Series Talk: Around the NHL - Playoff Edition

[Gary Nylund]

Finally, we can agree on something.

You left out the most important part of my post, why am I not surprised?

I mean that's not really true. Match-ups matter a lot.

Nope, it's true.

Stamkos will apparently be out the whole series, so that isn't a factor. Both Nelson and Point we're injured during the game.

I'm not sure why you think Tampa outplayed the Isles. They actually had more and better scoring chances. The only way Tampa was better was in finishing.

Yeah I agree, close game that could have gone either way. I don't think they're on the same tier as TB or anything and they'll almost certainly lose this series but they're a solid team that's playing well and probably has more talent then some people think.

 

[notDatsyuk]

Tampa was missing Stamkos, started the game with 11 forwards, and then lost Point and Killorn, and they still outshot the Islanders at ES.
Islanders were 0 for 4 on the PP, which included a 5 min PP and a 5 on 3.

I think Tampa starting 11 forwards was their choice. Killorn wasn't 'lost', he was throw out for injuring Nelson.

Each team 'lost' one player to injury.

And yes, Tampa outshot Isles at even strength. By one whole shot! Obviously that totally negates my suggestion that, while Tampa is better, that was a close game.

 

[Havoc]

Only Leafs fans would bet on the Isles taking them out in a 7 game series. Sometimes I need to double check if I'm on the right board. Isles win 0 of the series Leafs have lost in the last 4 years.


Isles are not a good team. They are dependent on Trotz system which can only take them so far.

Lou is running them into the ground. No 1st and 2nd in 2020. No 2nd in 2021. And unless someone owes Lou a favor, they won't have a 2021 1st either.

It's what he's been doing since 2005.

Isles aren't even a lock to make the playoffs next season. Leafs are probably minimum last wild card spot if we don't acquire any new D and go with what we currently have.

Isles weren't on track to make it this year. Now, they have to shed from their roster to sign their guys which means they'll be even weaker.

Again, all these takes are based on emotion. If you calm down and actually look into the Isles, I guarantee you don't want to be them regardless of how many rounds they won this season.

 

[notDatsyuk]

The Isles couldn't score on a 5 minute major and a 5-on-3 for over 30 seconds...and Vasilevsky held the fort...didn't just come down to a perfect pass...the Isles had plenty of opportunities to take the lead, but couldn't score.

You didn't think that was a perfect pass to Kucherov?

Other than that, I agree completely. But does anything you said negate anything I said?

 

[CantLoseWithMatthews]

Stamkos will apparently be out the whole series, so that isn't a factor. Both Nelson and Point we're injured during the game.

I'm not sure why you think Tampa outplayed the Isles. They actually had more and better scoring chances. The only way Tampa was better was in finishing.

well I don't really think it's noteworthy that the Islanders were able to carry play when they had a man advantage. At 5v5 Tampa was the better team by quantity and especially quality

 

[notDatsyuk]

NYI has had two very easy paths this year and last year, but as soon as they face a true contender, they fold.

They were swept by Boston, now they will be swept by Tampa Bay.

It would have been really interesting to see the narratives if the Leafs had faced Pittsburgh last year or the Panthers this year. Those are huge downgrades from Boston and Columbus, although we should have been able to overcome Columbus.

They didn't play Boston last year.

I keep seeing this 'easy path' comment, exclusively from Leaf fans, and it really sounds like sour grapes.

They beat the second, sixth, and seventh best scoring teams, and are now facing the best (and just held them to two goals). Lost, yes, but watching last night's game, I don't think they have folded.

 

[notDatsyuk]

i guess some leaf fans like the islanders better than the leafs....pretty sad.

I wouldn't say 'like the Islanders better', but are willing to accept that they are playing well.

Do all the 'Tampa is better' comments mean all those posters like Tampa better than the Leafs?

 

[Dekes For Days]

I think Tampa starting 11 forwards was their choice. Killorn wasn't 'lost', he was throw out for injuring Nelson.

Each team 'lost' one player to injury.

It was their choice, but it still has an impact when two more forwards leave the game.
Nelson still played in the game after that hit, and Point is a much bigger loss, before we even get to Stamkos.

 

[Merrrlin]

I think Tampa starting 11 forwards was their choice. Killorn wasn't 'lost', he was throw out for injuring Nelson.

Each team 'lost' one player to injury.

And yes, Tampa outshot Isles at even strength. By one whole shot! Obviously that totally negates my suggestion that, while Tampa is better, that was a close game.

Maybe one shot doesn't tell the story, but how about being positive in both SCF and HDCF 5v5?

1.56xGF vs 1.03xGF

The 5v3 penalty heavily skewed the non-5v5 stats (shots, attempts, etc) that are usually quoted by the media, but the reality is, Tampa bay outplayed the Isles 5v5 even while missing their best and third best forwards.

If injury luck was reversed and NYI was missing Barzal and Beauvillier, it would be a slaughter.

 

[Dekes For Days]

I'm not sure why you think Tampa outplayed the Isles. They actually had more and better scoring chances.

They were essentially even in xGF% overall (with Isles getting a 5 min PP and 5 on 3), and Tampa outplayed them at ES.

 

[stickty111]

i guess some leaf fans like the islanders better than the leafs....pretty sad.

It is sad. Not sure why these people seem to make excuses for the Islanders. Yet if made these excuses for the Leafs, we would be criticized. The narrative is wierd, and no the Islanders winning more series then us means nothing. They lost both games and deserved to lose. Yeah they played hard but they lost so maybe they should play harder?
Feel like some Leafs fans are cheering for the Islanders for whatever reason.

