Contender or Pretender? Deadline Wishlist

[Znthnk]

Trading Plekanec would be stupid. Unless we receive something very very very good in return. You don't trade a Selke caliber forward who has 50 points per year usually for nothing.

I would agree that Plek would merit a good return and it would be stupid to trade him for nothing. What return in a defenseman would justify trading Plek in your opinion?

 

[Kriss E]

Do you consider him an "untouchable"? If so, why? While I believe he has value to this and any other team, I feel that the habs are in greater need of a top 3 D. There is no deal involving a good defenseman that would make you consider parting with Plek?

It's not so much that he's an untouchable, it's more that moving him would really hurt our center depth. As much as people feel Eller would be a suitable replacement, fact remains we never used him in Plekanec's role and I really don't want DD back at center. We should be adding to our offense, not subtracting, especially not when it's such a big piece like Plekanec. In the POs, he usually takes on big defensive minutes versus the opposition, losing him for the POs would be huge.

Defensively, we really don't need much upgrading. Gonchar-Beaulieu-Emelin-Gilbert are good enough to flip flop the 2nd and 3rd pairs.

 

[Leon Lucius Black]

Emelin and Gilbert have both shown they can be solid second pairing defense at times, if Beaulieu can keep up his play we're set on defense. Also, Weaver was a beast last year in the playoffs and Tinordi can fill in if we have injuries.

Biggest need would be a winger, after getting Vanek last year our offense was brought to a whole new level. Be difficult to find a guy like him again, but a UFA like Vermette or Glencross could be a great addition who can add 50 points over a full year and help shut down other team's top lines.

Pacioretty - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
X - Plekanec - Parenteau
Prust - Eller - Sekac
Bournival - Desharnais - Weise

Put Desharnais on the fourth line like Briere was last year, having 4 lines who can chip in offensively in the playoffs is huge... having two solid defensive wingers and playing against weaker competition could make Desharnais productive in the playoffs.

 

[Dominator13]

Beaulieu is not a #3 defenseman nor is Gonchar at this point of their careers.

#1 Subban
#2 Mcdonagh (if he wasn't traded)
#3 Markov

Markov a n.3 defensmen? For who? NHL all-stars?

Beaulieu is most definitely playing like a n.3 defensmen right now, the only thing that's missing is filling up those stat sheets, and that will come. Sorry man, n.6 defensmens don't do spinoramas in the offensive zone, they don't do break out passes give us breakaways and 2 on 1 situations either.

 

[Yoshidas Island]

Emelin and Gilbert have both shown they can be solid second pairing defense at times, if Beaulieu can keep up his play we're set on defense. Also, Weaver was a beast last year in the playoffs and Tinordi can fill in if we have injuries.

Biggest need would be a winger, after getting Vanek last year our offense was brought to a whole new level. Be difficult to find a guy like him again, but a UFA like Vermette or Glencross could be a great addition who can add 50 points over a full year and help shut down other team's top lines.

Pacioretty - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
X - Plekanec - Parenteau
Prust - Eller - Sekac
Bournival - Desharnais - Weise

Put Desharnais on the fourth line like Briere was last year, having 4 lines who can chip in offensively in the playoffs is huge... having two solid defensive wingers and playing against weaker competition could make Desharnais productive in the playoffs.

Can you imagine, what would happen to that fourth line? I mean like Bournival and Ghetto is bad enough size wise. You can't have a 5'7" guy on the fourth line.. I'd prefer Desharnais on the Left Wing and find a better 2nd wing right wing. Use Parenteau in the deal if you must

 

[Znthnk]

We don't need a top 3 defensmen anymore, since Beaulieu has been paired up with Gonchar, that's exactly what he's been to us. We need bigger and better wingers for the 2nd line.

Defensively, we really don't need much upgrading. Gonchar-Beaulieu-Emelin-Gilbert are good enough to flip flop the 2nd and 3rd pairs.

Markov a n.3 defensmen? For who? NHL all-stars?

Beaulieu is most definitely playing like a n.3 defensmen right now, the only thing that's missing is filling up those stat sheets, and that will come. Sorry man, n.6 defensmens don't do spinoramas in the offensive zone, they don't do break out passes give us breakaways and 2 on 1 situations either.

