News Article: Corey Pronmans: "Farm system rankings" Habs at 6. -The Athletic

[Mrb1p]

I am pretty sure I understand everything just fine. Juulsen will struggle to have an impact at the NHL level and mete won't. Nowhere did I compare their skillsets.

Juulsen doesn't have enough offensive skills to be in the top 4 and defensively he is full of holes too. He was getting walked once or twice every game. He may improve to be a bottom 6 guy, but that's his ceiling IMO. Mete is just has a much bigger positive outcome on the game regardless of the differences in skill sets and no team needs a dman that is an offensive black hole and poor defensively.

Imagine thinking Juulsen doesnt have good offensive skills.

Imagine thinking Juulsen is full of holes defensively.

 

[cphabs]

Did you know all of that in August when I made that post?

I just responded to your post today. Not sure what you posted in August to be honest. In any case, did I expect our drafted prospects to move us up 20 positions in a quality seasonal ranking? No, not at the time of the draft, but here we are. Our prospect pool has incredible potential and credibility.

 

[Kudo Shinichi]

I am pretty sure I understand everything just fine. Juulsen will struggle to have an impact at the NHL level and mete won't. Nowhere did I compare their skillsets.

Juulsen doesn't have enough offensive skills to be in the top 4 and defensively he is full of holes too. He was getting walked once or twice every game. He may improve to be a bottom 6 guy, but that's his ceiling IMO. Mete is just has a much bigger positive outcome on the game regardless of the differences in skill sets and no team needs a dman that is an offensive black hole and poor defensively.

lol

 

[Goldenhands]

I think Juulsen will need to spend a good amount of time in the AHL next year, he has been rushed in the line-up while his game wasnt quite there yet and bad injuries slowed him down... There is nothing wrong to take a step back to come back better....

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Imagine thinking Juulsen doesnt have good offensive skills.

Imagine thinking Juulsen is full of holes defensively.

That's what he is. He'll struggle to be an NHL regular, that's pretty much a guarantee.

 

[montreal]

That's what he is. He'll struggle to be an NHL regular, that's pretty much a guarantee.

there's no way that's a guarantee that he'll struggle to be an NHL regular. He might or he might not, since we don't even know the status of his injuries. If he didn't have these injuries, I highly doubt he would struggle to be an NHL regular as he should be a safe bet to be a solid bottom pairing D. He needs to working on his mobility and skating a bit but they aren't terrible. He should never have been rushed but this management hasn't met a prospect they don't rush.

 

[Guns n Roses]

I think Juulsen will need to spend a good amount of time in the AHL next year, he has been rushed in the line-up while his game wasnt quite there yet and bad injuries slowed him down... There is nothing wrong to take a step back to come back better....

Agreed, give him a full year in the AHL next season with Bouchard.

 

[dackelljuneaubulis02]

Juulsen's puck skills in the NHL are far better than I thought they would be at this age. I think he can be a solid 2nd pairing guy but he's got Weber, Petry and Brook ahead of him right now. Something's gotta give on the right side.

I don't know why people were drooling over him and crapping on Mete. People seem to forget Mete's younger and man can he rush the puck. Mete easily has the higher ceiling. No contest.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

there's no way that's a guarantee that he'll struggle to be an NHL regular. He might or he might not, since we don't even know the status of his injuries. If he didn't have these injuries, I highly doubt he would struggle to be an NHL regular as he should be a safe bet to be a solid bottom pairing D. He needs to working on his mobility and skating a bit but they aren't terrible. He should never have been rushed but this management hasn't met a prospect they don't rush.

Let's revisit this next year or the year after if Juulsen's injuries don't end up derailing his career. He's just a very meh prospect in every single way IMO. His offense is not there, anyone who thinks he has offensive skills that translate to the NHL level pretty much don't know wtf they are watching. This guy isn't good enough to be a top 4 dman, his skating/gap control had him.getting completely walked every single game. Nothing he does is elite or even very good.

I don't like his game at all, a dime a dozen at best.