 

[stickty111]

No it really has more to do with the obsession about using Lou's success to bash on Dubas, when Lou hasn't brought in very many key roster pieces at all, didn't have this amazing track record with the Leafs we pretend he did and brought in Trotz which pretty well single handedly turned that team around.

The biggest player personnel change Lou has made to the NYI is losing Tavares and it's not close. Which convienently he and Dubas had no agency in at all for the Lou diehards. He found a perfect marriage of team and coach which he deserves credit for but he failed on that regard with the Leafs anyway. Leaf fans just need to get the hell over it.

Great post.

 

[Merrrlin]

It is sad. Not sure why these people seem to make excuses for the Islanders. They lost both games and deserved to lose. Yeah they played hard but they lost so maybe they should play harder?
Feel like some Leafs fans are cheering for the Islanders for whatever reason.

The reason is obvious - there is no better storyline to disparge the young controversial GM than to point at how his predeccesor got further in the playoffs. They love it.

Problem is, they probably won't win the cup, and in a no-gate revenue COVID world, 8 extra playoff games is a short term and pointless accomplishment. I'd love it if it were the Leafs, but I'd still find it equally pointless if they aren't winning the cup.

Islanders just can't win against true contenders. Hardly a model to envy.

 

[Merrrlin]

You left out the most important part of my post, why am I not surprised?



Nope, it's true.



Yeah I agree, close game that could have gone either way. I don't think they're on the same tier as TB or anything and they'll almost certainly lose this series but they're a solid team that's playing well and probably has more talent then some people think.

If you had to bet your house on it, who would you take to win a cup first - NYI or Toronto?

 

[stickty111]

If you had to bet your house on it, who would you take to win a cup first - NYI or Toronto?

It has to be Islanders because after all they won series

 

[Gary Nylund]

If you had to bet your house on it, who would you take to win a cup first - NYI or Toronto?

That's a tough one, I have no idea. Why do you ask?

 

[notDatsyuk]

well I don't really think it's noteworthy that the Islanders were able to carry play when they had a man advantage. At 5v5 Tampa was the better team by quantity and especially quality[/QUOTE]
I thought at 5v5 it looked pretty even. Quantity? One shot more. Quality is more subjective, but yes, they scored one more goal, although I thought the chances were close.

I agree, Tampa was, and is, the better team. I don't think anyone is disputing that.

 

[stickty111]

The reason is obvious - there is no better storyline to disparge the young controversial GM than to point at how his predeccesor got further in the playoffs. They love it.

Problem is, they probably won't win the cup, and in a no-gate revenue COVID world, 8 extra playoff games is a short term and pointless accomplishment. I'd love it if it were the Leafs, but I'd still find it equally pointless if they aren't winning the cup.

Islanders just can't win against true contenders. Hardly a model to envy.

90% of it is Lou vs Dubas matchup which is annoying.
Now I'm not going to count out the coaching of Trotz, but again once they faced teams that actually showed up, they really struggled.
I'm easily taking the Leafs team over the Isles without thinking twice.

 

[Merrrlin]

90% of it is Lou vs Dubas matchup which is annoying.
Now I'm not going to count out the coaching of Trotz, but again once they faced teams that actually showed up, they really struggled.
I'm easily taking the Leafs team over the Isles without thinking twice.

Agreed. I think Trotz's horrendously boring and smothering system has a decently high floor, but they need a major injection of talent to get the ceiling up. They will never beat Tampa/Boston etc without someone breaking out or bringing someone in (ie Panarin last season).

 

[Gary Nylund]

It is sad. Not sure why these people seem to make excuses for the Islanders. Yet if made these excuses for the Leafs, we would be criticized. The narrative is wierd, and no the Islanders winning more series then us means nothing. They lost both games and deserved to lose. Yeah they played hard but they lost so maybe they should play harder?
Feel like some Leafs fans are cheering for the Islanders for whatever reason.

What makes you say that? Every series means something, I'd even go so far as to say that every game means something. Some more than others of course but still, I watch almost every game my team plays and they all mean something to me.

I'm not sure any Leaf fans are cheering for the Islanders, more like some are cheering against them and looking for reasons to put them down.

 

[Gary Nylund]

Agreed. I think Trotz's horrendously boring and smothering system has a decently high floor, but they need a major injection of talent to get the ceiling up. They will never beat Tampa/Boston etc without someone breaking out or bringing someone in (ie Panarin last season).

Most likely true. But there's also no reason this can't happen.

 

[stickty111]

Agreed. I think Trotz's horrendously boring and smothering system has a decently high floor, but they need a major injection of talent to get the ceiling up. They will never beat Tampa/Boston etc without someone breaking out or bringing someone in (ie Panarin last season).

Agreed. If they play a talented team that even kind of plays, it would be tough for the Isles to win. That is not a good team and the Isles fit that category.

 

[Rare Jewel]

i guess some leaf fans like the islanders better than the leafs....pretty sad.

Nah, that's just an assumption.

This thread is about the remaining teams in the playoffs. Surely there can be discussion about their merit of playing to this point right?

 

[Menzinger]

I think Isles fans should be very happy with the fact there team has made it this far(as a Leafs fan I'd certainly love a deep playoff run like this)

That said there's also no sense in ignoring that theyve been dominated by Tampa at even strength and have been getting some pretty unpredictable hot streaks from a few of their guys.

They just don't have enough skilled/star power to compete with the better teams. Which in turn isn't that surprising given they were likely going to miss the playoffs if the season had finished normally and only 16 teams got in

Isles fans should just enjoy the rest of the ride

 

[Rare Jewel]

Most likely true. But there's also no reason this can't happen.

I mean the series vs. CBJ was in effect that kind of match up.