Post-Game Talk: Avs vs Kraken: 1st round series | SEA win 4-3

[littletonhockeycoach]

Avs weren't beating those two clubs and I don't have any problem with Seattle, except for that one weirdo on the main boards who is crazy dedicated to the Kraks. However, nobody is getting past Oettinger until otherwise proven. I would love to see Seattle go far, but I think it could be Dallas' year especially if they get Pavelski back sometime.

I agree. I said I thought the Avs would get past Seattle (until they lost the 1st game) but no further. The occasional (not rabid) Avs fan would look at me like I was crazy.

 

[Muffin]

I am not saying I wanted him to call them out like the Jets bloke did, but make a mention as one of the primary reasons why you lost except just going after the "too many mistakes by everyone game." We'll see though how much Avs valued that bottom 6 in the offseason. Actions are louder than words, but for someone as good of a hockey mind as Bednar is, he normally calls it as he sees it and so I don't think he was lying or purposely avoiding that subject. I think he honestly believes Avs lost because of too many turnovers.

I mean we retained our 4th line that which was one of the best line last year. Landeskog and Nuke were obvious big loss but Cogliano and Helm were lowkey big losses too.

 

[The Merchant]

Easy to point fingers at various players, but there's truly only one person to blame for this. What a shame.

 

[nammerus]

f***ing embarrassing display.

 

[Foppa2118]

Yeah the stars weren't the problem. They just didn't have any horses behind them.

Mikko 7 goals 10 points in 7 playoff games. MacKinnon 3 goals 7 points and could have had a 4th goal if it wasn't offsides.

Something was bothering Cale all year physically, but he still played his butt off, and finished with 1 goal 5 points in 6 games. Thought he was outstanding defensively in Game 6 and 7 especially.

Bo had an up and down series but I liked a lot of what he did. Had a huge goal overturned himself on an offsides. He's money from that spot in the circle.

They just didn't have any kind of offensive production whatsoever outside of them though. That and Grubauer outplaying Georgie in a tight series were the key reasons for the loss IMO.

 

[Avs2022]

I have no problem with ERod, I just don't want him to be relied upon to be a 2nd liner.

Exactly. I think he'd make a really good 3rd liner who can finish, especially when he won't be matched up often against the other teams best defensive forwards

 

[dahrougem2]

Exactly. I think he'd make a really good 3rd liner who can finish, especially when he won't be matched up often against the other teams best defensive forwards

Oh you'll be sadly mistaken.

Time and time again teams have gotten fooled by Rodrigues. I think he comes back if he is cheap because Avs are desperate, but this is a player who NEEDS to play with stars to produce. He cannot play a bottom six role and produce. Never has, never will.

 

[Avs2022]

Easy to point fingers at various players, but there's truly only one person to blame for this. What a shame.

This isn't true. Nuke had a goal.

 

[Raucherhusten]

Well, i'm actually glad that the "season from hell" is over.

They tried, even today i feel they deserved better, but at the end of it it wasn't enough.

Hockey gods failed us, CMac failed us, and to top it all off, Nuke failed us.

This wasn't our year - maybe the next one is. We'll see.

My guess is, a lot will change in the next 4+ month. Cogs, EJ & Helm are likely done,
the future is uncertain for Landy & Nuke, our entire middle six need a HUGE shakeup
and Mac will make (almost) a billion $ next year. Changes are unavoidable and necessary.

Take care fellas, see ya'll later!

Edit: LOL @ the Bruins. 65 wins my ass motherf*ckers

 

[BaconNater]

Eller was probably so confused to be traded to a team with worse depth than where he came lol

 

[Shinjuku Calling]

Glad the Bruins blowing it so badly will overshadow the Avs a bit lol

 

[henchman21]

Time for me to grieve a bit.

I'll keep this to this series and other posts to relevant threads.

On the Seattle side...Seattle was the better team in this series. Their depth and speed just gave the Avs absolute fits. Their system was ultra aggressive on the puck relenting no space to the Avs... and they had the skating to execute on it. I've never been a Hakstol fan, but he coached his ass off in this series. Seattle was more prepared and just punched the Avs in the mouth... to where it turned out the Avs didn't have anybody to punch back beyond the top line. Grubauer was spectacular in this series. I expect this comment to get some hate, but he was flat out awesome for them. Still had a couple stinkers, but he legitimately only had 1 bad game vs 5 great games. His GSAA is 2nd to only Shesty in the playoffs right now. Gourde was Gourde and that line was a huge part of this win. Ther job was to match up against the top line more often than not and tread water. For the most part they did that... and then some. That was overall Seattle's top scoring line and while holding MacK and Rants down.

