Colton Orr

[darrylsittler27]

Beef serves as a deterent.

Compared to Orr anyone is. Point being, Bodie & Ashton contribute something to the lineup. Orr & McLaren don't.

Ashton, Bodie, and D'Amigo should be on the team. Rotated on the 3rd or 4th lines depending on who the opponent is. Ship Orr, McLaren, Fraser, and Ranger to anywhere else.

We used to get injured a lot like the Bolland injury. Beef serves a purpose. Orr will retire soon. No way we give up McClaren, it stops team from running our Kessels.

Next year it will be McClaren,Broll on our 4th. Stopping teams from injurying our good players.

 

[Quares27]

Compared to Orr anyone is. Point being, Bodie & Ashton contribute something to the lineup. Orr & McLaren don't.

Ashton, Bodie, and D'Amigo should be on the team. Rotated on the 3rd or 4th lines depending on who the opponent is. Ship Orr, McLaren, Fraser, and Ranger to anywhere else.

You're clueless if you think Orr and Mclaren contribute nothing. There's a reason our players rarely get messed with. There's a reason our team has like 6 suspensions this year and haven't been the victim of one fine/suspension worthy hit. Having those guys in the lineup gives our players the freedom to play however they want and that in itself is a very valuable addition. I mean open your eyes, in the same game Kadri injured a goaltender and took a 5 minute major on a good young player and nobody on Minnesota went anywhere near him because they were scared what someone like Orr would do if they did. The coach even pointed that out after the game.

You think Bortuzzo thought twice about throwing two hard, injury-causing hits on D'Amigo because Bodie was there? of course not. Bodie had already lost two fights in that game, one of which was to Bortuzzo. Now do you think he would think twice if it was Orr in there instead of Bodie? of course. Players like Bortuzzo wouldn't dare go anywhere near Orr. Look at the game vs the Stars... the 3 toughest players on their team wanted no part of Orr even after he injured Eakin.

The funniest thing about this whole thing is that people cry for a guy like Ashton to be played in his spot but Ashton isn't even good. The guy has 0 goals and 3 pts in 28 games. Through 28 games last season Mclaren had 3 goals and 5 points and Orr had 1 goal and 4 points. So what is Ashton bringing that is so valuable on the 4th line? I mean if you're a garbage fighter then surely you should be putting up quite a few points right? Bodie does that at least.

 

[Ari91]

I'm pretty sure there have been games where neither Orr or McLaren were in the line up. Were there incidents in those games that suggest that Orr and McLaren are definitely needed to deter the opposition from picking on our star players?

 

[Glenn Isildur Healy]

You're clueless if you think Orr and Mclaren contribute nothing. There's a reason our players rarely get messed with. There's a reason our team has like 6 suspensions this year and haven't been the victim of one fine/suspension worthy hit. Having those guys in the lineup gives our players the freedom to play however they want and that in itself is a very valuable addition. I mean open your eyes, in the same game Kadri injured a goaltender and took a 5 minute major on a good young player and nobody on Minnesota went anywhere near him because they were scared what someone like Orr would do if they did. The coach even pointed that out after the game.

You think Bortuzzo thought twice about throwing two hard, injury-causing hits on D'Amigo because Bodie was there? of course not. Bodie had already lost two fights in that game, one of which was to Bortuzzo. Now do you think he would think twice if it was Orr in there instead of Bodie? of course. Players like Bortuzzo wouldn't dare go anywhere near Orr. Look at the game vs the Stars... the 3 toughest players on their team wanted no part of Orr even after he injured Eakin.

The funniest thing about this whole thing is that people cry for a guy like Ashton to be played in his spot but Ashton isn't even good. The guy has 0 goals and 3 pts in 28 games. Through 28 games last season Mclaren had 3 goals and 5 points and Orr had 1 goal and 4 points. So what is Ashton bringing that is so valuable on the 4th line? I mean if you're a garbage fighter then surely you should be putting up quite a few points right? Bodie does that at least.

