Confirmed with Link: [COL/ARI] Avs Acquire G D.Kuemper($1m ret.) for D C.Timmins + 2022 COL 1st + 2024 COL 3rd(cond.)

[Ararana]

Timmins proved to be an NHL quality player in the playoffs when it mattered most. Not to mention he’s young and hasn’t even played a full pro season yet. He’ll likely turn into even more.

It’s ok to be fine with getting Kuemper but also hate the trade. I feel like everyone here is either all in one way or another. There’s never any middle ground.

I for one am absolutely thrilled we got Kuemper. I think if healthy he’s a top 5 goalie in the NHL behind this team. But f*** I wish we found another way to acquire him. Timmins and a 1st is just a lot.

I'm probably in the minority that, if I got to choose, I'd have kept the 1st and sent Timmins. I'm just really not that high on Timmins, his skating was absolutely painful to watch when he shares the ice with Makar/Girard/Byram. It's both that makes it hard to swallow.

But Kuemper is the real deal. If they can get him extended it will end up a good trade value-wise IMO.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

IMO... for the price the Avs paid in the trade, pay a bit more and get Gibson. Yeah costs more in assets and cap, but he's locked in at a rate you can build around. If Kuemper is healthy next season, his cap will be right in between Grubi and Gibson anyway. It is a one year sort of situation. Plus, just get rid of Compher for the cap issues. The cap can be worked around and we've seen many times, no deal is unmovable.

If you just signed Grubi to the 6x6ish deal, the same 1st + Timmins could have been used to get DeBrusk to get the 'cheap' forward for a year.

I didn’t want Grubauer back on a 6X6 with a no trade clause though.

Maybe for you that works, but I don’t believe in going that high and locking in that kind of term for a goaltender, unless they’re special.

 

[henchman21]

I didn’t want Grubauer back on a 6X6 with a no trade clause though.

Maybe for you that works, but I don’t believe in going that high and locking in that kind of term for a goaltender unless they’re special.

That's just the market rate... going to have this rotation and continual spending of assets if the Avs don't lock in a guy. I'd be shocked if Kuemper is healthy, that he doesn't demand 6+m per over 5-6 years. If the Avs don't pay up... the 23 1st and another prospect is likely going to be gone again...

 

[The Abusement Park]

I didn’t want Grubauer back on a 6X6 with a no trade clause though.

Maybe for you that works, but I don’t believe in going that high and locking in that kind of term for a goaltender, unless they’re special.

Not that I don't disagree but we're literally going to be in the exact same situation again next summer. If Kuemper plays well he's going to demand ~6x6 and were right back to square one again.

 

[duckbear]

I didn’t want Grubauer back on a 6X6 with a no trade clause though.

Maybe for you that works, but I don’t believe in going that high and locking in that kind of term for a goaltender, unless they’re special.

I don't love Gru at 6x6, but I don't think that contract is going to be as bad as it might look to you. The cap very well could go up significantly by the middle of that deal, and additionally the cost for players is going to go up just because there is $82m more to spend on players due to Seattle. That inflation is generally going to be steeper for mid to high-end talent.

The other alternative was obviously to sign a lower quality goaltender with bounce-back potential like Holtby or Raanta as a stop gap, and use the extra cap space elsewhere. Add a C or W. Then address the issue at the deadline or mid-season (presumably trading or waiving Francouz). The price wouldn't have been higher than we just paid and it's not like there is something special about Kuemper. We would also have retained the F which we are now missing, with no assets to get anyone at the deadline.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

That's just the market rate... going to have this rotation and continual spending of assets if the Avs don't lock in a guy. I'd be shocked if Kuemper is healthy, that he doesn't demand 6+m per over 5-6 years. If the Avs don't pay up... the 23 1st and another prospect is likely going to be gone again...

This kind of trade isn’t sustainable long term obviously. You can’t go out every year and pay this kind of price for a goalie, but it’s a fine stop gap method.

Maybe you can get a little shorter term with a guy like Kuemper because of his age, or even a bit of a discounted AAV if you get an extension done now, or during the season.

Also… when it comes down to this season,
hopefully Kuemper can avoid the extreme lows Grubauer had late in the playoffs. If he is healthy and performs in the playoffs it will be a good trade and if they can get him on a decent extension it’s a great trade. If he just posts a solid season and leaves in UFA after the Avs get knocked out early in the playoffs then it’s a bad trade. Time will tell.

 

[henchman21]

This kind of trade isn’t sustainable long term obviously. You can’t go out every year and pay this kind of price for a goalie, but it’s a fine stop gap method.

Maybe you can get a little shorter term with a guy like Kuemper because of his age, or even a bit of a discounted AAV if you get an extension done now, or during the season.

Also… when it comes down to this season,
hopefully Kuemper can avoid the extreme lows Grubauer had late in the playoffs. If he is healthy and performs in the playoffs it will be a good trade and if they can get him on a decent extension it’s a great trade. If he just posts a solid season and leaves in UFA after the Avs get knocked out early in the playoffs then it’s a bad trade. Time will tell.

I don't see Kuemper signing anything discounted in this situation. Him and his agent know what the Avs spent, and they know the opportunity that exists here. But in the end, the deal will be fine (still not great IMO) if he can solve the goalie issue for 4 years. If he's only here a season, healthy or not, it is a bad deal.

