Rumor: AVS Proposals/Rumors/Free Agents & Related Topics 2016-17 Part VIII

[BK Avs]

Hanifin carries more value than Z. I think he meant we get Hanifin like we predicted we will get Z.

Definitely true. But MD's contract I think makes him a little more valuable that ROR. And obviously CAR's 2nd won't be as good at 31OA, probably somewhere in the late 40s, early 50s. Not sure how Roy compares to Compher.

 

[UncleRisto]

Duchene has more value than ROR. Should be by a fair margin, all things considered, IMO. And so does Hanifin compared to Zads, yes.

 

[lonelybadger]

Maybe we can convince Carolina that Siemens is worth Roy?

I shall predict duchene + UFA to be + Siemens for hanifin + Roy + conditional pick.

 

[dahrougem2]

Duchene has more value than ROR. Should be by a fair margin, all things considered, IMO. And so does Hanifin compared to Zads, yes.

He absolutely has more value than ROR

Maybe we can convince Carolina that Siemens is worth Roy?

I shall predict duchene + UFA to be + Siemens for hanifin + Roy + conditional pick.

Siemens isn't valued around the league. At this point, he's an AHL player with a chance to become a 6/7 in the NHL, that's it. Nothing of value there in a trade

 

[lonelybadger]

He absolutely has more value than ROR


Siemens isn't valued around the league. At this point, he's an AHL player with a chance to become a 6/7 in the NHL, that's it. Nothing of value there in a trade

The sad truth.

If they are targeting duchene to make the playoffs. Duchene + tyutin for hanifin + Roy makes sense in my mind. Hanifin is playing behind slavin and Hainsey, tyutin slides into the 3rd pairing providing some cagey vet presence and duchene gives them a top offensive center.

Avs get a big center prospect they are apparently looking for, an NHL ready top flight d prospect they need.

 

[henchman21]

The sad truth.

If they are targeting duchene to make the playoffs. Duchene + tyutin for hanifin + Roy makes sense in my mind. Hanifin is playing behind slavin and Hainsey, tyutin slides into the 3rd pairing providing some cagey vet presence and duchene gives them a top offensive center.

Avs get a big center prospect they are apparently looking for, an NHL ready top flight d prospect they need.

Where is this coming from? The Avs have had chances to target those players in the draft and haven't.

 

[RockLobster]

Why?

Can anyone help me out?

I think, as others have said, that TSN (likely with a lot of input from people like Dreger, McKenzie, and LeBrun) also weighs the "likelihood of a trade" into their list.

I'm confident that Carolina wants Duchene...that they want him REALLY bad. And that they also place a good value on having him before the deadline to help with this year's playoff run, and next (at a minimum). I think that's where he ends up.

 

[lonelybadger]

At this point with the locker room issues that have finally started to surface (including the benching of MacKinnon) something has to happen. I love Duchene , one of my top avs of all time but it makes sense he is the one to go. Carolina makes sense as the trading partner. The big pieces of the trade (Duchene Hanifin) make sense for both sides, it is the extras that make it a bit harder.

I do agree though that it is duchene + (maybe vet rental) for hanifin + prospect + conditional draft pick.

 

[Ivan13]

I don't see Canes adding a thing to Hanifin in order to get Matt.

 

[JoemAvs]

At this point with the locker room issues that have finally started to surface (including the benching of MacKinnon) something has to happen. I love Duchene , one of my top avs of all time but it makes sense he is the one to go. Carolina makes sense as the trading partner. The big pieces of the trade (Duchene Hanifin) make sense for both sides, it is the extras that make it a bit harder.

I do agree though that it is duchene + (maybe vet rental) for hanifin + prospect + conditional draft pick.

Those lockerroom rumors right now seem to entirely be about MacKinnon throwing hissy fits.

So if we want to fix it, he is the one to go....


Kid is 21 and not used to losing. So we should probably not put too much weight on it.

The only thing to take away from it is IMO that Mac is not captain material for atleast the next 5 years or so.