Orr and McClaren contribute nothing to this team except look like giants who skate on rocks. All they do is take spots away from players who actually earn their spots based on their skill. Ashton isn't the greatest player but at the very least he brings speed and forechecking ability to the team. He scored 10 goals in 14 games with the Marlies and had a solid pre-season so he earned his spot

There is a reason why Orr and McClaren don't fight as much as last season because opponents know if the team doesn't engage in the buffoonery, they are completely useless. In fact if say McClement is our 4th line center, all they do is drag down his effectiveness

And guess what, all those years the Red Wings were Cup winners or contenders, they were the least penalized team in the league. They still are one of the least penalized teams and they seem to be doing just fine

 

[ldnk]

You're clueless if you think Orr and Mclaren contribute nothing. There's a reason our players rarely get messed with. There's a reason our team has like 6 suspensions this year and haven't been the victim of one fine/suspension worthy hit. Having those guys in the lineup gives our players the freedom to play however they want and that in itself is a very valuable addition. I mean open your eyes, in the same game Kadri injured a goaltender and took a 5 minute major on a good young player and nobody on Minnesota went anywhere near him because they were scared what someone like Orr would do if they did. The coach even pointed that out after the game.

You think Bortuzzo thought twice about throwing two hard, injury-causing hits on D'Amigo because Bodie was there? of course not. Bodie had already lost two fights in that game, one of which was to Bortuzzo. Now do you think he would think twice if it was Orr in there instead of Bodie? of course. Players like Bortuzzo wouldn't dare go anywhere near Orr. Look at the game vs the Stars... the 3 toughest players on their team wanted no part of Orr even after he injured Eakin.

The funniest thing about this whole thing is that people cry for a guy like Ashton to be played in his spot but Ashton isn't even good. The guy has 0 goals and 3 pts in 28 games. Through 28 games last season Mclaren had 3 goals and 5 points and Orr had 1 goal and 4 points. So what is Ashton bringing that is so valuable on the 4th line? I mean if you're a garbage fighter then surely you should be putting up quite a few points right? Bodie does that at least.

Ah yes, the last bastion of knuckle dragger justification. Stuff hasn't happened therefore it is Orr's existence that caused that. You know, or it could be because nothing has happened because other teams aren't dressing as many of these foolish players anymore. Guys who make a living out of fighting aren't afraid of Colton Orr. Ignoring the fact that Orr hasn't won a fight this year it is honestly laughable that you honestly think that grown men are so afraid of Orr sitting on the bench that they are thinking about him during the play.

 

[Quares27]

Ah yes, the last bastion of knuckle dragger justification. Stuff hasn't happened therefore it is Orr's existence that caused that. You know, or it could be because nothing has happened because other teams aren't dressing as many of these foolish players anymore. Guys who make a living out of fighting aren't afraid of Colton Orr. Ignoring the fact that Orr hasn't won a fight this year it is honestly laughable that you honestly think that grown men are so afraid of Orr sitting on the bench that they are thinking about him during the play.

Nothing you just sad was actually a response to anything I said. You're just spouting a bunch of general ********.

"Stuff hasn't happened therefore it is Orr's existence that caused that"

Of course things are always going to happen. But weird how it rarely happens to the Leafs and often seems to happen to teams like Montreal and Edmonton. What a coincidence that is huh?

"You know, or it could be because nothing has happened because other teams aren't dressing as many of these foolish players anymore."

The majority of cheap **** isn't caused by goons so this point really serves no relevance whatsoever. Do you not actually watch the NHL and see the Hanzals, Marchands and Lapierres of the league?

"Guys who make a living out of fighting aren't afraid of Colton Orr."

Well first of all, like I previously stated the majority of cheapshots aren't by goons so that's once again a completely irrelevant point. And even then I guess it must be another coincidence that guys who fight 15+ times a year every year like Prust and Konopka have somehow fought Orr 0 times but fought guys like Brown 5 times each. Man, your point sure seems to be backed up by a bunch of fluke coincidences.

"Ignoring the fact that Orr hasn't won a fight this year it is honestly laughable that you honestly think that grown men are so afraid of Orr sitting on the bench that they are thinking about him during the play."

The Minnesota Wild sure seemed to be thinking about him and Fraser when they decided not to jump Kadri after that hit on Backstrom, huh?