Now for the Avs:

The depth on this team is putrid. No other way to split it... the bottom 6 forwards and bottom 2 defensemen are just not capable of their roles. This cost the Avs dearly in this series. They simply couldn't even tread water in their matchups... which really gave Seattle the edge for 2 or 3 of the shifts. It also caused the top guys for the Avs to play WAY too much. The top forwards were all out of gas multiple times in this series... but last night's 3rd after the offsides goal just showed how little was left in the tank.

George... he wasn't flat out bad per se, but he was very far from good. He has a negative GSAA for the series. Of his 18 goals against, I legitimately think at least 5 were very savable... he saves even 2 or 3 of those and the Avs move on. People will point to .914 and say that is good enough... but goaltending is more than just an average over time. It is not letting in bad goals. It is holding momentum. It is keeping your team tied when facing a ton of pressure so they can actually play with a lead to start a game. It isn't a scarlet letter situation here, but he simply has to be better. Avs are locked into him for a couple more years. He needs a better showing in next year's playoffs.

Compher... well... he's still Compher. He did an admirable job during the season and held court as a 2C. Best season of his career by far. That said, pretty clear to see he isn't a 2C by playoff team standards. Avs gotta find a solution at center. I hope he gets paid, but I hope it isn't here.

Now the biggest positive of the series was Rantanen. He still did his disappearing act and his terrible game but score two goals thing... but he was the Avs' best player in this series by a pretty large gap. When the Avs needed something, he was the most consistent guy to bring it. I think he played really well over all.

Which brings me to MacKinnon. The stat sheet will show 7 points. The highlights will show his dancing and taking over some shifts. But I think he had a pretty bad series. Some games he was pretty invisible or he'd only have ~2 of those shifts. He got some luck on his production (and some bad luck on not producing too). When he was away from Rants and Makar though, he was pretty terrible. All 3 of them together on the ice resulted in a ~76% xGF. Just Mikko and MacK, ~54%. MacK away from them ~48%. That simply isn't good enough from him. He needs to be able to row the boat on his own if needed. That's why he's a superstar and paid like one. We know he can produce and we know he can step up in the playoffs. That doesn't change him laying an egg in this series.

With Makar I'm expecting some sort of injury news. If he's healthy and performed like he did (which honestly is still great, just below our standards)... that is real disappointing. He wasn't nearly as impactful as he normally is, so hopefully there is a reason.

Another positive though, Toews. I thought he was spectacular in this series. Great defense, activating well, moved the puck... just was great. Consistently the Avs' best defensemen. After a ho-hum season for him, this was good to see.

The two bigger defensive names (Byram and G) left were a real disappointment. G's playoff struggles continue. The book is clear at this point... he needs a cycle buster who can also move the puck next to him. If he doesn't have that, he's going to struggle in the playoffs. He'll struggle from time to time anyway even with that player, but it will mitigate some of it. Byram... some bright flash, but a lot of mistake prone and riverboat hockey. His worst game was with Makar out when the Avs needed him to step up. He also couldn't provide enough offensive spark through the series either. I know many want to push him next to Makar and move Toews... I think the Avs will take a step back if they do that. Byram would have to take a pretty massive leap for that pairing to be as effective.

The bottom 6 as a whole was complete trash. Those players have to hold court and provide energy. They didn't. Which shouldn't be surprising since they are filled with 4th liners or worse... many of them not physical or spark plug types. I don't really blame the players on this so much as the front office. If you're going to go the cheap route, you gotta find more impactful players.

EJ, JMFJ, and Manson... these guys are all done. I know the injury will come up with Manson, and being injured plays into it... he's just lost a few steps though. If you watched him 5 years ago in Anaheim, you'd see how much of shell of a player he really is now. Back then, he could not only keep up, but he was a better skater than most NHLers. Today, he's behind the play and falling further behind the play. It leads to penalties and gaps in coverage. His deal is an anchor. EJ and JMFJ... they are just old. Not necessarily their fault they suck, but time they are put out to pasture.

I'm also pretty frustrated with Bednar here. Seattle's gameplan isn't complicated, nor did it take Bednar for surprise (he stated this). He didn't adjust his gameplan against Seattle's forecheck at all. Nor did he do anything in coverage to help break the cycle. He stuck with his plan and felt his guys would out talent Seattle. That just never happened. There were adjustments to be made here that would have worked to lessen Seattle's pressure... he chose to rely on talent instead.

Lastly, Nuke was the straw... whatever happened and him not taking part after game 2 was really the end. Maybe not for this series, but for this season. Even making it to round 2 would have had the Avs' rolled by Dallas.

