Brayden Schenn Part II

[FlyersFan61290]

I'm kinda continuing this from the Buffalo post game thread:

Since the 2012-13 season to date only G, Jake and Simmonds have more pts then Brayden. In that same span he's fifth in ES points behind G, Jake, Simmer and Read with Simmer and Read having only 2 more points then him (aka he's 2 ES pts out of a 3 way tie for 3rd place). In terms of goals he has 36 ES goals behind only Simmonds (38g) and G and Jake (40g a piece).


Choosing to ignore his production is dumb especially since the only reasoning is that Schenn's a complimentary player. Well especially in today's NHL, teams need productive complimentary players. Sure most hoped he'd be more when we acquired him but that doesn't change the facts.

Saying a young winger with his level of production, which this team needs more of not less, isn't worth a 4mil/year extension is ridiculous.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

This summer, Hextall should be offering Raffl a nice little security contract before he plays the whole year on the top line and we can't afford him.

Offer him a 3year deal worth 2 million per and then hope for the next 4 years we get "Burrows" like production with the Sedins.

Plus, he is effective on any line we use him on and can even play C if we run into injury issues.

I do not think that is going to be an issue. I'm not sure what type of extension would put him in the category of not being able to afford him, but I don't think he's looking at anything that substantial unless he absolutely lights it up the remainder of the season. He's got one point in the first nine games, while I think his production will increase, I don't think he puts up much more than what he's been putting up since getting to the NHL, and career 30 points a year doesn't exactly mean big bucks.

 

[Rebels57]

Raffl will be lucky to get re-signed at all with the way he is playing so far. He needs a complete 180 after this lackluster start.

I'm sure it will come for him, but he's been the most dissapointing forward in my opinion.

 

[PALE PWNR]

I'm kinda continuing this from the Buffalo post game thread:

Since the 2012-13 season to date only G, Jake and Simmonds have more pts then Brayden. In that same span he's fifth in ES points behind G, Jake, Simmer and Read with Simmer and Read having only 2 more points then him (aka he's 2 ES pts out of a 3 way tie for 3rd place). In terms of goals he has 36 ES goals behind only Simmonds (38g) and G and Jake (40g a piece).


Choosing to ignore his production is dumb especially since the only reasoning is that Schenn's a complimentary player. Well especially in today's NHL, teams need productive complimentary players. Sure most hoped he'd be more when we acquired him but that doesn't change the facts.

Saying a young winger with his level of production, which this team needs more of not less, isn't worth a 4mil/year extension is ridiculous.

Been pumping those tires forever. He's constantly top 4 on the team in ES Scoring behind G and Jake and a combination of Simmonds, Couturier, Read or Hartnell. The only exception being 2 years ago where hes tied with Hartnell for 5th behind Read Giroux Jake and Simmer.

 

[Rebels57]

I'm kinda continuing this from the Buffalo post game thread:

Since the 2012-13 season to date only G, Jake and Simmonds have more pts then Brayden. In that same span he's fifth in ES points behind G, Jake, Simmer and Read with Simmer and Read having only 2 more points then him (aka he's 2 ES pts out of a 3 way tie for 3rd place). In terms of goals he has 36 ES goals behind only Simmonds (38g) and G and Jake (40g a piece).


Choosing to ignore his production is dumb especially since the only reasoning is that Schenn's a complimentary player. Well especially in today's NHL, teams need productive complimentary players. Sure most hoped he'd be more when we acquired him but that doesn't change the facts.

Saying a young winger with his level of production, which this team needs more of not less, isn't worth a 4mil/year extension is ridiculous.

Good post.

 

[bb12]

Trading schenn would be the biggest mistake this team can make. He has been moved up and down the line up and messed with mentally yet still produces at high levels. He rightfully deserves to be here and deserves a new contract

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

Raffl will be lucky to get re-signed at all with the way he is playing so far. He needs a complete 180 after this lackluster start.

