Contender or Pretender? Deadline Wishlist

[Smokey Thompson]

He's as good defensively than all those guys. He's just less offensive and publicized. That's why he never won the Selke

I wouldn't say he's as good as those 3 defensively, although he's still great in that aspect.

 

[Kriss E]

One game sample?

The coaching staff leans quite a bit on Eller, it seems pretty obvious to me that they're grooming him to play the same kind of role

Also, i'm not exaggerating...I mean, yes, I think Habs fans overrate Plekanec, but that doesn't imply that I think he's useless

I just find it funny that something he's irreplaceable, like Eller could never fill his shoes or rather...skates

I said one game because you only mentioned the Pittsburgh one. But Eller has been grooming to takeover Plekanec's role since the Martin era. So I'm a bit skeptical at this point that management have it in their mind that Eller will takeover Plekanec's role. Not because he couldn't do it, that's another debate.
If we were to move Plekanec, DD would be moved to the 2nd center spot. Or he'd be moved back up next to Max and Galchenyuk moved down to 2nd line. Something of the sort.

As for the exaggeration, it was directed at your ''plek isn't Bob Gainey'' comment. Nobody ever argued that he was, but he's still an important piece of our offense. You don't rid yourself of such a player unless there's a clear upgrade taking over.

 

[radicalcenter]

Eller has shown 0 flashes till now of being a potential 50-60 point centermen. I LOVE Eller, trust me, but putting him higher than his role could lead to disastrous results for the Habs.

30 points in 46 games and 13 in 17 games

if those ''streak'' are not flashes I don't know what is

 

[417]

I said one game because you only mentioned the Pittsburgh one. But Eller has been grooming to takeover Plekanec's role since the Martin era. So I'm a bit skeptical at this point that management have it in their mind that Eller will takeover Plekanec's role. Not because he couldn't do it, that's another debate.
If we were to move Plekanec, DD would be moved to the 2nd center spot. Or he'd be moved back up next to Max and Galchenyuk moved down to 2nd line. Something of the sort.

As for the exaggeration, it was directed at your ''plek isn't Bob Gainey'' comment. Nobody ever argued that he was, but he's still an important piece of our offense. You don't rid yourself of such a player unless there's a clear upgrade taking over.

Yeah you're right...no one argued that he was Bob Gainey...they argued that he was as good defensively Jonathan Toews, Patrice Bergeron and Anze Kopitar (for the record, I think Begeron and Kopitar are the 2 best 2 way players in the NHL)

 

[Kriss E]

Yeah you're right...no one argued that he was Bob Gainey...they argued that he was as good defensively Jonathan Toews, Patrice Bergeron and Anze Kopitar (for the record, I think Begeron and Kopitar are the 2 best 2 way players in the NHL)

I disagree with that assertion but I don't really see the big deal. Plekanec is excellent defensively. They have an edge on him offensively, they're bigger and better at faceoffs, I would pick all three of them over Plekanec in a defensive match up except on the PK. Plekanec is one of the best in the NHL to generate offensive chances on the PK.

 

[Mr Jackpot]

Plekanec does some good things during the season to help the team make the playoffs but during the playoffs he doesn't help us at all, he was never able to rise and elevate his game when it counts, we've witness it years after years.

Let's look again at his 13-14 playoff stats:

-he finished 8th in points on his team (not kidding, he finished 8th)
-finished last on his team for +/- (not kidding, last)
-49.5% in the faceoffs
-2 hits

After 10 years with the club, it's time to move-on with Plekanec and it's better to move on while he has a good value on the market.

 

[417]

I disagree with that assertion but I don't really see the big deal. Plekanec is excellent defensively. They have an edge on him offensively, they're bigger and better at faceoffs, I would pick all three of them over Plekanec in a defensive match up except on the PK. Plekanec is one of the best in the NHL to generate offensive chances on the PK.

Yes agreed - Plekanec's sense of anticipation on the PK is as good as anyone.

 

[Richiebottles]

Plekanec does some good things during the season to help the team make the playoffs but during the playoffs he doesn't help us at all, he was never able to rise and elevate his game when it counts, we've witness it years after years.

Let's look again at his 13-14 playoff stats:

-he finished 8th in points on his team (not kidding, he finished 8th)
-finished last on his team for +/- (not kidding, last)
-49.5% in the faceoffs
-2 hits

After 10 years with the club, it's time to move-on with Plekanec and it's better to move on while he has a good value on the market.