"NBC Sports commentator Mike Milbury – never one to sugarcoat things – claimed somebody should’ve gone after Kadri. In response to none of his players picking a fight with the Toronto forward, Wild coach Mike Yeo claimed he didn’t want the violence to escalate.
“Do we match up against that team’s toughness? No, we don’t,†Yeo said. “If we want to start trading off, we go after Kadri, next thing you know, what are they going to go after? They’re going to go after our guys too and again we don’t match up in that toughness department against them."

It's also interesting that Minnesota's tough guy is Zenon Konopka, who has fought Orr 0 times. Oh look, another fluke coincidence that is backing up your point!!!!! Could it be that they're not actually coincidences and that you simply have no clue what you're talking about? of course not!!!! Coincidences!!!!!!!!

 

[shaner8989]

Orr and Mclaren are both garbage. Negative impact every time they hit the ice

 

[BiggestLeafsFanEVER*]

guy's a waste of space, can't wait until he's off the team

 

[PureTruculence]

Nothing you just sad was actually a response to anything I said. You're just spouting a bunch of general ********.

"Stuff hasn't happened therefore it is Orr's existence that caused that"

Of course things are always going to happen. But weird how it rarely happens to the Leafs and often seems to happen to teams like Montreal and Edmonton. What a coincidence that is huh?

"You know, or it could be because nothing has happened because other teams aren't dressing as many of these foolish players anymore."

The majority of cheap **** isn't caused by goons so this point really serves no relevance whatsoever. Do you not actually watch the NHL and see the Hanzals, Marchands and Lapierres of the league?

"Guys who make a living out of fighting aren't afraid of Colton Orr."

Well first of all, like I previously stated the majority of cheapshots aren't by goons so that's once again a completely irrelevant point. And even then I guess it must be another coincidence that guys who fight 15+ times a year every year like Prust and Konopka have somehow fought Orr 0 times but fought guys like Brown 5 times each. Man, your point sure seems to be backed up by a bunch of fluke coincidences.

"Ignoring the fact that Orr hasn't won a fight this year it is honestly laughable that you honestly think that grown men are so afraid of Orr sitting on the bench that they are thinking about him during the play."

The Minnesota Wild sure seemed to be thinking about him and Fraser when they decided not to jump Kadri after that hit on Backstrom, huh?

"NBC Sports commentator Mike Milbury – never one to sugarcoat things – claimed somebody should’ve gone after Kadri. In response to none of his players picking a fight with the Toronto forward, Wild coach Mike Yeo claimed he didn’t want the violence to escalate.
“Do we match up against that team’s toughness? No, we don’t,†Yeo said. “If we want to start trading off, we go after Kadri, next thing you know, what are they going to go after? They’re going to go after our guys too and again we don’t match up in that toughness department against them."

It's also interesting that Minnesota's tough guy is Zenon Konopka, who has fought Orr 0 times. Oh look, another fluke coincidence that is backing up your point!!!!! Could it be that they're not actually coincidences and that you simply have no clue what you're talking about? of course not!!!! Coincidences!!!!!!!!

Your first comment was spot on, this one is even better. I like the way you think.

Carlyle has even said "It's amazing how quiet things are when Orr is on the ice". If it's not about corsi or some other stat pulled outta someone's ass then half the people on this site won't get it.

 

[Milan90]

The notion that teams don't dress fighters is an outright lie.

Anaheim - Jackman
Boston - Thornton
Buffalo - Scott; Konopka
Calgary - Westgarth; O'Brien
Carolina - Harrison
Chicago - Brookbank
Colorado - Bordeleau; McLeod
Columbus - Boll
Dallas - Roussel
Detroit - N/A
Edmonton - Hendricks; Gazdic
Florida - Barch; Winchester
Los Angeles - Nolan; Clifford
Minnesota - Rupp; Cooke
Montreal - Moen; Prust; Parros
Nashville - Clune
New Jersey - N/A
Islanders - Martin; Carkner; Clutterbuck
Rangers - Carcillo
Ottawa - Neil; Smith
Philadelphia - Rosehill
Phoenix - Bissonnette
Pittsburgh - Glass; Engelland
San Jose - Brown; Desjardins
St. Louis - Reaves
Tampa Bay - Crombeen
Toronto - Orr
Vancouver - Sestito
Washington - Erskine
Winnipeg - Peluso; Thorburn

 

[HoweHullOrr]

We used to get injured a lot like the Bolland injury. Beef serves a purpose. Orr will retire soon. No way we give up McClaren, it stops team from running our Kessels.