I'm sure it will come for him, but he's been the most dissapointing forward in my opinion.

Yeah, I think even if he had the same season as he had last year he wouldn't be looking at a huge increase. He's making $1.1 million at the moment. Say he put up 35 points this season, which would be a career high. How big of an extension would that warrant? How much would you be willing to spend on him? If they gave him too much more than $2 million, I think that I would probably consider that an overpayment. I mean...imagine the outrage if the Flyers signed a UFA from a different team for more than $2 million that never scored more that was 27 and had a career high of 35 points. I don't see that going over too well if was an outside guy coming and I wouldn't be too thrilled if Raffl got that much.

Now, obviously if he has a huge year or even just a bigger year, that's a different story (one that does not appear to be taking place).

 

[Tripod]

I do not think that is going to be an issue. I'm not sure what type of extension would put him in the category of not being able to afford him, but I don't think he's looking at anything that substantial unless he absolutely lights it up the remainder of the season. He's got one point in the first nine games, while I think his production will increase, I don't think he puts up much more than what he's been putting up since getting to the NHL, and career 30 points a year doesn't exactly mean big bucks.

Look at when I wrote that...it was back in April. Getting Raffl fir 2 million would have been a great deal back then. The way he is playing now, I am fine with trading his ass at the deadline for a pick.

 

[achdumeingute]

I'm kinda continuing this from the Buffalo post game thread:

Since the 2012-13 season to date only G, Jake and Simmonds have more pts then Brayden. In that same span he's fifth in ES points behind G, Jake, Simmer and Read with Simmer and Read having only 2 more points then him (aka he's 2 ES pts out of a 3 way tie for 3rd place). In terms of goals he has 36 ES goals behind only Simmonds (38g) and G and Jake (40g a piece).


Choosing to ignore his production is dumb especially since the only reasoning is that Schenn's a complimentary player. Well especially in today's NHL, teams need productive complimentary players. Sure most hoped he'd be more when we acquired him but that doesn't change the facts.

Saying a young winger with his level of production, which this team needs more of not less, isn't worth a 4mil/year extension is ridiculous.

I have no issue spending money on the right people. I don't see schenn at this point as more than just a guy. He's an invisible player most noghts. I'm already more impressed with laughtons ability.

Committing more $$ to the wrong player for multiple years is going to compound the problem. We have enough passengers already.

I'm still waiting to see some examples of what this guy does to change a game nightly.

 

[Tripod]

I have no issue spending money on the right people. I don't see schenn at this point as more than just a guy. He's an invisible player most noghts. I'm already more impressed with laughtons ability.

Committing more $$ to the wrong player for multiple years is going to compound the problem. We have enough passengers already.

I'm still waiting to see some examples of what this guy does to change a game nightly.

Guys that change a game nightly get way more than 4 million a year.

 

[achdumeingute]

Guys that change a game nightly get way more than 4 million a year.

not as RFAs, mostly.

Game changer may have been too strong....have an impact on the game. Push the play.. ect...too many nights he is invisible.

 

[Tripod]

not as RFAs, mostly.

Game changer may have been too strong....have an impact on the game. Push the play.. ect...too many nights he is invisible.

Kadri 4.1
Bjugstad 4.1

Those will be the guys that just signed that will be used as comparables IMO. And Schenn it scored them both last year.

 

[Appleyard]

not as RFAs, mostly.

Game changer may have been too strong....have an impact on the game. Push the play.. ect...too many nights he is invisible.

Nazem Kadri: age 24: $4.1m
Nick Bjugstad: age 23: $4.1m
Marcus Johansson: age 25: $3.75m
Jakob Silfverberg: age 25: $3.75m

It is the going rate tbh for someone his age in a top 6.

 

[achdumeingute]

Nazem Kadri: age 24: $4.1m
Nick Bjugstad: age 23: $4.1m
Marcus Johansson: age 25: $3.75m
Jakob Silfverberg: age 25: $3.75m

It is the going rate tbh for someone his age in a top 6.

the money isn't my issue, it's us giving it to HIM, related to our cap and existing passengers on the team.