 

[nammerus]

Time for me to grieve a bit.

I'll keep this to this series and other posts to relevant threads.

On the Seattle side...Seattle was the better team in this series. Their depth and speed just gave the Avs absolute fits. Their system was ultra aggressive on the puck relenting no space to the Avs... and they had the skating to execute on it. I've never been a Hakstol fan, but he coached his ass off in this series. Seattle was more prepared and just punched the Avs in the mouth... to where it turned out the Avs didn't have anybody to punch back beyond the top line. Grubauer was spectacular in this series. I expect this comment to get some hate, but he was flat out awesome for them. Still had a couple stinkers, but he legitimately only had 1 bad game vs 5 great games. His GSAA is 2nd to only Shesty in the playoffs right now. Gourde was Gourde and that line was a huge part of this win. Ther job was to match up against the top line more often than not and tread water. For the most part they did that... and then some. That was overall Seattle's top scoring line and while holding MacK and Rants down.

Now for the Avs:

The depth on this team is putrid. No other way to split it... the bottom 6 forwards and bottom 2 defensemen are just not capable of their roles. This cost the Avs dearly in this series. They simply couldn't even tread water in their matchups... which really gave Seattle the edge for 2 or 3 of the shifts. It also caused the top guys for the Avs to play WAY too much. The top forwards were all out of gas multiple times in this series... but last night's 3rd after the offsides goal just showed how little was left in the tank.

George... he wasn't flat out bad per se, but he was very far from good. He has a negative GSAA for the series. Of his 18 goals against, I legitimately think at least 5 were very savable... he saves even 2 or 3 of those and the Avs move on. People will point to .914 and say that is good enough... but goaltending is more than just an average over time. It is not letting in bad goals. It is holding momentum. It is keeping your team tied when facing a ton of pressure so they can actually play with a lead to start a game. It isn't a scarlet letter situation here, but he simply has to be better. Avs are locked into him for a couple more years. He needs a better showing in next year's playoffs.

Compher... well... he's still Compher. He did an admirable job during the season and held court as a 2C. Best season of his career by far. That said, pretty clear to see he isn't a 2C by playoff team standards. Avs gotta find a solution at center. I hope he gets paid, but I hope it isn't here.

Now the biggest positive of the series was Rantanen. He still did his disappearing act and his terrible game but score two goals thing... but he was the Avs' best player in this series by a pretty large gap. When the Avs needed something, he was the most consistent guy to bring it. I think he played really well over all.

Which brings me to MacKinnon. The stat sheet will show 7 points. The highlights will show his dancing and taking over some shifts. But I think he had a pretty bad series. Some games he was pretty invisible or he'd only have ~2 of those shifts. He got some luck on his production (and some bad luck on not producing too). When he was away from Rants and Makar though, he was pretty terrible. All 3 of them together on the ice resulted in a ~76% xGF. Just Mikko and MacK, ~54%. MacK away from them ~48%. That simply isn't good enough from him. He needs to be able to row the boat on his own if needed. That's why he's a superstar and paid like one. We know he can produce and we know he can step up in the playoffs. That doesn't change him laying an egg in this series.

With Makar I'm expecting some sort of injury news. If he's healthy and performed like he did (which honestly is still great, just below our standards)... that is real disappointing. He wasn't nearly as impactful as he normally is, so hopefully there is a reason.

Another positive though, Toews. I thought he was spectacular in this series. Great defense, activating well, moved the puck... just was great. Consistently the Avs' best defensemen. After a ho-hum season for him, this was good to see.

The two bigger defensive names (Byram and G) left were a real disappointment. G's playoff struggles continue. The book is clear at this point... he needs a cycle buster who can also move the puck next to him. If he doesn't have that, he's going to struggle in the playoffs. He'll struggle from time to time anyway even with that player, but it will mitigate some of it. Byram... some bright flash, but a lot of mistake prone and riverboat hockey. His worst game was with Makar out when the Avs needed him to step up. He also couldn't provide enough offensive spark through the series either. I know many want to push him next to Makar and move Toews... I think the Avs will take a step back if they do that. Byram would have to take a pretty massive leap for that pairing to be as effective.

The bottom 6 as a whole was complete trash. Those players have to hold court and provide energy. They didn't. Which shouldn't be surprising since they are filled with 4th liners or worse... many of them not physical or spark plug types. I don't really blame the players on this so much as the front office. If you're going to go the cheap route, you gotta find more impactful players.