 

[Mrb1p]

Let's revisit this next year or the year after if Juulsen's injuries don't end up derailing his career. He's just a very meh prospect in every single way IMO. His offense is not there, anyone who thinks he has offensive skills that translate to the NHL level pretty much don't know wtf they are watching. This guy isn't good enough to be a top 4 dman, his skating/gap control had him.getting completely walked every single game. Nothing he does is elite or even very good.

I don't like his game at all, a dime a dozen at best.

Terrible player evaluation. Youre using 20 NHL games played on the second pair by a 21 year old kid.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Terrible player evaluation. Youre using 20 NHL games played on the second pair by a 21 year old kid.

I've seen your evaluations in the past. I think I'll go with mine.

 

[bleuetbio]

Pronman was the one a way of the board than the others in Ylonen's case. I think he had him like in his top 12 on the predraft.

 

[LaP]

Every year. Not just their draft year.

And while I don't agree with Pronman's ranking, at least he's not stat watching, he actually scouts guys.

And the reality is that most top prospects that become top players make the NHL within a year or two of their draft. You have to consider recently drafted players greatly.

And rankings are an inexact science. Its a gauge, not a precision thing.

120% true. But there's a strong persistent myth in Montreal that all great players spent 10 years in the AHL before making the NHL. I call it The Red Wings myth.

 

[Big Lurk]

I've seen your evaluations in the past. I think I'll go with mine.

We want receipts

 

[montreal]

Let's revisit this next year or the year after if Juulsen's injuries don't end up derailing his career. He's just a very meh prospect in every single way IMO. His offense is not there, anyone who thinks he has offensive skills that translate to the NHL level pretty much don't know wtf they are watching. This guy isn't good enough to be a top 4 dman, his skating/gap control had him.getting completely walked every single game. Nothing he does is elite or even very good.

I don't like his game at all, a dime a dozen at best.

I never said he was a top 4, but I do think if he's 100% healthy this year that he ends up a solid bottom pairing D. Now we have to wait and see what impact his injuries have on his game, since we don't even know what's going on with him.

He's got a big shot, he can move the puck, he's never going to be a big point producer but I do think he will be able to chip in here and there. He's very good in his own end and on the PK, smart positionally, good physical game.

Did he get completely walked every single game, I call bull shit and that's with him being rushed, he should never have been in the NHL at 20 and should have spent all this year in Laval as well. This organization drives me nuts with how they rush just about every decent prospect.

 

[tazsub3]

Most the people who decided Noah is not an NHL player, would have thought that max was barely ahl material after his first stint in the NHL . Lol

 

[Mrb1p]

Most the people who decided Noah is not an NHL player, would have thought that max was barely ahl material after his first stint in the NHL . Lol

I remember people telling me the same thing about Pac when I bought a centennial jersey of him.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I never said he was a top 4, but I do think if he's 100% healthy this year that he ends up a solid bottom pairing D. Now we have to wait and see what impact his injuries have on his game, since we don't even know what's going on with him.

He's got a big shot, he can move the puck, he's never going to be a big point producer but I do think he will be able to chip in here and there. He's very good in his own end and on the PK, smart positionally, good physical game.

Did he get completely walked every single game, I call bull **** and that's with him being rushed, he should never have been in the NHL at 20 and should have spent all this year in Laval as well. This organization drives me nuts with how they rush just about every decent prospect.

The whole league is getting younger and rookies and sophomores get a taste all the time. Montreal just needs to be moderate and balanced about it.

Mete was stuck in the NHL last year, but in the end, with his time last year during a lost year, and then getting sent down for a bit this year, I feel Mete has progressed a LOT. Juulsen got his look last year at the end with the injuries, but should have been sent down this year earlier than he actually was. He was being exposed at times, and has things to work on in Laval.

 

[Mrb1p]

Juulsen was a 2nd pair D for the first 30 games of the season and somehow everyone forgets it.

 

[montreal]

The whole league is getting younger and rookies and sophomores get a taste all the time. Montreal just needs to be moderate and balanced about it.

