Better season 18-19? Crosby or Ovechkin?

[Tuna Tatarrrrrr]

It’s not like Crosby doesn’t have two of his own. But two more nominations make up for the extra hart.

LOL Pens fans... More nominations is more valued than winning the award now.

 

[66-30-33]

Voted Crosby but is this thread just Pens fans picking Crosby laughing at people pick Ovy because points and Caps fans picking Ovy laughing at people picking Crosby because of goals?

 

[FinProspects]

Rather have 3 actual trophies than a bunch of nominations.

1 which was gifted to Ovie due to Sid missing 12 games. Of course Ovie missed out on Hart in 09-10 in a similar way. Nevertheless, the nominations matter as well, like it or not.

 

[amnesiac]

well this poll makes no sense compared to the Hart finalists poll

Crosby 117
Ovie 30

 

[FinProspects]

well this poll makes no sense compared to the Hart finalists poll

Crosby 117
Ovie 30

I think the general thinking is that Sid had better season, but some people just vote for Ovie due to the timing+OP of the thread.

 

[Midnight Judges]

well this poll makes no sense compared to the Hart finalists poll

Crosby 117
Ovie 30

I didn't pick either one for a Hart nomination.

I picked Ovechkin in this poll.

Maybe that explains some of it.

 

[george14]

But to proclaim him as a Finalists no matter what and act like a fortune teller is perfectly reasonable? Same with the Selke. Last time I checked, no one knows. What makes some here so special?

That’s rich. I love your attempt to once again proclaim that you can tell the future and know exactly what I would do. Because apparently ignoring a record 8th Rocket takes a back seat to a supposed Selke and Hart Finalists that may or may not happen, makes perfect sense. Because having more assists than goals is obviously more valuable? Right?

No your problem is your superiority complex. That shows when Crosby is ever talked about, all while making yourself look silly. Your whole post had nothing to do what my original, if you actually read it and didn’t just react out of your sad impulse, you would know this.

Says the guy who continues to cite "8th Rocket" as if that matters at all. The question is this season, not last season or however many years ago.

To say Crosby won't be a Hart finalist is willful ignorance. I also never said half the things you said I did.

Talk about a superiority complex. Crosby will likely be a Hart and Selke finalist. He outproduced Ovechkin point wise and played great two way hockey. What is there to debate? Unless you want to say "no one knows" and pretend as if that is some leg to stand on.

I will never post on this website again if Ovechkin finishes higher than Crosby in Hart voting. There, I put my money where my mouth is since "we don't know".

 

[Voight]

well this poll makes no sense compared to the Hart finalists poll

Crosby 117
Ovie 30

Being higher in Hart voting doesn't not necessarily = being a better player

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Being higher in Hart voting doesn't not necessarily = being a better player

Wasn't someone arguing earlier (and you "liked" their post) that more Hart trophies for Ovechkin means he's a better player than Crosby?

So if more Harts = proof of better player, then wouldn't finishing higher in Hart voting also = proof of better player?

Or does Hart voting/trophies only matter if it doesn't favor Crosby?

 

[JasonRoseEh]

I'm pretty sure that the "goal of hockey" is to win, not just to score goals. There are many things that lead to winning, with goals being probably the biggest factor but certainly not the definitive factor.

How do you win? That's right.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

To take a shot, you need to get the puck first.

The goal (pardon the pun) of a hockey game is to outscore your opponent, goals are the most important thing in a hockey game. It can't even be argued.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

It’s not like Crosby doesn’t have two of his own. But two more nominations make up for the extra hart.

How in the blue heck did you come up with this rational?

 

[Turin]

Crosby is objectively a more impactful player, which says more about him than it does OVs flaws.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

Crosby's most important statistic of 2018-2019 wasn't mentioned in OP:
Skated with a backpack full of Penguins up a very treacherous Metro mountain and into the playoffs*


*Note: He had a Sherpa named Jake Guentzel.


Tough to vote though. I mean.. goals were up through the league - but Ovi netting 50 AGAIN is absolutely noteworthy. Sid carrying the Pens, getting 100 points, being in contention for both MVP and Selke are also absolutely noteworthy. Even when you try and look at the whole thing objectively it's tough. That being said I'd choose Sid for two reasons 1a) He did more for the Pens than Ovi did for the Caps, and 1b) My personal bias.