Next year it will be McClaren,Broll on our 4th. Stopping teams from injurying our good players.

Oddly, if a goon like Scott wants to take a run at some one like let's say um Kessel, he will anyways whether Colton is around or not.

Even more enigmatic is why Clarkson jumped of the bench when we have an enforcer like Orr.

The other thing worth noting is that I'd guess several Eastern Conference teams added goons to their rosters as a reaction to us having 2 goons in our lineup. Combine that with the fact that some teams don't have a goon on their starting roster and find a way of managing somehow.

So, is it really a case that we needed these goons, or that we need them now as a result of our roster.

 

[Duffman955]

The notion that teams don't dress fighters is an outright lie.

Anaheim - Jackman
Boston - Thornton
Buffalo - Scott; Konopka
Calgary - Westgarth; O'Brien
Carolina - Harrison
Chicago - Brookbank
Colorado - Bordeleau; McLeod
Columbus - Boll
Dallas - Roussel
Detroit - N/A
Edmonton - Hendricks; Gazdic
Florida - Barch; Winchester
Los Angeles - Nolan; Clifford
Minnesota - Rupp; Cooke
Montreal - Moen; Prust; Parros
Nashville - Clune
New Jersey - N/A
Islanders - Martin; Carkner; Clutterbuck
Rangers - Carcillo
Ottawa - Neil; Smith
Philadelphia - Rosehill
Phoenix - Bissonnette
Pittsburgh - Glass; Engelland
San Jose - Brown; Desjardins
St. Louis - Reaves
Tampa Bay - Crombeen
Toronto - Orr
Vancouver - Sestito
Washington - Erskine
Winnipeg - Peluso; Thorburn

This.

Orr needs to fight more though, should have just wailed on Roussel in the 7-1 beatdown.

 

[newfy]

The notion that teams don't dress fighters is an outright lie.

Anaheim - Jackman
Boston - Thornton
Buffalo - Scott; Konopka
Calgary - Westgarth; O'Brien
Carolina - Harrison
Chicago - Brookbank
Colorado - Bordeleau; McLeod
Columbus - Boll
Dallas - Roussel
Detroit - N/A
Edmonton - Hendricks; Gazdic
Florida - Barch; Winchester
Los Angeles - Nolan; Clifford
Minnesota - Rupp; Cooke
Montreal - Moen; Prust; Parros
Nashville - Clune
New Jersey - N/A
Islanders - Martin; Carkner; Clutterbuck
Rangers - Carcillo
Ottawa - Neil; Smith
Philadelphia - Rosehill
Phoenix - Bissonnette
Pittsburgh - Glass; Engelland
San Jose - Brown; Desjardins
St. Louis - Reaves
Tampa Bay - Crombeen
Toronto - Orr
Vancouver - Sestito
Washington - Erskine
Winnipeg - Peluso; Thorburn

I would say a lot of guys on that list fight but arent enforcers like Orr or McLaren. Ie most of those guys have purpose besides dropping the gloves, Orr and McLaren dont. I counted around 18 of the guys that you listed that are actually solid bottom line players that provide more than just fighting to a team. I think youre thinking of Brad Winchester for Florida, hes in the AHL. Jesse Winchester isnt much of a fighter at all.

I would say with Orrs record lately and lack of activity the Leafs should be looking to give Devane a shot

 

[HoweHullOrr]

The notion that teams don't dress fighters is an outright lie.

Anaheim - Jackman
Boston - Thornton
Buffalo - Scott; Konopka
Calgary - Westgarth; O'Brien
Carolina - Harrison
Chicago - Brookbank
Colorado - Bordeleau; McLeod
Columbus - Boll
Dallas - Roussel
Detroit - N/A
Edmonton - Hendricks; Gazdic
Florida - Barch; Winchester
Los Angeles - Nolan; Clifford
Minnesota - Rupp; Cooke
Montreal - Moen; Prust; Parros
Nashville - Clune
New Jersey - N/A
Islanders - Martin; Carkner; Clutterbuck
Rangers - Carcillo
Ottawa - Neil; Smith
Philadelphia - Rosehill
Phoenix - Bissonnette
Pittsburgh - Glass; Engelland
San Jose - Brown; Desjardins
St. Louis - Reaves
Tampa Bay - Crombeen
Toronto - Orr
Vancouver - Sestito
Washington - Erskine
Winnipeg - Peluso; Thorburn

Probably better to distinguish between "goons" and "fighters". I suspect that some of the fighters you've listed have some actual hockey skills versus only pugilistic skills.

