Bring the NHL to Houston!!!

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Blackhawkswincup

RIP Fugu
Jun 24, 2007
187,324
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Chicagoland
With still no owner for the Dallas Stars a team in Houston is an absolute non-starter imo. If the Coyotes are relocated I think Quebec City is at the very top of the list. They are getting a brand new arena built and have an ownership group in place.

In the US, Seattle and Kansas City rank higher than Houston I think.

As for Hamilton, MLSE pulls a lot of weight in the league. While they may not have a veto vote they're opinion matters more than any other. If you think the rest of the owners would strong arm the Leafs and force a team into Hamilton without their blessing you're dreaming.

Why would Hicks financial screwups in Dallas effect Houston?

Why would Seattle with no major hockey programs or arena or ownership interst be ranked higher? Why would KC who has yet had no prospective ownership groups?

Houston has NHL arena ready and Les Alexander had history trying to bring NHL to city. So there is alot more potential in Houston getting team then those other 2 IMO
 

HansH

Unwelcome Spectre
Feb 2, 2005
5,294
482
San Diego
www.mib.org
Victoria isn't a hockey city. They're just getting WHL back after many years without it. There are also many Canucks fans who take the ferry to see games (North and South Island). On weekend games, it wouldn't surprise me if 3,000+ fans at a Canucks game are from Vancouver Island.
So, the success of the ECHL Salmon Kings, that opened the door for RG Properties to acquire that WHL team... that's a clear indication that Victoria "isn't a hockey city", obviously.

I'll agree that it's not an _NHL_ city, but I'm increasingly aggravated at the provincial attitudes that "only Canadian Major Juniors and the NHL are actually indications of what are 'hockey cities'".
 

MoreOrr

B4
Jun 20, 2006
24,421
439
Mexico
If Les Alexander talks to Gary Bettman and says he is willing to buy a team and have it play in Houston, he immediately passes Quebec City for a franchise and rightfully so.

I wouldn't be too sure about that. Perhaps. Houston's made bids to get a team in the past and obviously it hasn't got one yet. Now, if Seattle suddenly announced it's building a new arena and wants to bring an NHL team there, then the League would be saying... What's Quebec City? Is it on the NA map?
 

KevFu

Registered User
May 22, 2009
9,203
3,435
Phoenix from Rochester via New Orleans
What's ridiculous about it?

Clearly there's a problem with many of the southern teams, and based on the incredible response to Winnipeg's season ticket drive, it seems pretty obvious that bringing teams back to traditional markets is not only a near-guarantee that a team will be successful, but a massive PR bonus for the league as well, especially here in Canada.

Clearly there is a problem with many of the southern teams:

- Carolina, which has an owner of 17 years, who remains committed to the team. Loves the team, doesn't care about year-to-year profit/loss as the team is just one aspect of his portfolio, they won a cup, average about 16,000 fans since the lockout.

- Nashville, with their steady revenue growth since the lockout despite ownership and lease issues still being sorted out, attendance rock steady at the 15,000 mark; one of the few new teams to be developing traditions with the Standing O and the Cellblock; playoff berths in six of seven years and now coming off their first playoff win. Went to dynamic pricing in the playoffs and increased ticket revenue 30% and could go to that for next season for all games to further increase revenue.

- Dallas, aka the poster boys of a "southern success story." Forbes shows the team in the black for the last 10 years, ranked #10 in franchise value. Claims that the team "lost money" somehow coincided with Tom Hicks assuming $500 million in debt buying Liverpool. The team wasn't bankrupt, Hicks was. Just like the Rangers, who were bankrupt in July and in the World Series in October, there's zero worries for a team with more revenue last year than Minnesota or Pittsburgh.

- Tampa Bay. New ownership, Yzerman in charge, averaged 17,700 over the last nine seasons, including 20,600 the first year after the lockout.

- LA and Anaheim, two teams in Los Angeles with revenues over $85 million. Not much reason to worry there.

Florida and Phoenix are our two struggling southern markets now; and the Islanders continue to be our struggling northern market.