I think those 4 above are better PLAYERS, maybe not kadri, but the leafs are pretty bad.

 

[Appleyard]

the money isn't my issue, it's us giving it to HIM, related to our cap and existing passengers on the team.

I think those 4 above are better PLAYERS, maybe not kadri, but the leafs are pretty bad.

Funny... Schenn has outproduced all 4 of them in the last 2 seasons.

 

[CodyTheHuman]

Funny... Schenn has outproduced all 4 of them in the last 2 seasons.

But that doesn't fit the narrative!

 

[PALE PWNR]

the money isn't my issue, it's us giving it to HIM, related to our cap and existing passengers on the team.

I think those 4 above are better PLAYERS, maybe not kadri, but the leafs are pretty bad.

Why do you think that?

14-15

B Schenn 47 Pts 18 Goals
M Johansson 47 Points 20 Goals
N Kadri 39 Points 20 Goals
J Silfverberg 39 Points 13 Goals
N Bjugstad 43 Points 24 Goals


13-14

B Schenn 41 points 20 Goals
M Johansson 44 points 8 Goals
N Kadri 50 points 20 Goals
J Silfverberg 23 Points 10 Goals
N Bjugstad 38 Points 16 Goals

B Schenn career PPG .49
M Johansson .54
N Kadri .60
J Silfverberg .43
N Bjugstad .52

 

[FlyersFan61290]

Funny... Schenn has outproduced all 4 of them in the last 2 seasons.

Production doesn't win games, pushing the play and being visible does. Who cares if you score a goal when you're not visible doing it!!

Btw, since the 12-13 season to date, Schenn has 13 game winning goals. Only Simmer and G have more with 14 each.

 

[PALE PWNR]

Production doesn't win games, pushing the play and being visible does. Who cares if you score a goal when you're not visible doing it!!

Btw, since the 12-13 season to date, Schenn has 13 game winning goals. Only Simmer and G have more with 14 each.

I almost took this post seriously until I read the last 2 sentences.

 

[Fire Tortorella]

The amount of hate Schenn seemingly gets because he's not "the best prospect not in the NHL" is astounding.

 

[achdumeingute]

Why do you think that?

14-15

B Schenn 47 Pts 18 Goals
M Johansson 47 Points 20 Goals
N Kadri 39 Points 20 Goals
J Silfverberg 39 Points 13 Goals
N Bjugstad 43 Points 24 Goals


13-14

B Schenn 41 points 20 Goals
M Johansson 44 points 8 Goals
N Kadri 50 points 20 Goals
J Silfverberg 23 Points 10 Goals
N Bjugstad 38 Points 16 Goals

B Schenn career PPG .49
M Johansson .54
N Kadri .60
J Silfverberg .43
N Bjugstad .52

not everything is box score/ stat sheet.

IMO brayden is an average skater in terms of speed, agility, and shot.

Bjugstad is better at all those things, plus younger, and 6 6.

JS is more agile/stickhandler/way better shot.
MJ is a better stickhandler.

I'd trade schenn straight up for both NB or JS, in a second.

I am not saying Schenn is not worth 4m, im saying I don't want it to be the Flyers who give it to him.

We already have "4m" tied up in simmonds (better net front presence), couturier (better D, FO%, size, creativity), umberger (would be OK at 2/2.5), read (thought his shot was better, but he''s been a big disappointment), And vinny, who has a great shot, but can't move. In a perfect world, umby and vinny go, not Schenn, but we are stuck here.

Schenn is more grind than skill. We have that in 4 other guys, above. We need some skill around here.

Part of the schenn argument is his points keep rising. I'm not expecting that to continue, because I don't think he has the talent to take it to the next level. I think the guy is what he is.

I'm of the opinion that cup contenders need a 2nd line player who is a B+/A- level. We don't have that now. I'd rather trade Schenn to get a younger guy capable of that ability.