 

[Milan90]

The majority are strictly enforcers. Maybe take Cooke, Neil, and Smith off of the list. 99% of the guys I mentioned would struggle to find a roster spot if they weren't skilled fighters.

 

[likeabosski]

The notion that teams don't dress fighters is an outright lie.

Anaheim - Jackman
Boston - Thornton
Buffalo - Scott; Konopka
Calgary - Westgarth; O'Brien
Carolina - Harrison
Chicago - Brookbank
Colorado - Bordeleau; McLeod
Columbus - Boll
Dallas - Roussel
Detroit - N/A
Edmonton - Hendricks; Gazdic
Florida - Barch; Winchester
Los Angeles - Nolan; Clifford
Minnesota - Rupp; Cooke
Montreal - Moen; Prust; Parros
Nashville - Clune
New Jersey - N/A
Islanders - Martin; Carkner; Clutterbuck
Rangers - Carcillo
Ottawa - Neil; Smith
Philadelphia - Rosehill
Phoenix - Bissonnette
Pittsburgh - Glass; Engelland
San Jose - Brown; Desjardins
St. Louis - Reaves
Tampa Bay - Crombeen
Toronto - Orr
Vancouver - Sestito
Washington - Erskine
Winnipeg - Peluso; Thorburn

There are only 32 fighters with at least 6 fights this season. 7 NHL teams don't even have a fighter with at least 6 fights (Carolina, Chicago, Detroit, New Jersey, Phoenix, Pittsburgh and Winnipeg). Nine different NHL teams have 2 fighters with 6 or more fights: Anaheim, Boston, Buffalo, Edmonton, Los Angeles, Montreal, NY Rangers, San Jose and Toronto.

23/30 teams employ an enforcer but Chicago and Pittsburgh seem to be doing alright without a real enforcer. The Chicago Blackhawks are ranked 4th last in the league in fighting majors (8 fights). The Pittsburgh Penguins are tied for 20th (21 fights).

 

[Milan90]

Oddly, if a goon like Scott wants to take a run at some one like let's say um Kessel, he will anyways whether Colton is around or not.

Even more enigmatic is why Clarkson jumped of the bench when we have an enforcer like Orr.

The other thing worth noting is that I'd guess several Eastern Conference teams added goons to their rosters as a reaction to us having 2 goons in our lineup. Combine that with the fact that some teams don't have a goon on their starting roster and find a way of managing somehow.

So, is it really a case that we needed these goons, or that we need them now as a result of our roster.

Neither Orr nor McLaren were dressed for the Buffalo game.

 

[Milan90]

There are only 32 fighters with at least 6 fights this season. 7 NHL teams don't even have a fighter with at least 6 fights (Carolina, Chicago, Detroit, New Jersey, Phoenix, Pittsburgh and Winnipeg). Nine different NHL teams have 2 fighters with 6 or more fights: Anaheim, Boston, Buffalo, Edmonton, Los Angeles, Montreal, NY Rangers, San Jose and Toronto.

23/30 teams employ an enforcer but Chicago and Pittsburgh seem to be doing alright without a real enforcer. The Chicago Blackhawks are ranked 4th last in the league in fighting majors (8 fights). The Pittsburgh Penguins are tied for 20th (21 fights).

Likewise, there are plenty of teams who employ enforcers who are doing well. Los Angeles, Colorado, Anaheim, Boston, Tampa, to name a few.

Why the benchmark of 6 fights?