Mete was stuck in the NHL last year, but in the end, with his time last year during a lost year, and then getting sent down for a bit this year, I feel Mete has progressed a LOT. Juulsen got his look last year at the end with the injuries, but should have been sent down this year earlier than he actually was. He was being exposed at times, and has things to work on in Laval.

it's one thing to get younger and another to put kids that aren't ready in the NHL. Juulsen while he played well in Laval at the start had terrible offensive production. He had pts in something like 2 of his first 26 games which is just brutal. Then in his last 5 he picks up 4 pts or so, so of course the Habs call him up just as he was starting to string together a few games of production. They do this a lot and it drives me crazy. Why not give him at least a month or two to see if he can build off that? At the end of the day I just can't get behind what this organization believes in for development. The results clearly don't favor them either.

Mete and Juulsen should never have been in the NHL last year. The question is what impact would it have on Mete if he played all last year in the OHL, then all year in Laval under what appears to be a much better coach. But he has physical limitations so perhaps it his case it wouldn't have mattered. At least in the case of DLR, I felt that things could have gone a little different had he stayed in the SHL or went to the OHL at 19, then spend 3 years in the AHL but now we'll never know.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Juulsen was a 2nd pair D for the first 30 games of the season and somehow everyone forgets it.

Sure he was lolol.

 

[BaseballCoach]

it's one thing to get younger and another to put kids that aren't ready in the NHL. Juulsen while he played well in Laval at the start had terrible offensive production. He had pts in something like 2 of his first 26 games which is just brutal. Then in his last 5 he picks up 4 pts or so, so of course the Habs call him up just as he was starting to string together a few games of production. They do this a lot and it drives me crazy. Why not give him at least a month or two to see if he can build off that? At the end of the day I just can't get behind what this organization believes in for development. The results clearly don't favor them either.

Mete and Juulsen should never have been in the NHL last year. The question is what impact would it have on Mete if he played all last year in the OHL, then all year in Laval under what appears to be a much better coach. But he has physical limitations so perhaps it his case it wouldn't have mattered. At least in the case of DLR, I felt that things could have gone a little different had he stayed in the SHL or went to the OHL at 19, then spend 3 years in the AHL but now we'll never know.

Considering where Mete was drafted, we can't complain how he is developing. He is an NHL calibre defenceman at age 20 who is no longer having to be ultra-sheltered. He should be a 4/5 right now, but that is more a case of not having enough other good players than a development issue.

I agree that Juulsen should have played most of this season in Laval.

 

[AlexGretzchenvid]

Considering where Mete was drafted, we can't complain how he is developing. He is an NHL calibre defenceman at age 20 who is no longer having to be ultra-sheltered. He should be a 4/5 right now, but that is more a case of not having enough other good players than a development issue.

I agree that Juulsen should have played most of this season in Laval.

Mete isnt strong enough to be paired with a weak partner. That is why hes with weber, because hes good enough to play with a good partner but not good enough to cover up for a weak one. Almost contradicting.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Mete isnt strong enough to be paired with a weak partner. That is why hes with weber, because hes good enough to play with a good partner but not good enough to cover up for a weak one. Almost contradicting.

He's playing against tougher opponents than Reilly and Kulak because he makes fewer mistakes. Very much unlike last year.

 

[montreal]

Considering where Mete was drafted, we can't complain how he is developing. He is an NHL calibre defenceman at age 20 who is no longer having to be ultra-sheltered. He should be a 4/5 right now, but that is more a case of not having enough other good players than a development issue.

I agree that Juulsen should have played most of this season in Laval.

sure we can, if we think he could be better then he is now if not rushed. For sure he's doing great when you consider how young he is, how tough it is to play top pairing D especially for someone undersized like him, plus being a mid round pick. It was clearly a very good pick by Timmins and his staff but you can still openly question if it was the smart move to play him in the NHL at 19 and now he has to go every day hearing will you ever score a goal? That has to be very tough mentally and confidence wise to go through and the question is did he really need to go through it?