He brings a lot to the table though. You watch him play and he is valuable to this team.

 

[Mr Jackpot]

He brings a lot to the table though. You watch him play and he is valuable to this team.

You say a lot but let's enumerate the list of things that a player can bring to his team in the playoffs: leadership, high intensity, offense, defense, physicality, courage,...

These are all things that Plek doesn't bring to his team when it counts. He finished fakin last on his team for +/-

edit: I just looked at another stats, the Habs PK was 13th out of 16 team during the 13-14 playoffs. So not only Plek finished last for +/-, but the Habs were one of the worst team for penalty kill.

 

[CauZuki]

You say a lot but let's enumerate the list of things that a player can bring to his team in the playoffs: leadership, high intensity, offense, defense, physicality, courage,...

These are all things that Plek doesn't bring to his team when it counts. He finished fakin last on his team for +/-

Watch the sport not the stats...

 

[Mr Jackpot]

Watch the sport not the stats...

That's exactly what I did the last 2 playoffs, I watched a lot.

After the 12-13 playoffs against Ottawa, there was 3 players that disappointed me a lot: DD, Pacio and Plek.

Those are the 3 players that I was playing close attention too during last year playoffs. I watched Plek play a lot last year and once again he didn't bring what we could expect from a player that is supposed to be a big piece of the puzzle. He just can't elevate his level of intensity, it's not in him. He doesn't have the drive, the desire. He doesn't have the courage to go in the areas where it hurts (and btw in his whole 10 years career in the NHL, he was never once injured!)

 

[S Bah]

Hockey being a team game, the Habs with their history knowing that fact better than most it seems, especially when considering the upper management team. Having both Bergevin(GM) and Larry Carriere(Former NHL defenceman, Asst.GM & GM in Buffalo also winning the AHL Calder Cup with Rochester & three more while Asst GM with Washington, besides being a great talent evaluator)former NHL Dmen steeped in the defensive game, appreciation of complete hockey players that play the two way game is paramount to any team's success. The Habs have Rick Dudley(Vice-President Hockey Operations) & Scott Mellanby( Asst.GM) both former NHL PWF's that both excelled @ the two/way game and consummate team players, that enjoyed success everywhere they worked.

The Habs Championship teams were always steeped in these types of personnel throughout the years, players that expected to get icetime with those teams had to earn their icetime by proving they could play sound defensively. Top end players like Lafleur or Galchenyuk serve an apprenticeship on the Habs, playing with the team slowly developing their two/way play, until they earn the coaches trust in every situation before receiving the burdens they can expect playing first line minutes against the best lines in the NHL. Others like Plekanec/Eller have all had a likewise education, their work ethic combined with overall talents making them complete players that coaches love to have. This is more the "Norm" way of life in Montreal Canadiens organization than in any other teams. Which has changed over the last few decades with so many former Habs, with those ideals engrained in them joining other NHL teams in management, enjoying the same types of success
that was once the domain of the Habs organization.

Knowing that this is the template for success as Bergevin, Dudley, Carriere, Mellanby and Timmins are completely aware isn't enough, they as a group work at making sure the Habs have every competitive edge possible. Including Stephan Waite to help our great goalies Price, Tikker, Fucale and Condon and other prospects in continuing their growth to be the best. Having both Martin Lapointe(Forwards) & Rob Ramage(Defencemen) ensuring Habs prospects can receive the best help in development at every stage is instrumental in increasing the odds for the Habs to become Stanley Cup Champions once again. It's not enough to just draft and sign the available UFA's or Free Agents, the team's success is based on the total emersion from all their staff (Management, Trainers, Players, Coaches) throughout the system, creating a 24/7 Worldwide Net ensuring the Habs of having players like Jiri Sekac sign with our team. Every signing having input into the final goal of being an Elite NHL Contender each season, with Stanley Cup Championship the ultimate goal every year as befits our glorious franchise.

Winning the goal always, being sound defensively is first and foremost to being Champions that means having complete players. Just one way players like Vanek whose play in the playoffs disappears in tight checking games against complete players, become obsolete and players like Sidney Crosby excel against tougher competition.

 

[MSLs absurd thighs]

Adding a Vermette to this group of forwards without taking much away from the current roster would be a good coup. His two-way abilities would definitely help in the playoffs.