While I do like Beaulieu and Gonchar's play of late, they may be too green and too old respectively to take the grind of the playoffs. I also feel that Price's brilliance has hidden some of the defensive lapses.

I think Pleks has great value to the habs and any team that might acquire him. I just feel that the habs need that upgrade on D to make that leap to contention, and it takes sometimes painful sacrifices to get what the team needs most. The Rangers survived trading their captain to make the SCF, so I feel that the disruptive effect of trading Plek may be overstated.

 

[pepperMonkey]

I think the Habs need a top 3 D, and you have to give to get. I think that Plekanec is the only forward along with other assets that the Habs could trade and realistically get that defenseman, while compensating for his loss by committee (Eller, Bournival, Prust as defensive forwards).

So I ask the board, if you had to make this trade, how would you fill in the gaps?


Plekanec + [Prospects/DraftPicks] for [top 3 D]

While I would welcome a top or 2nd paring D, considering we are 3rd in the league for GA and we are 16th in the league for GF, I think it's pretty fair to say we are in need of MORE offense. Besides, if we were to trade Pleks for a 3D, yes, our defense would probably be better still...but we would be making our forward defense much weaker, let alone making our offense even weaker than it was before...unless we are planing to become the next NJD which frankly I would hate to watch...

 

[Znthnk]

While I would welcome a top or 2nd paring D, considering we are 3rd in the league for GA and we are 16th in the league for GF, I think it's pretty fair to say we are in need of MORE offense. Besides, if we were to trade Pleks for a 3D, yes, our defense would probably be better still...but we would be making our forward defense much weaker, let alone making our offense even weaker than it was before...unless we are planing to become the next NJD which frankly I would hate to watch...

I think Eller, Prust and Bournival could somewhat compensate Plek's loss for defensive forwards. I also feel that Price's terrific play has made the D look a bit better than it is. Los Angeles is 13th in GF/G and they aren't boring to watch.

 

[Dominator13]

While I do like Beaulieu and Gonchar's play of late, they may be too green and too old respectively to take the grind of the playoffs. I also feel that Price's brilliance has hidden some of the defensive lapses.

I think Pleks has great value to the habs and any team that might acquire him. I just feel that the habs need that upgrade on D to make that leap to contention, and it takes sometimes painful sacrifices to get what the team needs most. The Rangers survived trading their captain to make the SCF, so I feel that the disruptive effect of trading Plek may be overstated.

Too green and too old? I think it's you that's too spoiled. The Beaulieu-Gonchar is very much In the upper echelon of the league as a 2nd pairing, for now.

 

[417]

It's not so much that he's an untouchable, it's more that moving him would really hurt our center depth. As much as people feel Eller would be a suitable replacement, fact remains we never used him in Plekanec's role and I really don't want DD back at center. We should be adding to our offense, not subtracting, especially not when it's such a big piece like Plekanec. In the POs, he usually takes on big defensive minutes versus the opposition, losing him for the POs would be huge.

Defensively, we really don't need much upgrading. Gonchar-Beaulieu-Emelin-Gilbert are good enough to flip flop the 2nd and 3rd pairs.

Not sure I agree with that...Eller does a lot of heavy lifting for the Habs defensively, he played much of the Pittsburgh game against Malkin and shut him down

I'm not sure why people are so fearful if Eller stepping into Plekanec's role...let's not act like Plekanec is Bob Gainey reincarnated here..

As for trading Plekanec...I can't see it during the current season, it would cause way too much disruption.

But I would not at all be surprised to see him moved this offseason

 

[Dominator13]

Not sure I agree with that...Eller does a lot of heavy lifting for the Habs defensively, he played much of the Pittsburgh game against Malkin and shut him down

I'm not sure why people are so fearful if Eller stepping into Plekanec's role...let's not act like Plekanec is Bob Gainey reincarnated

I'm not sure you got what he's saying. Nobody is doubting Eller's defensive capabilities, we're doubting that he can bring both the defense AND the offense at the same time in a top 6 role like Plekanec has for the last 6 to 8 years.

Slice it anyway you want, Eller's most productive season is 30 points and he's 25 years old now. That's not very reassuring for a n.2 centermen.

 

[417]

I'm not sure you got what he's saying. Nobody is doubting Eller's defensive capabilities, we're doubting that he can bring both the defense AND the offense at the same time in a top 6 role like Plekanec has for the last 6 to 8 years.