I think by now everyone agrees that Duchene to Carolina for Hanifin as the base of a deal is right now the best case scenario for us if Sakic is dead set on shaking things up.

We will see if it happens.
If he goes to Carolina, I can't envision a deal without Hanifin so I am fine with it.

The one thing I am most concerned about right now are those Landeskog to LA rumors.

Those IMO are very worrisome and there is basically no upside to any deal with LA for us.


I'd rather do the EJ for Drouin deal Dater was throwing at the wall to see if its sticks before I consider any deal with LA.

And I am not a huge fan of reuniting Mac and Drouin and think EJ should be kept...


@Ivan:

Depends. Let say the deal revolves around Duchene + Tyutin (Hanifin replacement)+ Grigorenko/Comeau/Iggy for Hanifin + Roy + 2nd.

Don't think that is impossible. If the Canes trade for Duchene, they want to go for it right now.
Might as well make it a bigger deal.

Avs seem to like this when it comes to bigger deals. EJ for Shatty/Stewart involved plenty of moving pieces. So did the ROR deal.

Also if the Canes are really desperate for Duchene as RL seems to be indicating, there certainly is a good case to be made that they have to add to Hanifin to land him. We will see. I hope something around those two gets done. If the Avs can squeeze out a bit more than all the better.

 

[dahrougem2]

I don't see Canes adding a thing to Hanifin in order to get Matt.

I do. 2.5 years left on his contract, I don't foresee this being a straight 1-for-1 swap.

 

[Avs44]

Before the Jones / Johansen swap, Columbus fans, and many 'neutral' fans, were adamant that Nashville would be adding. Pieces like Fiala, Nashville's 1st, etc., were thrown about. If Duchene / Hanifin happens, I don't think Carolina will be adding in any significant value to the deal. It'll be straight up, or pieces added to both sides of similiar value.

 

[RockyMtnRedhawk]

I do. 2.5 years left on his contract, I don't foresee this being a straight 1-for-1 swap.

Agree. I don't think the adds will be as much as the ROR-Zadorov framework, but I do think it would be a pick (2nd?) OR a prospect, instead of a pick (2nd), NHL player (Grigorenko), AND a prospect (Compher).

 

[dahrougem2]

Before the Jones / Johansen swap, Columbus fans, and many 'neutral' fans, were adamant that Nashville would be adding. Pieces like Fiala, Nashville's 1st, etc., were thrown about. If Duchene / Hanifin happens, I don't think Carolina will be adding in any significant value to the deal. It'll be straight up, or pieces added to both sides of similiar value.

I think this is a different scenario, though.

While Johansen had just scored 33 goals as a 21 year old, I believe the Predators were still trading for a bit of potential when dealing Jones.

The Hurricanes know exactly what they're getting in Duchene. A guy who can be a 1st line centre, a guy who Hockey Canada has turned to multiple times for the Olympics/World Cup, and a guy still signed for 2.5 more seasons.

 

[Ivan13]

Those lockerroom rumors right now seem to entirely be about MacKinnon throwing hissy fits.

So if we want to fix it, he is the one to go....


Kid is 21 and not used to losing. So we should probably not put too much weight on it.

The only thing to take away from it is IMO that Mac is not captain material for atleast the next 5 years or so.


I think by now everyone agrees that Duchene to Carolina for Hanifin as the base of a deal is right now the best case scenario for us if Sakic is dead set on shaking things up.

We will see if it happens.
If he goes to Carolina, I can't envision a deal without Hanifin so I am fine with it.

The one thing I am most concerned about right now are those Landeskog to LA rumors.

Those IMO are very worrisome and there is basically no upside to any deal with LA for us.


I'd rather do the EJ for Drouin deal Dater was throwing at the wall to see if its sticks before I consider any deal with LA.

And I am not a huge fan of reuniting Mac and Drouin and think EJ should be kept...


@Ivan:

Depends. Let say the deal revolves around Duchene + Tyutin (Hanifin replacement)+ Grigorenko/Comeau/Iggy for Hanifin + Roy + 2nd.