Granted, no one seems to notice or care when the same indicators we use to say "southern failure!" happen to northern teams. Like the Bruins averaging under 15,000 fans in 2007; or the fact that the Blues have had a negative operating income in the last 10 seasons, haven't won a playoff series in eight, and somehow their franchise is valued at $14 million less than it was in 1998.

Of any current NHL team, Houston's market potential most closely resembles Dallas; who's top 10 in revenue and value.


We might not have the cities with mega-populations like they do down south, but we have waaaay more hockey fans per capita, and it's not a bad thing for the NHL to throw a bone to its strongest and most passionate fanbase every once in a while. It has definitely done more than enough for the southern fans, who haven't really responded well.

I don't disagree with any of that.

(Well, okay, I disagree with the "haven't really responded well." If there was any truth to the whole "warm-weather cities just don't get hockey" argument, then getting 15,000 in LA, ANA, SJ, DAL, TB, FLA, ATL, CAR, DAL is pretty freaking incredible. So, I consider it neither "not responding well" or "incredible." It's about what you'd expect. After decades of being relatively exclusive to the north, the NHL basically established the fact that hockey is universally popular).

Despite the fact that I'm always on here "defending" southern markets, I'm actually a traditionalist, and would love to see the return of the Jets moniker, and the Nordiques and Whalers franchises; and I am twice as likely to tune in to my team playing the teams other than FLA, PHX, ATL, CAR and NASH.

And yes, you're 100% correct: We need a team in Quebec before we put a team in Houston.

But I also think that Houston could be key to getting a team in Quebec. Florida is locked in to their lease, and we know the NHL isn't going to want to have a "southern exodus" if the Coyotes move.

Therefore, I think we'd be just fine going to 32 teams with Quebec, Houston and Seattle getting teams and PHX relocating.

THAT is how they should have expanded in the first place: "one large southern market with intense sports passion we think will work and help us grow the game, along with one under-served northern market we know is a slam dunk to be successful." The problem wasn't growing the game. The numbers show the game has grown in terms of participation in the south, the US TV contract, etc, etc. The problem to me has always been the southern expansion.


And by the way, the examination of the Blues financials according to Forbes, would indicate to me that an NHL team in Kansas City should NEVER HAPPEN.
 
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RTN

Be Kind, Rewind
Aug 28, 2008
2,054
3
So, the success of the ECHL Salmon Kings, that opened the door for RG Properties to acquire that WHL team... that's a clear indication that Victoria "isn't a hockey city", obviously.

I'll agree that it's not an _NHL_ city, but I'm increasingly aggravated at the provincial attitudes that "only Canadian Major Juniors and the NHL are actually indications of what are 'hockey cities'".

Considering I'm from Vancouver Island, I think my opinion counts for something.

It has nothing to do with major junior. Nanaimo is probably the best hockey city on Vancouver Island (I'm not from there) and the best they have is junior A.

In Victoria, ECHL was not a success. At least not in the way people thought it would be. If the Salmon Kings were a success, they wouldn't be pushed out of town by a junior team. Victoria's Junior B teams aren't well supported compared to other towns and their junior A team struggled to gain support for many years, though it improved in recent years. Even their minor hockey associations (minus a private club) are fairly weak. Whether WHL can be successful remains to be seen. Victoria may have the biggest population on the Island, but it's far from being a hockey city.

If Kelowna's population could find a way to increase, they would be a better choice than Victoria.
 

wjhl2009fan

Registered User
Nov 13, 2008
9,042
0
Clearly there is a problem with many of the southern teams:

- Carolina, which has an owner of 17 years, who remains committed to the team. Loves the team, doesn't care about year-to-year profit/loss as the team is just one aspect of his portfolio, they won a cup, average about 16,000 fans since the lockout.

- Nashville, with their steady revenue growth since the lockout despite ownership and lease issues still being sorted out, attendance rock steady at the 15,000 mark; one of the few new teams to be developing traditions with the Standing O and the Cellblock; playoff berths in six of seven years and now coming off their first playoff win. Went to dynamic pricing in the playoffs and increased ticket revenue 30% and could go to that for next season for all games to further increase revenue.

