Rumor: Arthur Staple: Isles Remain Front-Runner for Tavares | Other teams still in mix

[Notsince67]

Maybe all of them, maybe none of them. Pretty much all the teams in the Tavares sweepstakes - including your Leafs - are not guaranteed playoff contenders. Kings, Sharks, Blues, Sabres, Habs, Devils, Avs - whoever else is putting in an offer isn't that far ahead of us. You expect Toronto to be on this way higher tier than the Islanders, when in reality your front office seems plagued by negative rumors here and there. First Babcock and Matthews had a confrontation of some sorts. Now Matthews & Marner don't want to sign until they have to. We might be stealing your top assistant!

There's no guarantee that Toronto finishes ahead of the Islanders next season, especially considering the turmoil in Toronto contrasted with the stability brought by Lou to the Islanders. This article mentions Lou is using assets to upgrade this team, fix the holes. A core forward roster of Barzal, Lee, Bailey, Beauvillier, Eberle, with Bellows and potentially Ho-Sang fighting for spots in the lineup. So please, you go ahead predicting success and glory for your team, and doom and failure for ours.

This post is insane. Are you suggesting that the leafs are not considered playoff contenders? They are currently 10:1 odds of winning the 2019 cup. In what alternative universe do you live.

 

[X66]

Sure, but the point is to win not to be the most entertaining to watch. If they get Tavares they still need defense to push for a cup and they'll have very little cap space to make that happen unless they lose another piece that will hurt.

We don't know the direction the cap is going, and no doubt it'll be tight, but that's the risk you might have to take.

Matthews
Tavares
Kadri

Down the middle can impact a game in ways that very few teams can counter.

With those 3 down the middle, it's not a question of a few more steps, it's cup or bust every year out, they're that good of a trio.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

The Penguins still had Crosby, Malkin and Kessel on their salary cap and won back to back Stanley Cups.

The Lightning were able to re-sign Stamkos and Headman.

This notion that the Leafs need to trade Matthews, Marner or Nylander if they sign Tavares is crazy.

You think Matthews and Tavares equal Crosby and Malkin? And throw in Kessel with the Leafs retaining 20% of his salary. You comparing these players that are most likely 2 HOF players, and one that has a good chance of making it to make a case for a similar situation if JT signs in Toronto?

If you are betting on history repeating, you are betting on false equivalencies.

 

[Deadly Dogma]

If he does sign in Tor there is going to be some seriously mad people. The only way he is coming to us is if he already made up his mind and will take 9-10/yr. Other teams supposedly are willing to go up to 12? to leave 2 mil on the table to go play with an other team is gonna hurt for some of you guys. (if it happens)

 

[Notsince67]

Two bottom-six center spots from my vantage point.

No. Kadri obviously moves down to 3rd.

 

[CodeE]

This post is insane. Are you suggesting that the leafs are not considered playoff contenders? They are currently 10:1 odds of winning the 2019 cup. In what alternative universe do you live.

Complete Stanley Cup odds for 2017-18 season released - Sportsnet.ca

Edmonton Oilers had 10:1 odds of winning the 2018 Cup. How'd they fare in the playoffs this year?

 

[LeafsNation75]

You think Matthews and Tavares equal Crosby and Malkin? And throw in Kessel with the Leafs retaining 20% of his salary. You comparing these players that are most likely 2 HOF players, and one that has a good chance of making it to make a case for a similar situation if JT signs in Toronto?

Matthews and Tavares are both legit #1 centres and are already superstars. Tavares was also a finalist for the Hart Trophy in 2015. Plus the Leafs also have Mitch Marner who could easily play on Matthews wing next season and put up the same amount of goals and points Phil Kessel has for the Penguins.

 

[Face Of Bear]

I'm still crossing my fingers that Tavares bleeds blue and white and wont be able to turn down a solid offer from the Leafs.

Leafs would be deadly down the middle and Nylander could be moved for a young talented defenseman to play with Rielly. Leafs already have the second wave of quality (and cheap) youngsters coming too. That team would have a pretty large cup window imo. Can Tavares say no to the chance of winning multiple cups with Toronto?

