Though I'd pop back in since it's been so quite on the (Duchene) western front, lol.
Fleury is unlikely to turn into the franchise d-man you're after. But he's big, very defensively responsible, smooth skating, and will almost assuredly end up as a very good 2nd pair NHL d-man (he'll start in Carolina in the 3rd pair this year).
I understand the hesitation in going with an all futures package. To mitigate that, instead of just picks or prospects, what if Teravainen were included? Kid doesn't turn 23 until September, is very versatile, and tallied 15 goals and 27 assists last year. He probably hasn't even reached full physical maturity yet. Again, maybe not the home run potential of some extremely young prospects, but nowhere near the risk, either. You know he's going to provide a nice contribution at the NHL level.
I know the above as a base isn't what you want, I only ask compared to what is most likely being offered by other teams still in the mix.
I can't imagine that this offer beats what is currently on the table from CBJ in any way.Though I'd pop back in since it's been so quite on the (Duchene) western front, lol.
Fleury is unlikely to turn into the franchise d-man you're after. But he's big, very defensively responsible, smooth skating, and will almost assuredly end up as a very good 2nd pair NHL d-man (he'll start in Carolina in the 3rd pair this year).
I understand the hesitation in going with an all futures package. To mitigate that, instead of just picks or prospects, what if Teravainen were included? Kid doesn't turn 23 until September, is very versatile, and tallied 15 goals and 27 assists last year. He probably hasn't even reached full physical maturity yet. Again, maybe not the home run potential of some extremely young prospects, but nowhere near the risk, either. You know he's going to provide a nice contribution at the NHL level.
I know the above as a base isn't what you want, I only ask compared to what is most likely being offered by other teams still in the mix.
There is no joint effort by the GMs, there just applying the same tactics. Once they saw that a GM could disrespect him publicly without consequence they felt they had a license to do the same.
''Ganging up'' was not the right wording.
I can't imagine that this offer beats what is currently on the table from CBJ in any way.
I am also pretty sure that Sakic would rather deal him to CBJ than to CAR if the offers are comparable given that you guys did not budge on Hanifin.
But at this point we can only speculate what really is on the table.
But I really don't think Fleury + Teuvo is close to getting it done.
I wouldn't even consider it personally and I am pretty sure we have been offered more than that.
I have my heart set on PLD which is probably not great cause now it won't happen. But at this point Carlsson+ PLD would have me itching to pull the trigger. A pick on top and I'm happy. PLD is legit. Some BJ fans seemed receptive to that package on the main board.
Not that it takes away from your conclusion, but no one knows for sure if RF was willing to budge on Hanifin or not, especially at the trade deadline. Don't forget that Sakic's reported asking price when all this started would have been Hanifin++(+?). At some point Sakic could well have turned down a deal that included Hanifin.
But you allude to a point that I've wondered about, as well. Given the positioning of both orgs, Avs and Canes seem like natural trade partners. But presumably Sakic and Francis started negotiating very early on, when demands were probably very far apart. I wonder if that might have led to somewhat of a confrontational vibe, which might make it harder for the 2 to get a Duchene deal done now as compared to Sakic dealing with a different GM?
Would you give Markov 7.5 on a one year deal and a limited no trade? Give him more dollars now to buy away from that 2nd year he wants, then give him his pick of contenders at the deadline if Colorado is out of it?
Would you give Markov 7.5 on a one year deal and a limited no trade? Give him more dollars now to buy away from that 2nd year he wants, then give him his pick of contenders at the deadline if Colorado is out of it?
No.
Avs need to stop doing stupid ****. Not do more of it.
I wouldn't mind Markov on a 1 year deal. Not for 7.5M though.
6.5M would be the most I would give him. And with the clear intention to flip him at the deadline for a 2nd+. No trade protections.
Avs really could use some more pieces to sell at next years deadline.
And not sure we could get more value out of any UFA out there than Markov at the deadline.
That is also under the assumption that Markov won't make too much of a difference for this team.
I mean our tanking solely relies on Varly anyways. If he really is 100% healthy and back to his old self, we are probably in trouble anyways if we want to get a good shot at Dahlin...
with the clear intention to flip him at the deadline for a 2nd+. No trade protections.
Avs really could use some more pieces to sell at next years deadline.
If the player is all fine and good with that strategy then hell yeah, we should damn well be doing this kind of thing.
I think it all comes from a bad evaluation of their own assets....Sakic must realize that he is selling a player who had a bad season and bad world championship......Francis is selling a young talented player who could become a star like Duchene in 2/3 years....but he might just be a good young D (second pair D)...so for that risk Sakic should just ask for a 1st round choice in 2018....that's all......
If the player is all fine and good with that strategy then hell yeah, we should damn well be doing this kind of thing.
I mentioned this twitter and got some disagreements but I would be ok giving up both Carlsson and Murray to get Duchene. I don’t see the upside in Carlsson that others do. I see him as someone who tops out as maybe a second pair defencemen if everything breaks right. I see him getting exposed in the NHL next season. Regardless he should not be the reason this deal doesn’t get done. Murray is another story. He's shown he can play on the top pair, as he did with Seth Jones in the 2015-16 season. He has all the talent but just can’t stay healthy and put it all together. His loss would be felt, but it’s hard to count on Murray with his injury history. It might be time for another organization to take a chance on him. Moving both defencemen, a prospect like Sonny Milano or a first round pick is something the Jackets should do. That would open a hole on the third pair but it could easily be filled by a UFA defencemen, like a Cody Franson.
Sakic won't trade with the Canes if their entire top four is off the table. For better or worse, I'm fairly confident in that. I also understand the Canes' perspective, but they won't be getting really high end forward talent that isn't 1) A year to UFA, or 2) Aging, if they keep holding those pieces off the table. If they still want to add a top six forward they should have gotten MoJo - unless they were on his NTC list I suppose. But that's the type of player they should be targeting with what appears to be available.
Carlsson + Murray + Milano + 1st? Yes please.
Interesting piece from the Jackets' side:
Carlsson + Murray + Milano + 1st? Yes please.
http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Paul...e-Agent-Frenzy-Remain-in-on-Duchene/224/86239
Carlsson + Murray would be on the table. The other two pieces are the question, and very doubtful unless the Avs added to the deal. Carlsson + Murray + 2nd is more realistic.