EJ, JMFJ, and Manson... these guys are all done. I know the injury will come up with Manson, and being injured plays into it... he's just lost a few steps though. If you watched him 5 years ago in Anaheim, you'd see how much of shell of a player he really is now. Back then, he could not only keep up, but he was a better skater than most NHLers. Today, he's behind the play and falling further behind the play. It leads to penalties and gaps in coverage. His deal is an anchor. EJ and JMFJ... they are just old. Not necessarily their fault they suck, but time they are put out to pasture.

I'm also pretty frustrated with Bednar here. Seattle's gameplan isn't complicated, nor did it take Bednar for surprise (he stated this). He didn't adjust his gameplan against Seattle's forecheck at all. Nor did he do anything in coverage to help break the cycle. He stuck with his plan and felt his guys would out talent Seattle. That just never happened. There were adjustments to be made here that would have worked to lessen Seattle's pressure... he chose to rely on talent instead.

Lastly, Nuke was the straw... whatever happened and him not taking part after game 2 was really the end. Maybe not for this series, but for this season. Even making it to round 2 would have had the Avs' rolled by Dallas.

The days of comparing Mac to McDrai are pretty much over now after seeing their performances this first round.

 

[S E P H]

I mean we retained our 4th line that which was one of the best line last year. Landeskog and Nuke were obvious big loss but Cogliano and Helm were lowkey big losses too.

I would blame more of it on the lack of success from the third line. Malgin though had a good season, disappeared in the playoffs, Eller has no offence whatsoever (I think he was up to playing the 2nd line), and Newhook is just a nightmare to watch all around.

That team yesterday was pretty much this...
Leh - MacK - Rant
XXX - XX - XXX
Erod - JTC - Malgin/LOC
Nieto - Eller - Cogs

That was forced to play as...

Leh - MacK - Rant
Erod - Eller - JTC
LBN - New - LOC
Hunt - Meyers - Malgin

I get the idea that every team has injuries, but you can make a solid debate Avs had it worse than any team. Not because of the number of personnel, but the quality of them.

 

[RampoSanta]

More people need to talk about it. Too many cowards in the national media though. Parros is an embarrassment and shouldn't be allowed to make these decisions.

This tweet needs to be on every page.... Courtesy bump for all

 

[Hennessy]

I've never understood why not one of the journalists that constantly whines about the NHL league office never actually use their chance during an interview to ask direct, pointed questions. They actually have the ability to ask a question of Daily, Bettman, Parros, etc. But instead, they kiss the ring finger during interviews.

Same with most press anywhere. Once you get access you don't want to lose it.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

 

[hawk30]

Makar is right, he didn't play well enough.

 

[Avs_19]

O’Reilly vibes.

A Flames deal next, just like O’Reilly? @The Kingslayer

 

[The Kingslayer]

O’Reilly vibes.

A Flames deal next, just like O’Reilly? @The Kingslayer

This guy can't wait to go home.

 

[Northern Avs Fan]

Log in to discuss next game:

 

[S E P H]

George... he wasn't flat out bad per se, but he was very far from good. He has a negative GSAA for the series. Of his 18 goals against, I legitimately think at least 5 were very savable... he saves even 2 or 3 of those and the Avs move on. People will point to .914 and say that is good enough... but goaltending is more than just an average over time. It is not letting in bad goals. It is holding momentum. It is keeping your team tied when facing a ton of pressure so they can actually play with a lead to start a game. It isn't a scarlet letter situation here, but he simply has to be better. Avs are locked into him for a couple more years. He needs a better showing in next year's playoffs.

100% agree here, as I mentioned after game 3 or so that he was allowing a lot of outside body shots similar to Budaj. Also, a weird number of goals he let in from like falling over or trying to make a save in a weird way from losing his balance or something. That was also similar to Samsonov, but Samsonov has the athletic ability to overcome it when Georgiev has his limits.

 

[henchman21]

100% agree here, as I mentioned after game 3 or so that he was allowing a lot of outside body shots similar to Budaj. Also, a weird number of goals he let in from like falling over or trying to make a save in a weird way from losing his balance or something. That was also similar to Samsonov, but Samsonov has the athletic ability to overcome it when Georgiev has his limits.

Yeah... these tends to be issues that come out with nerves too. Just being slightly off a will make these more noticable, and then they work to compensate... which just makes things worse. I'm not going to blast off one playoff series, but George will have to rebound next year in the playoffs.

 

[S E P H]

Yeah... these tends to be issues that come out with nerves too. Just being slightly off a will make these more noticable, and then they work to compensate... which just makes things worse. I'm not going to blast off one playoff series, but George will have to rebound next year in the playoffs.

I have a lot more faith in him than any goaler since Varlamov. Grubauer was very good at times here but always had consistency issues and I think we'll see some of that in round 2.