Pacioretty - Galchenyuk - Vermette
Sekac - Plekanec - Gallagher
Prust - Eller - Parenteau
Bournival - Malhotra - Weise

is something I could deal with, assuming Desharnais is the one who gets dealt in a package for Vermette.

 

[Kobe Armstrong]

Adding a Vermette to this group of forwards without taking much away from the current roster would be a good coup. His two-way abilities would definitely help in the playoffs.

Pacioretty - Galchenyuk - Vermette
Sekac - Plekanec - Gallagher
Prust - Eller - Parenteau
Bournival - Malhotra - Weise

is something I could deal with, assuming Desharnais is the one who gets dealt in a package for Vermette.

I think I'd rather see

Pacioretty-Galchenyuk-Gallagher (1st line)
Sekac-Eller-Parenteau (Solid offensive and defensive plus Seks & Eller chemistry)
Prust-Plekanec-Vermette (Really solid 2-way, plays most defensive situations)
Bournival-Malhotra-Weise (Good defensive 4th, could maybe chip in a few goals)

 

[MSLs absurd thighs]

I think I'd rather see

Pacioretty-Galchenyuk-Gallagher (1st line)
Sekac-Eller-Parenteau (Solid offensive and defensive plus Seks & Eller chemistry)
Prust-Plekanec-Vermette (Really solid 2-way, plays most defensive situations)
Bournival-Malhotra-Weise (Good defensive 4th, could maybe chip in a few goals)

Not only would Vermette be a good addition on the 1st line for his defensive abilities, but I also think he's a better offensive player than Gallagher. Hence why I put him there.

 

[Habsawce]

Not only would Vermette be a good addition on the 1st line for his defensive abilities, but I also think he's a better offensive player than Gallagher. Hence why I put him there.

You've been subject to far too much Jacques Martin & Jacques Lemaire if you think it would be a good idea to put Vermette on the top line.

 

[mustardnight*]

With a few tweaks we could be a Cinderella contender this season. Who can we add at the trading deadline that is affordable, realistic additions.

Pacioretty-Galchenyuk-Gallagher
Tlusty-Plekanec-Parenteau
Sekec-Eller-Talbot
Prust-Malhotra-Weise
Andrigetto

Markov-Subban
Sekera-Gonchar
Beaulieu-Weaver
Gilbert

Price
Tokarski

*Andrej Sekera and Jiri Tlusty from Carolina for Alexei Emelin and David Desharnais
*Max Talbot from Colorado Avalanche for Greg Pateryn, 3rd and 5th round picks.

I like what I saw in Sekera and Tlusty tonight. Sekera always make first pass out of the zone and we need that kind of defense. I don't see Emelin doing that often. Tlusty has lots of speed and had played with Plekanec in the past. Talbot will stabilize our 3rd line with Sekec and Eller.

Stop trading Emelin. We need him.

 

[Habs76]

With a few tweaks we could be a Cinderella contender this season. Who can we add at the trading deadline that is affordable, realistic additions.

Pacioretty-Galchenyuk-Gallagher
Tlusty-Plekanec-Parenteau
Sekec-Eller-Talbot
Prust-Malhotra-Weise
Andrigetto

Markov-Subban
Sekera-Gonchar
Beaulieu-Weaver
Gilbert

Price
Tokarski

*Andrej Sekera and Jiri Tlusty from Carolina for Alexei Emelin and David Desharnais
*Max Talbot from Colorado Avalanche for Greg Pateryn, 3rd and 5th round picks.

I like what I saw in Sekera and Tlusty tonight. Sekera always make first pass out of the zone and we need that kind of defense. I don't see Emelin doing that often. Tlusty has lots of speed and had played with Plekanec in the past. Talbot will stabilize our 3rd line with Sekec and Eller.

Leave Ghetto on the 3rd line. Gilbert > Weaver.

 

[MSLs absurd thighs]

You've been subject to far too much Jacques Martin & Jacques Lemaire if you think it would be a good idea to put Vermette on the top line.

I'll say it again; Vermette is a better offensive player than Gallagher.

 

[Ineverplayedthegame]

I'll say it again; Vermette is a better offensive player than Gallagher.

On the powerplay? most definitively. At 5v5 I would give the edge to Gallagher.