- Dallas, aka the poster boys of a "southern success story." Forbes shows the team in the black for the last 10 years, ranked #10 in franchise value. Claims that the team "lost money" somehow coincided with Tom Hicks assuming $500 million in debt buying Liverpool. The team wasn't bankrupt, Hicks was. Just like the Rangers, who were bankrupt in July and in the World Series in October, there's zero worries for a team with more revenue last year than Minnesota or Pittsburgh.

- Tampa Bay. New ownership, Yzerman in charge, averaged 17,700 over the last nine seasons, including 20,600 the first year after the lockout.

- LA and Anaheim, two teams in Los Angeles with revenues over $85 million. Not much reason to worry there.

Florida and Phoenix are our two struggling southern markets now; and the Islanders continue to be our struggling northern market.

Granted, no one seems to notice or care when the same indicators we use to say "southern failure!" happen to northern teams. Like the Bruins averaging under 15,000 fans in 2007; or the fact that the Blues have had a negative operating income in the last 10 seasons, haven't won a playoff series in eight, and somehow their franchise is valued at $14 million less than it was in 1998.

Of any current NHL team, Houston's market potential most closely resembles Dallas; who's top 10 in revenue and value.




I don't disagree with any of that.

(Well, okay, I disagree with the "haven't really responded well." If there was any truth to the whole "warm-weather cities just don't get hockey" argument, then getting 15,000 in LA, ANA, SJ, DAL, TB, FLA, ATL, CAR, DAL is pretty freaking incredible. So, I consider it neither "not responding well" or "incredible." It's about what you'd expect. After decades of being relatively exclusive to the north, the NHL basically established the fact that hockey is universally popular).

Despite the fact that I'm always on here "defending" southern markets, I'm actually a traditionalist, and would love to see the return of the Jets moniker, and the Nordiques and Whalers franchises; and I am twice as likely to tune in to my team playing the teams other than FLA, PHX, ATL, CAR and NASH.

And yes, you're 100% correct: We need a team in Quebec before we put a team in Houston.

But I also think that Houston could be key to getting a team in Quebec. Florida is locked in to their lease, and we know the NHL isn't going to want to have a "southern exodus" if the Coyotes move.

Therefore, I think we'd be just fine going to 32 teams with Quebec, Houston and Seattle getting teams and PHX relocating.

THAT is how they should have expanded in the first place: "one large southern market with intense sports passion we think will work and help us grow the game, along with one under-served northern market we know is a slam dunk to be successful." The problem wasn't growing the game. The numbers show the game has grown in terms of participation in the south, the US TV contract, etc, etc. The problem to me has always been the southern expansion.


And by the way, the examination of the Blues financials according to Forbes, would indicate to me that an NHL team in Kansas City should NEVER HAPPEN.

15.000 Is good but i would not say its incredible i can't see any more teams moving any time soon but again i would say avg 15.000 is good but no its not incredible.
 

headsigh

leave at once!
Oct 5, 2008
9,867
0
Atlanta
ofthesouth.blogspot.com
No more hockey in the south.

50495_111805522214839_6398411_n.jpg
 

Kimota

ROY DU NORD!!!
Nov 4, 2005
39,366
14,309
Les Plaines D'Abraham
Heaven forbid new people enjoy the game.

Not at the expense of people that have always supported hockey. Canada bread hockey players, it cost a lot of money to develop them. They deserve to have teams in the biggest hockey league in the World and actually see these players at their best. Before some dude in Oklahoma.
 

Bear of Bad News

Your Third or Fourth Favorite HFBoards Admin
Sep 27, 2005
13,532
27,046
Sure hockey is fun.

But looking at the stands it looked like only 5 of you thought so.

It's always fun to exaggerate, isn't it?

And to your other point above, hockey's taken off like wildfire in Oklahoma. Free your mind.
 