 

[Belgican]

I don't see Kuemper signing anything discounted in this situation. Him and his agent know what the Avs spent, and they know the opportunity that exists here. But in the end, the deal will be fine (still not great IMO) if he can solve the goalie issue for 4 years. If he's only here a season, healthy or not, it is a bad deal.

That’s why Sakic has to sign him now, while he’s high on emotions, and I don’t care it’s 5 or 6 AAV

 

[letsgoavs1921]

That's just the market rate... going to have this rotation and continual spending of assets if the Avs don't lock in a guy. I'd be shocked if Kuemper is healthy, that he doesn't demand 6+m per over 5-6 years. If the Avs don't pay up... the 23 1st and another prospect is likely going to be gone again...

Difference will be Keumper only gets that from us if he actually does something to deserve it. Being average for a couple years, not doing anything special in the playoffs, having a good (shortened) regular season and then being awful when it mattered most in the playoffs doesn't get you top dollar

 

[The Abusement Park]

That’s why Sakic has to sign him now, while he’s high on emotions, and I don’t care it’s 5 or 6 AAV

If Kuemper signed for 5-6mil AAV tomorrow, this whole trade would be one of Sakics worst moves since he took over.

 

[henchman21]

Difference will be Keumper only gets that from us if he actually does something to deserve it. Being average for a couple years, not doing anything special in the playoffs, having a good (shortened) regular season and then being awful when it mattered most in the playoffs doesn't get you top dollar

I'd argue he doesn't have to deserve it... just start 50 games and have a .915 sv%, then demand market for a starting goalie.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

If Kuemper signed for 5-6mil AAV tomorrow, this whole trade would be one of Sakics worst moves since he took over.

Depends on the term.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Depends on the term.

I don’t think it does. He would’ve paid a 1st and Timmins for a different goalie that’s at basically the same level as he could've signed for free.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

I don’t think it does. He would’ve paid a 1st and Timmins for a different goalie that’s at basically the same level as he could've signed for free.

Like I said, time will tell here. It’s going to come down to his performance in the playoffs.

But, I wouldn’t have an issue giving him a $5M X 3 year contract extension today.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Like I said, time will tell here. It’s going to come down to his performance in the playoffs.

But, I wouldn’t have an issue giving him a $5M X 3 year contract extension today.

At the cost of a 1st and Timmins though? It just seems like a waste of assets and now we lost have any good assets to address the other holes our team has.

Obviously if we win the cup it's all a moot point, but thats what this move hinges on basically.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

At the cost of a 1st and Timmins though? It just seems like a waste of assets and now we lost have any good assets to address the other holes our team has.

Obviously if we win the cup it's all a moot point, but thats what this move hinges on basically.

Do you not want to sign him? I don’t get it. Letting him walk would make the trade worse.

 

[henchman21]

Do you not want to sign him? I don’t get it. Letting him walk would make the trade worse.

I don't want him re-signed if he has injury issues next season. That is doubling down on a mistake. Sometimes it is best to take the loss and move on.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

I don't want him re-signed if he has injury issues next season. That is doubling down on a mistake. Sometimes it is best to take the loss and move on.

But you were ok giving Grubauer 6 years with a no trade clause? He has injury issues too.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Do you not want to sign him? I don’t get it. Letting him walk would make the trade worse.

I mean in the end yes assuming he stays healthy. But we paid a 1st and Timmins just to get into literally the same situation we were just in with Grub which makes 0 sense to me.

 

[henchman21]

But you were ok giving Grubauer 6 years with a no trade clause? He has injury issues too.

They are different leagues... I posted it up, but Grubi has had one season with injuries. Kuemper has had one season with no injuries.

 

[Belgican]

If Kuemper signed for 5-6mil AAV tomorrow, this whole trade would be one of Sakics worst moves since he took over.

It already is ! An extension would be sweat. How can you say it’s worse as Kuemper is better than Gru, and all what you all say is that we should have signed Gru

 

[Belgican]

They are different leagues... I posted it up, but Grubi has had one season with injuries. Kuemper has had one season with no injuries.

And if he isn’t injured he will use his trade value to sign elsewhere. Learn pls

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

I mean in the end yes assuming he stays healthy. But we paid a 1st and Timmins just to get into literally the same situation we were just in with Grub which makes 0 sense to me.

I think what the Avs are banking on is that he’ll be better in the playoffs. They can’t withstand what happened late in that Vegas series.

If he’s not better in the postseason and then walks, it’s a major L, because you could’ve just signed someone like Mrazek to do the same thing. It’s just one of those moves that’s impossible to give a firm judgement on right now.

 

[The Abusement Park]

It already is ! An extension would be sweat. How can you say it’s worse as Kuemper is better than Gru, and all what you all say is that we should have signed Gru

Kuemper is at best a slight upgrade over Gru. Both are in the same tier of goalies. If we didn't want to pay Gru 6mil why would we want to give up a 1st and Timmins to sign a goalie that isn't a huge upgrade to a similar deal?

 

[Belgican]

Kuemper is at best a slight upgrade over Gru. Both are in the same tier of goalies. If we didn't want to pay Gru 6mil why would we want to give up a 1st and Timmins to sign a goalie that isn't a huge upgrade to a similar deal?

It’s done, nothing you can do now