Slice it anyway you want, Eller's most productive season is 30 points and he's 25 years old now. That's not very reassuring for a n.2 centermen.

How much opportunity has Eller had to produce more points though? How do you expect Eller to put up 50pts when he gets virtually no PP time? That's a bit unfair and unrealistic if you ask me

As for Plekanec, I don't question the work he does defensively, he's solid in that area (probably not as stellar as most of you think, but still solid), offensively though...i'm not so sure, I think Eller could be just as productive if given the same opportunity as Plekanec gets

In fact, I think this team would be a lot more balanced if Eller/Plekanec switched roles...but that's another debate

 

[Kriss E]

Not sure I agree with that...Eller does a lot of heavy lifting for the Habs defensively, he played much of the Pittsburgh game against Malkin and shut him down

I'm not sure why people are so fearful if Eller stepping into Plekanec's role...let's not act like Plekanec is Bob Gainey reincarnated here..

As for trading Plekanec...I can't see it during the current season, it would cause way too much disruption.

But I would not at all be surprised to see him moved this offseason

Well a one game sample doesn't quite sell me on that, but even if he does, having two guys that can do this heavy lifting is a big positive. Give those minutes to Plekanec and Eller can simply own his easier competition.
Nobody is acting like Plekanec is a pioneer and future HoF, so ease down a bit, we all know you have a pretty formed opinion that Plekanec is overrated but no need to exaggerate.
Our offense needs improving by either upgrading or adding, not subtracting.
In the off season going into next year is an entire different question.

While I do like Beaulieu and Gonchar's play of late, they may be too green and too old respectively to take the grind of the playoffs. I also feel that Price's brilliance has hidden some of the defensive lapses.

Beaulieu got experience last year, how will Gonchar look during the grind of the POs, well it's completely unpredictable. Right now he looks in good shape, but I'm assuming like for any 40yo, fatigue will catch up. At that point, Beaulieu-Emelin-Gilbert could take a slightly bigger role.
As for our defensive lapses, they are system related, not personnel.
Don't get me wrong, we can definitely improve our D, but it's not our priority at the moment imo.

I think Pleks has great value to the habs and any team that might acquire him. I just feel that the habs need that upgrade on D to make that leap to contention, and it takes sometimes painful sacrifices to get what the team needs most. The Rangers survived trading their captain to make the SCF, so I feel that the disruptive effect of trading Plek may be overstated.

We're not going to jump into contention with Galch-Eller-DD as our three centers. It's not going to happen.
The Rangers traded away their Captain for a better player in MSL. That's fine. How did losing MSL work for TB last year? Not so great.
Trade Plekanec for Getzlaf, ya, that would be awesome. Not going to happen though and losing Plekanec without a replacement up front would hurt our offense too much.

 

[Dominator13]

How much opportunity has Eller had to produce more points though? How do you expect Eller to put up 50pts when he gets virtually no PP time? That's a bit unfair and unrealistic if you ask me

As for Plekanec, I don't question the work he does defensively, he's solid in that area (probably not as stellar as most of you think, but still solid), offensively though...i'm not so sure, I think Eller could be just as productive if given the same opportunity as Plekanec gets

In fact, I think this team would be a lot more balanced if Eller/Plekanec switched roles...but that's another debate

Eller has shown 0 flashes till now of being a potential 50-60 point centermen. I LOVE Eller, trust me, but putting him higher than his role could lead to disastrous results for the Habs.

 

[Znthnk]

Too green and too old? I think it's you that's too spoiled. The Beaulieu-Gonchar is very much In the upper echelon of the league as a 2nd pairing, for now.

By no means I am dismissing their contribution, Gonchar's experience and Beaulieu's improved play has definitely helped the habs. Yet the standings are tight and the bubble teams tend to up their game down the stretch, while refs begin to swallow their whistles. I would need to see more to declare them as upper echelon at the moment. A 3rd D that's younger than Gonchar and more experienced than Beaulieu may be needed, in my opinion. And that's gonna cost, and I would be willing to reluctantly part with Pleks to get it.