My entire reasoning is to have a team ready to rise in a minimum of 2/max of 4 years. IMO Schenn is better served getting an asset to be ready then (a guy like hertl would be perfect)

 

[achdumeingute]

Funny... Schenn has outproduced all 4 of them in the last 2 seasons.

it's not like he's significantly out pointing here...

 

[Tripod]

not everything is box score/ stat sheet.

IMO brayden is an average skater in terms of speed, agility, and shot.

Bjugstad is better at all those things, plus younger, and 6 6.

JS is more agile/stickhandler/way better shot.
MJ is a better stickhandler.

I'd trade schenn straight up for both NB or JS, in a second.

I am not saying Schenn is not worth 4m, im saying I don't want it to be the Flyers who give it to him.

We already have "4m" tied up in simmonds (better net front presence), couturier (better D, FO%, size, creativity), umberger (would be OK at 2/2.5), read (thought his shot was better, but he''s been a big disappointment), And vinny, who has a great shot, but can't move. In a perfect world, umby and vinny go, not Schenn, but we are stuck here.

Schenn is more grind than skill. We have that in 4 other guys, above. We need some skill around here.

Part of the schenn argument is his points keep rising. I'm not expecting that to continue, because I don't think he has the talent to take it to the next level. I think the guy is what he is.

I'm of the opinion that cup contenders need a 2nd line player who is a B+/A- level. We don't have that now. I'd rather trade Schenn to get a younger guy capable of that ability.

My entire reasoning is to have a team ready to rise in a minimum of 2/max of 4 years. IMO Schenn is better served getting an asset to be ready then (a guy like hertl would be perfect)

Just because you think his points won't rise doesn't make it true.

Think back to Simmonds 60 point season. He played well most of the year. Schenn has yet to have a year where we as fans would say he had a good year. And one if those reasons are how he has been used being thrown around the lineup so much.

Personally, I am ok with trading Simminds for a kings ransom and then have Jake, Schenn and Konecny as our future RWers.

 

[achdumeingute]

Just because you think his points won't rise doesn't make it true.

Think back to Simmonds 60 point season. He played well most of the year. Schenn has yet to have a year where we as fans would say he had a good year. And one if those reasons are how he has been used being thrown around the lineup so much.

Personally, I am ok with trading Simminds for a kings ransom and then have Jake, Schenn and Konecny as our future RWers.

nobody knows what he's going to do, for sure. Just because his points went up the last two years, doesn't mean they will this year, or next year...ect. he might breakout and become the greatest player of all time.

Jonathan Cheechoo scored 90 goals over 2 years....then fell off the map...did he forget how to play? Stats on paper don't tell the full story, always.

I'm asserting my opinion in his lack of ability, that's all I (or anybody here) can do.

I'd trade both Schenn and simmonds.

 

[PALE PWNR]

nobody knows what he's going to do, for sure. Just because his points went up the last two years, doesn't mean they will this year, or next year...ect. he might breakout and become the greatest player of all time.

Jonathan Cheechoo scored 90 goals over 2 years....then fell off the map...did he forget how to play? Stats on paper don't tell the full story, always.

I'm asserting my opinion in his lack of ability, that's all I (or anybody here) can do.

I'd trade both Schenn and simmonds.

His body broke down, he had shoulder surgery and double knee surgery in the same year.

I'm not of the opinion that results are the only thing that matters but his results are the same or close to the same as the guys mentioned in this thread. So his "ability" to put up points is the same as those guys. And as you say he's a grinder as well, which when talking about a guy like Simmonds for example gives him added value because he brings something else to the table, but apparently when talking about Schenn that's a negative? He's got the skill to do good things with the puck and is not afraid of going in the dirty areas around the net or in the corners to win battles. I feel like you just want a team full of Gagner's. In a limited capacity guys like that can work on the team, when your whole team is like that you are the Edmonton Oilers.