 

[PureTruculence]

There are only 32 fighters with at least 6 fights this season. 7 NHL teams don't even have a fighter with at least 6 fights (Carolina, Chicago, Detroit, New Jersey, Phoenix, Pittsburgh and Winnipeg). Nine different NHL teams have 2 fighters with 6 or more fights: Anaheim, Boston, Buffalo, Edmonton, Los Angeles, Montreal, NY Rangers, San Jose and Toronto.

23/30 teams employ an enforcer but Chicago and Pittsburgh seem to be doing alright without a real enforcer. The Chicago Blackhawks are ranked 4th last in the league in fighting majors (8 fights). The Pittsburgh Penguins are tied for 20th (21 fights).

Engelland isn't a real enforcer? Bollig was an enforcer but I guess he thinks he's a player now playing in Chicago.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Neither Orr nor McLaren were dressed for the Buffalo game.

I guess your agreeing then that Scott was added to Buffalo's roster largely as a reaction to our goons - escalation of the arms race so to speak. Its kind of ironic then that our strategy backfired in that Buffalo game.

 

[likeabosski]

Likewise, there are plenty of teams who employ enforcers who are doing well. Los Angeles, Colorado, Anaheim, Boston, Tampa, to name a few.

Why the benchmark of 6 fights?

There are 30 teams in the NHL. I think looking at the top 30 fighters in the NHL gives a good indication of which teams are employing full-time enforcers as opposed to tough guys who fight every now and then (ie. Milan Lucic and Jarome Iginla).

Engelland isn't a real enforcer? Bollig was an enforcer but I guess he thinks he's a player now playing in Chicago.

Engelland has only fought 5 times this season though. Considering that Pittsburgh has already played like 53 games, 5 fights is not much. The fact that 6 fights is enough to make you top 30 in the NHL in fighting majors says a lot about the reduced role that fighting has in the game. Leafs fans generally think that Colton Orr isn't fighting much these days and he has 6 fights.

Bollig is definitely being used a lot more in a shut-down/checking line capacity than an enforcer capacity these days in Chicago. My guess is the Chicago Blackhawks coach (or GM) doesn't believe in fighting and probably tells Bollig not to fight much. Because the Blackhawks barely fight as is (8 fights the whole season). There is an anonymous Western Conference GM who has gone on record criticizing the Toronto Maple Leafs for employing goons (especially 2 goons). I bet it's Chicago's GM because they have the least fights in the western conference.

 

[Milan90]

There are 30 teams in the NHL. I think looking at the top 30 fighters in the NHL gives a good indication of which teams are employing full-time enforcers as opposed to tough guys who fight every now and then (ie. Milan Lucic and Jarome Iginla).

Engelland has only fought 5 times this season though. Considering that Pittsburgh has already played like 53 games, 5 fights is not much. The fact that 6 fights is enough to make you top 30 in the NHL in fighting majors says a lot about the reduced role that fighting has in the game.

Bollig is definitely being used a lot more in a shut-down/checking line capacity than an enforcer capacity these days in Chicago. My guess is the Chicago Blackhawks coach (or GM) doesn't believe in fighting and probably tells Bollig not to fight much. Because the Blackhawks barely fight as is (8 fights the whole season).

5 fights at this point in the season is pretty average for an enforcer.

There's a reason I didn't mention Lucic or Iginla or Jamie Benn. I strictly stuck to third and fourth liners and bottom pairing defensemen. They're all clearly there for their fighting ability.

 

[Glenn Isildur Healy]

The majority are strictly enforcers. Maybe take Cooke, Neil, and Smith off of the list. 99% of the guys I mentioned would struggle to find a roster spot if they weren't skilled fighters.

The more reason why these enforcers need to go. The less Orrs, Scotts and McClarens of the world, the less stage fighting and stupidity in the game

 

[Milan90]

The more reason why these enforcers need to go. The less Orrs, Scotts and McClarens of the world, the less stage fighting and stupidity in the game

The opposite argument is made by fighting proponents.

 

[Man Bear Pig]

Anyone who thinks goons prevent star players from being attacked need a reality check. How many guys go after dastyuk and zetterberg? Detroit hasn't had a goon in ages, seems to work just fine for them. Kessel has also been attacked this season, further proof that a guy like Colton really doesn't have the intimidation factor we'd like to believe it does. I'm for fighting, I believe it should be done in the heat of the moment though, not some premeditated predictable scrap.