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Matthews and Tavares are both legit #1 centres and are already superstars. Tavares was also a finalist for the Hart Trophy in 2015. Plus the Leafs also have Mitch Marner who could easily play on Matthews wing next season and put up the same amount of goals and points Phil Kessel has for the Penguins.

You formulated a premise that was similar to the Pens having Crosby and Malkin in their prime. This was inaccurate as there is only one tandem like 87 & 71. And I doubt the Leafs will find a GM so accommodating to take 20% of the salary on Kessel to help them win the cup as the Pens got in that steal of a deal.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Just as the Leafs were all in on Stamkos, they'll be all in on Tavares.

I think a lot of people would enjoy watching the Leafs if signed there, they're already one of the most entertaining teams in the league.

When the Leafs talked to Stamkos everyone said at that time they weren't ready to contend and they were right since they had just finished last place overall, plus Matthews and Marner had played a total of 0 NHL games. Obviously no one expected them to make the playoffs the following season, however today it's not outrageous to say that the Leafs have a better chance at singing Tavares compared to when they talked to Stamkos.

 

[BigKing]

Just for a good old fashioned measuring contest:

Kopitar
Tavares
Carter

I'd play Carter at RW with Tavares, so more like:

Kopitar
Tavares
Kempe with Vilardi slotting in sometime soon.

Not saying it is better than Toronto, but I will say this is better behind it:

Doughty
Quick

 

[LeafsNation75]

You formulated a premise that was similar to the Pens having Crosby and Malkin in their prime. This was inaccurate as there is only one tandem like 87 & 71. And I doubt the Leafs will find a GM so accommodating to take 20% of the salary on Kessel to help them win the cup as the Pens got in that steal of a deal.

You conveniently choose to forget that among teams on Kessel approved trade list at that time, only the Penguins were willing to talk about trading for him. If other teams were more interested maybe the Leafs would not have had to retain any of his contract.

 

[Notsince67]

Complete Stanley Cup odds for 2017-18 season released - Sportsnet.ca

Edmonton Oilers had 10:1 odds of winning the 2018 Cup. How'd they fare in the playoffs this year?

Strawman argument if true. Please stop. The BS is already flying too fast today

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Either way they still won despite that, so if you add Tavares on a forward group that includes Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Kadri and Marleau, the Leafs will have a legit chance to contend. Plus some people seem to be discounting Morgan Rielly at his improvement for the Leafs defense when non Leafs fans mention it.

I mean, you could say the same thing about the Islanders, then. They're potent up front, questionable on defense.

If all you need to do is stack your forwards and hope your goalie plays at a Conn Smythe level to carry a poor defense, JT has just as good a chance of winning the Cup in New York as he does in Toronto.

 

[PWJunior]

I mean, you could say the same thing about the Islanders, then. They're potent up front, questionable on defense.

If all you need to do is stack your forwards and hope your goalie plays at a Conn Smythe level to carry a poor defense, JT has just as good a chance of winning the Cup in New York as he does in Toronto.

If JT wants a Cup, he should sign with the Pens. Crosby, Malkin, and JT blows away all others, they'd be the NHL's version of GSW.

Not trolling you STK, but that scenario is a helluva a lot better than Toronto.

 

[LeafsNation75]

I mean, you could say the same thing about the Islanders, then. They're potent up front, questionable on defense.

If all you need to do is stack your forwards and hope your goalie plays at a Conn Smythe level to carry a poor defense, JT has just as good a chance of winning the Cup in New York as he does in Toronto.

Besides Barzal and you need to see if he can have the same performance next season, the Leafs forwards as they look right now without Tavares are a lot better than everything else the Islanders have on their roster.

 

[CodeE]

Strawman argument if true. Please stop. The BS is already flying too fast today

What's the strawman? You seem to take offense to the possibility the Leafs may miss the playoffs by saying they have 10:1 odds to win a Cup. But hockey is a crazy sport, as guaranteed by last year's 10:1 favorites Edmonton missing the postseason while teams like Vegas (200:1), Jersey (100:1) and Colorado (80:1) all made it.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

If JT wants a Cup, he should sign with the Pens. Crosby, Malkin, and JT blows away all others, they'd be the NHL's version of GSW.