Since the lockout, among the 340 fowards with at least 1000 5v5 minutes played, Gallagher has the 42th best points per minutes played, Vermette ranks 214th and Gallagher is a much better possession player. *

Honestly, unless we are going for a big deal, I would completely ignore anything that's not 5v5 in any trade. The powerplay's problem is not personnel, it's the system, so most players we get will see their PP efficiency decrease anyway. Most fowards who have enough PP impact overcome bad tactics are stars.

I already said in a trade thread that I liked Grabner alot, Bergenheim is also solid. The former has been injured for most of the season and the latter has a long injury history though. I kinda like Zack Kassian as a buy low too.

If Franson doesn't want to resign in Toronto, Bergevin will probably give Nonis a call. That was his target in the Gorges deal.

* Honorable mention: Pacioretty at 21th

Unhonorable mentions: Malhotra dead last at 340th and Rene Bourque at 298th.

 

[Blind Gardien]

We don't so much *need* Vermette as a center, though, whereas there might be other teams who *need* that facet of his game, and consequently would likely drive up the pricetag on acquiring him beyond our means.

I'd be happy to find just some "decent" rental winger. Glencross, Stafford, Tlusty, maybe one of the Florida guys cheap enough if the scouting reports aren't too hideous (Fleischmann, Bergenheim, Upshall), Jagr of course, even Ryder, Frolik if the Jets dropped out, basically scanning the bargain bin for whatever the "best value" seems to be out there. Some of these are better than others. Maybe a few others come onto the market. It doesn't have to be a clear top-6 guy, though, if the price is right somebody who just fits into the "committee" in a versatile top-9 would be worth adding.

 

[417]

We don't so much *need* Vermette as a center, though, whereas there might be other teams who *need* that facet of his game, and consequently would likely drive up the pricetag on acquiring him beyond our means.

I'd be happy to find just some "decent" rental winger. Glencross, Stafford, Tlusty, maybe one of the Florida guys cheap enough if the scouting reports aren't too hideous (Fleischmann, Bergenheim, Upshall), Jagr of course, even Ryder, Frolik if the Jets dropped out, basically scanning the bargain bin for whatever the "best value" seems to be out there. Some of these are better than others. Maybe a few others come onto the market. It doesn't have to be a clear top-6 guy, though, if the price is right somebody who just fits into the "committee" in a versatile top-9 would be worth adding.

Drew Stafford is an interesting player...right handed shot, good size, but so inconsistent and doesn't always play with the jam his size indicates that he should

I wonder what the price point would be on him

 

[calder candidate]

We don't so much *need* Vermette as a center, though, whereas there might be other teams who *need* that facet of his game, and consequently would likely drive up the pricetag on acquiring him beyond our means.

I'd be happy to find just some "decent" rental winger. Glencross, Stafford, Tlusty, maybe one of the Florida guys cheap enough if the scouting reports aren't too hideous (Fleischmann, Bergenheim, Upshall), Jagr of course, even Ryder, Frolik if the Jets dropped out, basically scanning the bargain bin for whatever the "best value" seems to be out there. Some of these are better than others. Maybe a few others come onto the market. It doesn't have to be a clear top-6 guy, though, if the price is right somebody who just fits into the "committee" in a versatile top-9 would be worth adding.

I agree as some more teams drop out of the playoff race there will be more player available, I want MB to make a move, but I don't want him to over pay, no move is better than a bad move.

 

[rockjngo]

Guys a trade for a top 6 forward is imminent. Bergervin is working around the clock. Like last year, he wants to reward the fans, we are currently first this year. Last year we almost went to the finals. Vanek was suppose to give us the edge but he didn't. I think we have a better team this year. Likely MB will wait until the deadline when things are cheaper. MB won't give up a first round for a UFA. Likely if he trades a first round its going to be for a player around 23-27 with multi years left on his contract to grow with Pacioretty, Subban, Price, Galchenyuk, Gallagher, Eller.

 

[mustardnight*]

Guys a trade for a top 6 forward is imminent. Bergervin is working around the clock. Like last year, he wants to reward the fans, we are currently first this year. Last year we almost went to the finals. Vanek was suppose to give us the edge but he didn't. I think we have a better team this year. Likely MB will wait until the deadline when things are cheaper. MB won't give up a first round for a UFA. Likely if he trades a first round its going to be for a player around 23-27 with multi years left on his contract to grow with Pacioretty, Subban, Price, Galchenyuk, Gallagher, Eller.

I don't think 'rewarding the fans' is the no.1 reason he wants to get a top 6 forward. I think it is probably irrelevant actually.