I can't believe people are still trying to act like this Penguins team is bad, please spare me. They finished with the same points as last year and Murray's SV% since coming back is like .940. They're a good team and far from this nonsense Crosby fanboys try to paint them as in order to prop up Sid. He's great, but stop making it bigger than it is, he has a good team.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

Wasn't someone arguing earlier (and you "liked" their post) that more Hart trophies for Ovechkin means he's a better player than Crosby?

So if more Harts = proof of better player, then wouldn't finishing higher in Hart voting also = proof of better player?

Or does Hart voting/trophies only matter if it doesn't favor Crosby?

You win or you don't win and Hart voting is horse manure anyway. Ovechkin only finishing 9th last year is proof enough after he dragged a carcass of a Caps team to another division title and leading the league in goals again, the proof is in the results. He should have easily been in the top 5 and arguably deserved a finalist nod in 2018.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

I think the general thinking is that Sid had better season, but some people just vote for Ovie due to the timing+OP of the thread.

Not at all and up to the final 10-15 games Ovechkin had a very serious shot at being a finalist. He's ridiculously important to his team, he led the league in goals AGAIN and his team just won the Metro AGAIN. The Caps had a lot of injuries this year to top players and another first line player was suspended for 16 games.

 

[JackSlater]

How do you win? That's right.

By outscoring the other team. "Goals" is not the objective of a team.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

By outscoring the other team. "Goals" is not the objective of a team.

You seriously can't be this daft, goals are literally the objective of a damn team. Like what?

 

[Turin]

You seriously can't be this daft, goals are literally the objective of a damn team. Like what?

Fire the goalies

 

[JasonRoseEh]

Fire the goalies

Goalies jobs are to stop the puck, the goal of a team is to score goals. You guys can't be this stupid. No coach says ok guys let's score no goals today and make sure our goalie stops them all. WTF?

 

[JackSlater]

You seriously can't be this daft, goals are literally the objective of a damn team. Like what?

Goals are not the objective. The objective is winning. You cannot win just by scoring goals.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

You win or you don't win and Hart voting is horse manure anyway. Ovechkin only finishing 9th last year is proof enough after he dragged a carcass of a Caps team to another division title and leading the league in goals again, the proof is in the results. He should have easily been in the top 5 and arguably deserved a finalist nod in 2018.

I'm just trying to clarify here.

So if Player A finishes 1st in Hart voting while Player B finishes 15th, it proves Player A is better because he won. But if Player A finishes 2nd in Hart voting while Player B finishes 15th, you can't conclude Player A had a better year?

So essentially the Hart voting only counts if you win?

That's a bit dubious. That's like saying someone who scored 49 goals didn't really have a better year than someone who scored 20 goals because 49 goals was only good enough for 2nd in the league.

 

[JasonRoseEh]

Goals are not the objective. The objective is winning. You cannot win just by scoring goals.

YOU WIN BY SCORING MORE GOALS THEN THE OPPOSING TEAM. WOW

 

[JasonRoseEh]

I'm just trying to clarify here.

So if Player A finishes 1st in Hart voting while Player B finishes 15th, it proves Player A is better because he won. But if Player A finishes 2nd in Hart voting while Player B finishes 15th, you can't conclude Player A had a better year?

So essentially the Hart voting only counts if you win?

That's a bit dubious. That's like saying someone who scored 49 goals didn't really have a better year than someone who scored 20 goals because 49 goals was only good enough for 2nd in the league. So unless you win the Rocket, then it doesn't matter how much you actually out-score the other guy, they're basically equal without the Rocket win.

Not at all because goals are a real thing, no one votes on them, MVP voting is voted on, it's definitely up for interpretation and error which happens time and again. The NHL rarely gets the MVP wrong though.

I don't prescribe that being a finalist doesn't matter, I think it does, but putting a ton of weight into it doesn't mean much. No one is going to bring up in 10 years that someone was the 2nd runner up 3 times for the MVP award, but they will say that guy scored 50 once.

 

[illpucks]

well this poll makes no sense compared to the Hart finalists poll

Crosby 117
Ovie 30

Sid gets votes because he is Sid.

Remember on NHL.com the experts gave Kucherov 20/21 Hart first place votes. The final first place vote for the Hart was for Alex Ovechkin. No first place Hart votes for Sidney Crosby on NHL.com