Not trolling you STK, but that scenario is a helluva a lot better than Toronto.

Well, there *have* been rumors that Rutherford's trying to make signing Tavares work (hence some talk he'd be okay moving Kessel out just for picks to clear cap space), so ...

But on an Islanders/Leafs topic, I just think if the idea is "screw defense, just stack up the forwards and win with ridiculously opportune scoring and Conn Smythe goaltending", I don't know why the Leafs would be a better option than the Isles. Both teams sort of have the same strengths and weaknesses.

 

[S E P H]

Didn't Arthur Staples pretty much get the whole Duchene to Islanders saga completely wrong? Not sure why people would trust him over that....

 

[PWJunior]

Well, there *have* been rumors that Rutherford's trying to make signing Tavares work (hence some talk he'd be okay moving Kessel out just for picks to clear cap space), so ...

But on an Islanders/Leafs topic, I just think if the idea is "screw defense, just stack up the forwards and win with ridiculously opportune scoring and Conn Smythe goaltending", I don't know why the Leafs would be a better option than the Isles. Both teams sort of have the same strengths and weaknesses.

If the Pens could pull it off, kudos to them. JT can get his Cup and then re-enter the market and get his big deal a year later.

 

[BrockLobster]

Besides Barzal and you need to see if he can have the same performance next season, the Leafs forwards as they look right now without Tavares are a lot better than everything else the Islanders have on their roster.

Wheres the leafs 40 goal scorer and other 70+ point forward? Oh right.....

 

[The Winter Soldier]

You conveniently choose to forget that among teams on Kessel approved trade list at that time, only the Penguins were willing to talk about trading for him. If other teams were more interested maybe the Leafs would not have had to retain any of his contract.

You are missing the point. You pointed to a Crosby/Malkin/Kessel fwd built core as an argument that the Leafs could afford to sign JT not allowing the fact that Crosby and Malkin are better than Matthews and Tavares, and that Kessel had a retained contract compliments to Shanahan. You may want to add Malkin and Crosby were signed to relatively cap friendly contracts at 8.7M each far less than what JT and Matthews whom I am hearing will be looking for the moon.

 

[Notsince67]

Well, there *have* been rumors that Rutherford's trying to make signing Tavares work (hence some talk he'd be okay moving Kessel out just for picks to clear cap space), so ...

But on an Islanders/Leafs topic, I just think if the idea is "screw defense, just stack up the forwards and win with ridiculously opportune scoring and Conn Smythe goaltending", I don't know why the Leafs would be a better option than the Isles. Both teams sort of have the same strengths and weaknesses.

????You realize that 232 GA is lower than a 296 right?
You realize Toronto also has less goals against than the pens right?

 

[LeafsNation75]

You are missing the point. You pointed to a Crosby/Malkin/Kessel fwd built core as an argument that the Leafs could afford to sign JT not allowing the fact that Crosby and Malkin are better than Matthews and Tavares, and that Kessel had a retained contract compliments to Shanahan. You may want to add Malkin and Crosby were signed to relatively cap friendly contracts at 8.7M each far less than what JT and Matthews whom I am hearing will be looking for the moon.

Forgetting about all the contract situations for a moment, talent wise it's not outrageous to say that Matthews and Tavares on the same team can be just as good as Crosby and Malkin.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

????You realize that 232 GA is lower than a 296 right?
You realize Toronto also has less goals against than the pens right?

You realize that "sort of have the same strengths and weaknesses" doesn't mean "THEY HAVE THE EXACT SAME DEFENSE/EXACT SAME OFFENSE"? It simply means that both teams are strong up front, but have question marks on defense.

And good for the Leafs. At no point have I suggested the Penguins had a defense that rivals the 1990s Devils club, so I'm not sure how that's relevant to my assessment of the Isles/Leafs' strengths and weaknesses.