fair for both Buffalo and Dahlin.

 

[beerme1]

I take the 4 1st round picks AND the cap space. I would rather have two 7 AAV top 4 defenseman than one 14 AAV Dahlin, so the 4 1st's is golden gravy on top.

This is because of Thomas Vanek. At the end of the day they should have taken the four firsts.
Pretty hard to stomach though considering all that happened to the team leading up to that point. There would have been mutiny by the fans and remaining players if they took the four firsts.
From Stanley Cup contenders to forever has beens overnight. Oh and ticket prices need to go up.
Good luck selling that.
With the cap expected to grow and me expecting still much more growth from Dahlin, I'm keeping him.

I probably have Dahlin in the Top 5 or 6 defenseman now with potential to be the top defenseman.

Cale Makar
6 Years 9 million per

Erik Karlsson
8 years 11.5 million per

Quinn Hughes
6 years 7.85 million per

Victor Hedman
8 year 7.85 million per

Mikahil Sergachev
8 years 8.5 million per

Dougie Hamilton
7 Years 9 million per

Roman Josi
8 Years 9.059 million per

Charlie McAvoy
8 years 9.5 million per

Adam Fox
7 years 9.5 million per

Seth Jones
8 years 9.5 million per

Zach Werenski
6 years 9.583 million per

Miro Heiskanen
8 years 8.45 million per



I think 7-8 years 10.5 million is more than fair for both Buffalo and Dahlin.

I think all of those contracts are completely misrepresented if you were looking to sign them today. Their deals are done so you can't use them as comparisons. The thing that scares me most is what if NHL revenue doesn't grow. Then what?
I'm willing to go to the mat with Dahlin if it is required. 8 x 13 million. He is part of Sabres lore forever. Of course I would love 8 x 10.5 or 11 but I'm not losing this player over 2 million per year on a long term deal. No sir.

 

[toddkaz]

Why so much hate for Auston Matthews making the most of his short career. Do you want to be locked into your current salary for 8 years, while inflation rages on and your company’s revenue steadily rises?

There’s got to be some middle ground where a guy can invest in himself and not be a villain for not eagerly jumping at 8 years at 75% of their actual value.

Guys like Thompson and their constant appearance on best value lists (and message boards where we gush about what a great contract it is) are exactly why Dahlin and Matthews are saying “nope”

I cant believe you mention inflation when we are talking about people making 50-100 million off a career. You really think it makes a difference if Matthews pays 2.99 for eggs or 3.99 for eggs?

 

[dortt]

I cant believe you mention inflation when we are talking about people making 50-100 million of a career. You really think it makes a difference if Matthews pays 2.99 for eggs or 3.99 for eggs?

nah, for them, its the difference between paying 50K per year in property tax vs 65K per year

 

[toddkaz]

nah, for them, its the difference between paying 50K per year in property tax vs 65K per year

And then selling their house for double what they paid

 

[Deep Blue Metallic]

Yes, all those high character guys who desperately want to win are going to toss their toys out of the pram if Dahlin gets paid.

"locker room problem" is probably overstating the case, but I can imagine Dahlin extracting every dollar possible would sour some of his teammates a bit.

Surely there's a number where a core teammate asks himself "does this guy want to win with us or just get paid?"

Let's hope he settles this side of that number.

 

[Moncton man]

Not sure why people think players shouldn't get the best contract they are worth and why discounts are expected. He is one of the top players in the league pay him like one.
And sorry no we shouldn't be pointing to $XXX dollars set players up for life. The players are the reason people show up to the games. These are the top people at their profession, so no the money isn't insane, they are being paid what they are worth.
And in terms of the other major sports, the money hockey players make is essentially peanuts in comparison.

 

[Aladyyn]

It's the front office's job to care about the cap and building the roster under its constraints, not the players'.

 

[toddkaz]

Its a bit disappointing he hasn't signed.

Not sure why people think players shouldn't get the best contract they are worth and why discounts are expected. He is one of the top players in the league pay him like one.
And sorry no we shouldn't be pointing to $XXX dollars set players up for life. The players are the reason people show up to the games. These are the top people at their profession, so no the money isn't insane, they are being paid what they are worth.
And in terms of the other major sports, the money hockey players make is essentially peanuts in comparison.

Terrible hot take.

No one here is complaining about Dahlin getting millions just point out whats fair market value.

Dahlin isn't the best defenseman in the league according to he peers and he wants the most money. He wasn't even top 3.

 

[Fjordy]

Dahlin isn't the best defenseman in the league according to he peers and he wants the most money. He wasn't even top 3.

He was better than guys like Fox and Makar last season, and that's a statistical fact. He is also younger than them. He's a damn top-three defenseman in the NHL.

 

[HOOats]

It's the front office's job to care about the cap and building the roster under its constraints, not the players'.

And it's the fans' job to care about the front office's work building the roster under cap constraints, in the interest of producing a winning, enjoyable product. It is not the fans' job to care about the players' feelings about their compensation relative to their peers, or the players' purchasing power while they're making more in a week than fans do in a year.

 

[Balthazar]

He was better than guys like Fox and Makar last season, and that's a statistical fact.

Which stats are you referring to?

 

[Duddy]

The difference between Dahlin at 13 or 10 or 11 is not not contending or contending, it's not signing a guy like Jost or keeping 3 goalies or not signing vets for the vibe.

 

[BFLO]

He was better than guys like Fox and Makar last season, and that's a statistical fact. He is also younger than them. He's a damn top-three defenseman in the NHL.

To add some depth to this comment. According to Evolving hockey, Dahlin was the best overall defensemen in the league until he got hurt in February, he then missed a few games and then played injured for about 4-5 weeks and tanked his stats. For the month of March Dahlin had basic stats of 0G 4A and -16 +/- in 14 games played.

Even with that abysmal month of March he still finished the season 7th overall for defensemen. If we take penalties out of the equation Dahlin finished 3rd overall for defensemen.

Fox was 12th overall and 15th overall without penalties
Makar 8th and 19th

 

[Jacob582]

The difference between Dahlin at 13 or 10 or 11 is not not contending or contending, it's not signing a guy like Jost or keeping 3 goalies or not signing vets for the vibe.

No; it's not being able to afford a player like Power, Peterka or Kulich.

 

[MOGlLNY]

I’d be good with 5 at 10-10.5.

 

[Fjordy]

Which stats are you referring to?

Using Hockey Viz’s Model Fox and Karlsson were better at driving offense.

Dahlin was better than Makar on offense.

Dahlin had better defensive metrics than all of them.

 

[Diaspora]

6 years 12 mil

Honestly, the max contract length should be six (or even five) years. It's better for player self-determination, less risk for GMs/owners, makes cap management easier, reduces the temptations for buyouts, cap dumps and rule-flouting shenanigans.

It should be part of the next CBA.

 

[toddkaz]

He was better than guys like Fox and Makar last season, and that's a statistical fact. He is also younger than them. He's a damn top-three defenseman in the NHL.

He wasn't last year or he would have been nominated. You are in entitled to your opinion but I value his peers
He went on a 20 game stretch where he played pretty bad.

If you want to be the best you got to do it for 82 games hence no Norris nomination