Around the NHL 20-21 pt. 1: the season begins

[TehDoak]

While I don't think PLD is in the right here, let's remember something:

He took 1 shift off. In the scope of a game, it's a point to pay attention to, but its not the end all be all.

Torts went in and threw gasoline on the fire and made it a huge deal. And it's not the first time he's done this with players. Look at the Sedin's numbers under Torteralla, they had bad years under him and rebounded the second he was gone. I remember Ryan Johansen and Torts had a similar situation before he got traded too, though I think RyJo's problem proceeded Torts

Torts just doesn't have a long half life as a coach. There's a point where players simply stop listening to him. PLD is whipping boy right now, but I have to think this is probably a locker room wide issue.

 

[DJN21]

I know opinions on this will be polarizing but as talented as he is I wouldn't want him in my locker room after seeing that stunt...

 

[EmeraldCitySabre]

Just because a player is having a hard time in one place, doesn't mean he'll take that elsewhere, sometimes they do, sometimes they don't. Just look at Stefon Diggs. I'm friends with a few Vikings fans and when we made that trade, they all told me how Diggs was a diva, a locker room cancer, good luck with him, he's gonna destroy Allen, etc. He's shown NONE of that here, and its not like he wasn't winning in Minnesota. I don't think PLD would have the same impact as Diggs obviously, but he could be big for us, maybe he's worth a shot.

 

[joshjull]

I know opinions on this will be polarizing but as talented as he is I wouldn't want him in my locker room after seeing that stunt...

You can find plenty of “controller disconnected” plays from top offensive players throughout a game. Its usually on the defensive side of the game. As a Caps fan I can say Ovy was notorious for floating on back checks. PLD was like this for an entire shift and its wasn’t a good look. But by design Torts made this into a bigger deal than it needed to be.

 

[Buffaloed]

Man if we benched every player that had a shift like that the past few years...

Eichel would have been benched in the first game.

 

[Jim Bob]

While I don't think PLD is in the right here, let's remember something:

He took 1 shift off. In the scope of a game, it's a point to pay attention to, but its not the end all be all.

Torts went in and threw gasoline on the fire and made it a huge deal. And it's not the first time he's done this with players. Look at the Sedin's numbers under Torteralla, they had bad years under him and rebounded the second he was gone. I remember Ryan Johansen and Torts had a similar situation before he got traded too, though I think RyJo's problem proceeded Torts

Torts just doesn't have a long half life as a coach. There's a point where players simply stop listening to him. PLD is whipping boy right now, but I have to think this is probably a locker room wide issue.

A) It was way more than that one shift.

B) Jarmo has a history of moving guys that fight him come contract time.

And RyJo was traded mid-season in 15-16 and Torts was hired mid-season the same year. Most people believe RyJo was traded because of the contract standoff with Jarmo before Torts came on board.

 

[joshjull]

Eichel would have been benched in the first game.

And many others after that

 

[DJN21]

You can find plenty of “controller disconnected” plays from top offensive players throughout a game. Its usually on the defensive side of the game. As a Caps fan I can say Ovy was notorious for floating on back checks. PLD was like this for an entire shift and its wasn’t a good look. But by design Torts made this into a bigger deal than it needed to be.

I get that but also think you need to consider circumstance and timing. OV and other guys have had those moments at random times when in good standing with their respective teams. PLD's timing is what makes this incident so telling. He doesn't have the luxury of doing something like that while the microscope is on him. I think his intention was clear in this particular circumstance given the climate of his relationship with the team/coach currently.

 

[joshjull]

This is what I was thinking as well, if you were a team interested in acquiring PLD and saw him quit like this, it has to give you major reservations about acquiring him now.

It's one thing to express frustration with coaches or management, it's a completely different thing to check out on your teammates. There are other guys that are trying to win, playing for their next contract, trying to hit their own performance bonuses, and PLD's effort was as a much of an insult to his teammates as the organization.

The “he quite on his team” thing seems a little hyperbolic at this point.

Getting benched for a period or even half a period is pretty harsh in the modern game. That Torts didn’t let him play again was just about being vindictive on his part.

Had he let PLD play again in the 3rd and he was still floating after sitting for over a period. THEN I would agree he quit on the team. Plenty of players, for a variety of reasons, play like ass in a game warranting a benching for a period of time. They almost always get a chance later in the game to get their head out of ther ass and play better. How they respond in the 2nd chance in the game tells you more about that player.

 

[Der Jaeger]

The “he quite on his team” thing seems a little hyperbolic at this point.

Getting benched for a period or even half a period is pretty harsh in the modern game. That Torts didn’t let him play again was just about being vindictive on his part.

Had he let PLD play again in the 3rd and he was still floating after sitting for over a period. THEN I would agree he quit on the team. Plenty of players, for a variety of reasons, play like ass in a game warranting a benching for a period a time. They almost always get a chance later to get their head out of ther ass and play better later in the game.

Agree on all. I've never benched a player for more than the rest of a period, followed by some "coaching words of advice" during the period break. Then they get a chance to self-correct. If they do, all good. If the don't, then they ride the pine again.

 

[TehDoak]

A) It was way more than that one shift.

B) Jarmo has a history of moving guys that fight him come contract time.

And RyJo was traded mid-season in 15-16 and Torts was hired mid-season the same year. Most people believe RyJo was traded because of the contract standoff with Jarmo before Torts came on board.