 

[Dominator13]

By no means I am dismissing their contribution, Gonchar's experience and Beaulieu's improved play has definitely helped the habs. Yet the standings are tight and the bubble teams tend to up their game down the stretch, while refs begin to swallow their whistles. I would need to see more to declare them as upper echelon at the moment. A 3rd D that's younger than Gonchar and more experienced than Beaulieu may be needed, in my opinion. And that's gonna cost, and I would be willing to reluctantly part with Pleks to get it.

Agree to disagree.

We should live or die with our core pieces imo. We're FINALLY developing our younger players into studs but we're still no full contenders for the cup.

 

[ryan callahan]

#19 for goals scored.......that's middle of the back for you, but it's bottom tier to me.
#27 for shots on goals and and #26 for PP. Offensive numbers show, bottom tier.

Galchenyuk and Gallagher aren't prospect even if they haven't fulfilled their potential. Been here for 3 years now and McCarron and Scherback can't play in the NHL this year and will probably need some times in the AHL.

We're talking about THIS years. Our prospect are Andrighetto, Hudon, Thomas. Good players but not top prospect like Tinordi or Beaulieu.

We are 16th for goal scored

 

[ryan callahan]

I would agree that Plek would merit a good return and it would be stupid to trade him for nothing. What return in a defenseman would justify trading Plek in your opinion?

I'd rather trade for a forward. Simmonds would make sense but Philly already has tons of centers. Maybe Big Buff??

 

[pepperMonkey]

I think Eller, Prust and Bournival could somewhat compensate Plek's loss for defensive forwards.

"somewhat" is the key word here...

I also feel that Price's terrific play has made the D look a bit better than it is. Los Angeles is 13th in GF/G and they aren't boring to watch.

...they may not be boring to watch...but they are also losing...

besides, so the D gets better...but our 16th best offense just got worse...
Are we planing to bore our opponents to sleep, because we sure aren't going to be scoring much...

 

[ryan callahan]

Plekanec is way better than all the Montreal's forwards. He is Selke caliber defensively and good offensively too

 

[Milhouse40]

We are 16th for goal scored

Not that it is any better....but i look at goals per game. Numbers of games matters.
Habs have 2.64 goals per game and they are 19th

http://www.nhl.com/ice/teamstats.htm?fetchKey=20152ALLSAAAll&sort=avgGoalsPerGame&viewName=summary

 

[Smokey Thompson]

Plekanec is way better than all the Montreal's forwards. He is Selke caliber defensively and good offensively too

I love Plek but don't overrate him. Patch is knocking at the door for best forward and is arguably better already. And while he's great defensively, saying he's Selke calibre is comparing him to Toews, Bergeron, Kopitar.

Still a very solid 2nd line centre and will be for another few years. Wouldn't trade him yet as he'll be a big piece in our cup push.

 

[417]

Well a one game sample doesn't quite sell me on that, but even if he does, having two guys that can do this heavy lifting is a big positive. Give those minutes to Plekanec and Eller can simply own his easier competition.
Nobody is acting like Plekanec is a pioneer and future HoF, so ease down a bit, we all know you have a pretty formed opinion that Plekanec is overrated but no need to exaggerate.
Our offense needs improving by either upgrading or adding, not subtracting.
In the off season going into next year is an entire different question.

One game sample?

The coaching staff leans quite a bit on Eller, it seems pretty obvious to me that they're grooming him to play the same kind of role

Also, i'm not exaggerating...I mean, yes, I think Habs fans overrate Plekanec, but that doesn't imply that I think he's useless

I just find it funny that something he's irreplaceable, like Eller could never fill his shoes or rather...skates

 

[417]

Eller has shown 0 flashes till now of being a potential 50-60 point centermen. I LOVE Eller, trust me, but putting him higher than his role could lead to disastrous results for the Habs.

Hmm...I think he's showed flashes in VERY limited opportunities this year and also during the lockout year.

As for putting him higher than his current role leading to disaster?

So you think that if Plekanec and Eller switched roles, the results would disastrous?

Plekanec has 10 more points than Eller this year in more games and with way more icetime

 

[ryan callahan]

I love Plek but don't overrate him. Patch is knocking at the door for best forward and is arguably better already. And while he's great defensively, saying he's Selke calibre is comparing him to Toews, Bergeron, Kopitar.

Still a very solid 2nd line centre and will be for another few years. Wouldn't trade him yet as he'll be a big piece in our cup push.

He's as good defensively than all those guys. He's just less offensive and publicized. That's why he never won the Selke