Blackhawkswincup

RIP Fugu
Jun 24, 2007
187,324
20,742
Chicagoland
Not at the expense of people that have always supported hockey. Canada bread hockey players, it cost a lot of money to develop them. They deserve to have teams in the biggest hockey league in the World and actually see these players at their best. Before some dude in Oklahoma.

Take it you weren't watching hockey in late 90's

Edmonton , Calgary and Vancouver were ghost towns. They couldn't give tickets away
 

KevFu

Registered User
May 22, 2009
9,203
3,435
Phoenix from Rochester via New Orleans
Not at the expense of people that have always supported hockey. Canada bread hockey players, it cost a lot of money to develop them. They deserve to have teams in the biggest hockey league in the World and actually see these players at their best. Before some dude in Oklahoma.


Did I miss the part in the thread where someone said move the Flames, Oilers, Senators, Canadiens, Maple Leafs, Canucks or Thrashers/Jets/TBA to Houston?

I assume this would be about PHX relocating or expansion. Neither at the expense of Canadian fans.
 

dronald

Registered User
Mar 4, 2011
1,171
0
Hamilton, ON
Take it you weren't watching hockey in late 90's

Edmonton , Calgary and Vancouver were ghost towns. They couldn't give tickets away

I think he's saying if you're going to move a team, put it somewhere where people will have much appreication for it rather than taking a risk somewhere where people may not care less.
 

kdb209

Registered User
Jan 26, 2005
14,870
6
Did I miss the part in the thread where someone said move the Flames, Oilers, Senators, Canadiens, Maple Leafs, Canucks or Thrashers/Jets/TBA to Houston?

I assume this would be about PHX relocating or expansion. Neither at the expense of Canadian fans.

Didn't you know, Canada has already claimed the 'Yotes for Quebec City / Hamilton / Toronto / Saskatoon / a 2nd team in Winnipeg (so they keep the Moose & Jets names) / Moose Factory / ...
 

HisIceness

This is Hurricanes Hockey
Sep 16, 2010
40,390
70,958
Charlotte
As said, natural rivalry with the Stars, check. NHL-ready arena, check. History of the sport (no it's not Toronto, Montreal, etc. but for a sunbelt city it's definitely there), check. Growing metro, check.

That said I think getting the Coyotes should they bite the bullet and relocate might be their best chance for a while at snagging an NHL team. From a divisional standpoint it might be the best option too since they wouldn't have to change and would play Dallas 6 times a year.

I might be in Houston for some time during the holidays, if so I definitely would love to check out an Aeros game.

No more hockey in the south.

:rolleyes:
 

JMROWE

Registered User
Apr 2, 2010
1,372
52
Hamilton Ontario
I see Houston getting an NHL. expansion team in 10 years after the market has recovered but right now sunbelt markets are failing & it looks like the NHL. is now trying to distance it self from sunbelt & putting there focus towards putting or keeping teams less riskey markets like Winnipeg , NY. Islanders , Dallas Stars , St. Louis Blues , *Hamilton , *Quebec City & *Seattle .

* Don't have teams yet
 

dronald

Registered User
Mar 4, 2011
1,171
0
Hamilton, ON
Personally, I say no more (as in additional) NHL teams in Canada. In fact, personally, I think there are four or five too many teams in Canada.

Are you ok? Five? So what? That leaves Montreal and Toronto I'm guessing lol...



Or did you forget the :sarcasm: because maybe i'm looking silly for taking you seriously.
 

46zone

Pass me the soft pretzels
Feb 5, 2007
2,662
730
Philadelphia
I seriously doubt the NHL wants to add another small market Canadian team. Hockey is growing rapidly in Texas; having a team in Houston will only push that growth further.
 

dronald

Registered User
Mar 4, 2011
1,171
0
Hamilton, ON
I seriously doubt the NHL wants to add another small market Canadian team. Hockey is growing rapidly in Texas; having a team in Houston will only push that growth further.

Yes, but now that there are 30 teams it's not about what the NHL wants if no one is willing to buy a failing Franchise. The NHL can't just up and buy a team and move them to Houston if someone with bigger pockets is trying to get them to QC.
 
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