A) Right, but, people act as if players on our team (Eichel included) have games where they aren't engaged. It happens, even to the most professional guys. It's on the coach to sit down with the guy and get him back. There's an obvious fight here between he and Torts. I can't remember how many seasons fans of a player will want their ass on the next plane out of town in the first 10 games and calling him untouchable by the end of the season.

B) In a Columbus, It's an organizational issue. I remember John Davidson getting all of Columbus media dragging RyJo through the muck and mire when he was playing hardball airing all the dirty laundry. There's a reason why Bobvroksky, Panarin, and even Duchene got out of there and never even made a good faith attempt to stay. It's the ownership and coach's "our way or the highway" attitude that doesn't have a ton of on ice success to back it up.

And you are correct, RyJo's issues proceeded Torts, but Torts made the issue worse

Blue Jackets' Ryan Johansen irked Tortorella's critique became public

Torts is a toxic coach who guys don't typically like to play for.

PLD needs to be show he can be professional and show up to work even when the coach is being an ass, however.

 

[jc17]

PLD needs to be show he can be professional and show up to work even when the coach is being an ass, however.

But the question remains, did he really not show up, or was his bad shift just under the microscope because the situation?

 

[BuffaloGooner]

I’d take PLD on this team any day

 

[SundherDome]

You can find plenty of “controller disconnected” plays from top offensive players throughout a game. Its usually on the defensive side of the game. As a Caps fan I can say Ovy was notorious for floating on back checks. PLD was like this for an entire shift and its wasn’t a good look. But by design Torts made this into a bigger deal than it needed to be.

Da f*** is this shit?

Also, didn't PLD note he wanted to play In a big market?

 

[Buffaloed]

If it comes down to a choice between keeping Eichel or Bylsma ...

 

[Jim Bob]

If anyone who blasted ROR after his end of season interview as toxic wants PLD anywhere near the Sabres...

 

[jc17]

If anyone who blasted ROR after his end of season interview as toxic wants PLD anywhere near the Sabres...

I mean you could consider that learning from mistakes

Which " locker room issues" have followed players?

 

[Fezzy126]

The “he quite on his team” thing seems a little hyperbolic at this point.

Getting benched for a period or even half a period is pretty harsh in the modern game. That Torts didn’t let him play again was just about being vindictive on his part.

Had he let PLD play again in the 3rd and he was still floating after sitting for over a period. THEN I would agree he quit on the team. Plenty of players, for a variety of reasons, play like ass in a game warranting a benching for a period of time. They almost always get a chance later in the game to get their head out of ther ass and play better. How they respond in the 2nd chance in the game tells you more about that player.

I'm not saying Torts or management is without blame, obviously they contributed to a toxic situation. And obviously PLD is not the 1st player that Torts has completely alienated, so I tend to be on the players side especially when you see comments like this one:



But I disagree about the hyperbole, PLD went into the corner with 5'9" Tyler Johnson and stood upright and still and did nothing, and watched the puck go the other way. That was at the end of a 30-second shift where he barely moved, not a 60 or 75-second shift where he was exhausted. That wasn't a 'bad' shift, he absolutely mailed it in with regards to his effort.

 

[joshjull]

I'm not saying Torts or management is without blame, obviously they contributed to a toxic situation. And obviously PLD is not the 1st player that Torts has completely alienated, so I tend to be on the players side especially when you see comments like this one:



But I disagree about the hyperbole, PLD went into the corner with 5'9" Tyler Johnson and stood upright and still and did nothing, and watched the puck go the other way. That was at the end of a 30-second shift where he barely moved, not a 60 or 75-second shift where he was exhausted. That wasn't a 'bad' shift, he absolutely mailed it in with regards to his effort.

I’m not defending the shift. It warranted a benching. My point was more about Torts focus. He wasn’t trying to get PLD’s head out of his ass and back on track in that game.Torts goal was to embarrass PLD throughout the hockey world by ensuring that shift is noticed and talked about by all. I’d say mission accomplished on that front.

If Torts had let PLD play again in the third and he responded with the same level of play. Then I’d be on board with the hyperbolic talk about that shift. Have you watched PLD all of this season? I haven’t. So I wouldn’t presume that shift or even that game represents him.

 

[Jim Bob]

I mean you could consider that learning from mistakes

Which " locker room issues" have followed players?

Evander Kane? Unless you want to separate off ice vs locker room stuff.

Kane & Bogosian had reps before they arrived in Buffalo and there are plenty of people that feel that they didn't help the team be better in part to the things they had reps for.

 

[joshjull]

 

[Fjordy]

Well, we know Adams called about PLD, it depends on the price.

 

[explore]

If anyone who blasted ROR after his end of season interview as toxic wants PLD anywhere near the Sabres...

ROR never quit on the team, even though he was run down by Bylsma by giving him primarily defensive zone starts and using him as the primary penalty killer.

PLD quit on his team. It was visible for everyone to see.

ROR and PLD are nothing alike.

I don't want PLD on the Sabres. If he doesn't like Columbus, he's not going to like Buffalo

 

[BG82]

I dont want PLD here

 

[DJN21]

Not that we'd ever get wind of this in the media given the character of guys they are but I'd love to pick Foligno and jenner's brains on this whole thing truthfully. (yes I've watched Foligno's post game presser)