Don't think that is impossible. If the Canes trade for Duchene, they want to go for it right now.
Might as well make it a bigger deal.

Avs seem to like this when it comes to bigger deals. EJ for Shatty/Stewart involved plenty of moving pieces. So did the ROR deal.

Also if the Canes are really desperate for Duchene as RL seems to be indicating, there certainly is a good case to be made that they have to add to Hanifin to land him. We will see. I hope something around those two gets done. If the Avs can squeeze out a bit more than all the better.

They might be desperate, but they aren't stupid. Tyutin and the rest of the stuff you threw in from our side means little for them. I don't see them adding Roy to Hanifin if we offer that, let alone throw in a 2nd rounder for good measure. They need to keep forward prospects and develop them just like we do, not throw them away for over the hill forwards or guys who are on their way to Russia. What they can move is D.

Before the Jones / Johansen swap, Columbus fans, and many 'neutral' fans, were adamant that Nashville would be adding. Pieces like Fiala, Nashville's 1st, etc., were thrown about. If Duchene / Hanifin happens, I don't think Carolina will be adding in any significant value to the deal. It'll be straight up, or pieces added to both sides of similiar value.

Pretty much.

 

[dahrougem2]

ryjo basically had the same until he'd be eligible for UFA and he returned seth jones.

IIRC he had 1.5 years left

 

[henchman21]

Hanifin for all of his upside doesn't have Duchene value right now. Carolina will have to add something significant. Duchene is a low end #1C/elite #2C with 2.5 years on a good contract.

 

[InjuredChoker]

IIRC he had 1.5 years left

1.5 in his contract at the time, but he's RFA when its over, meaning after this season. he'd be UFA after next season.

 

[dahrougem2]

1.5 in his contract at the time, but he's RFA when its over, meaning after this season. he'd be UFA after next season.

True, but are we sure RyJo doesn't have ROR issues when it comes to contract

 

[Colorado Avalanche]

Hanifin for all of his upside doesn't have Duchene value right now. Carolina will have to add something significant. Duchene is a low end #1C/elite #2C with 2.5 years on a good contract.

I agree with this. Caroline has to add. Price should be very high.

 

[InjuredChoker]

True, but are we sure RyJo doesn't have ROR issues when it comes to contract

it's possible but the way i'm looking at this, canes would pay for 2.5 years of duchene and chance to negotiate with exclusive rights/earlier than others and the preds did the same for ryjo.

duchene isn't ryjo.

hanifin isn't seth jones.

but the base is there imo.

 

[UncleRisto]

Duchene + possible terrible scrub for Hanifin + some kind of forward prospect (+ pick depending on the prospect). Should be doable. Get er done.

 

[lonelybadger]

I still think Duchene has more value today than Johansen did, especially with Johansen's hold out and mullet.

Hanifin has less value than Jones, Jones was a guy that challenged for 1st overall and is a RD which the big media pundits say is always in higher demand than LD.

Duchene's value vs O'Reilly's value is similar to hanifin vs Zadorov so the return should be more than just Hanifin.

Maybe it's duchene + bourque for hanifin + prospect + draft pick.

Also I don't see a big issue of MacKinnon throwing a "hissy fit" at players during the game. He's been their best player, and has been one of the few constantly trying. Hes frustrated, he's showing emotion which is better than the majority of avs players that just show up expecting to lose, float through the game then go home. Bednar didn't chastise Beauch for calling out the team in practice despite the fact he is one of the biggest reasons for the teams failures.

 

[henchman21]

I still think Duchene has more value today than Johansen did, especially with Johansen's hold out and mullet.

Hanifin has less value than Jones, Jones was a guy that challenged for 1st overall and is a RD which the big media pundits say is always in higher demand than LD.

Duchene's value vs O'Reilly's value is similar to hanifin vs Zadorov so the return should be more than just Hanifin.

Maybe it's duchene + bourque for hanifin + prospect + draft pick.

That definitely increased RyJo's value.

 

[tigervixxxen]

All this talk about Nicolas Roy, quite ironic given he was a 4th round pick.