Around the NHL #17, the 18/19 on-season

[Volica]

They paid him for a career at a 35 to 45 point pace. And what impact player can you get for 4.5 million as a UFA? None that I've seen in over a decade.

You can rarely get impact players in UFA. But a guy like Frolik comes to mind.

 

[Lunatik]

You can rarely get impact players in UFA. But a guy like Frolik comes to mind.

Frolik is a complimentary player through and through, nothing about him is an impact player. In fact he and Brouwer were extremely comparable at the time of their signings

 

[Volica]

Frolik is a complimentary player through and through, nothing about him is an impact player. In fact he and Brouwer were extremely comparable at the time of their signings

Well. No. Only someone who opened up HockeyDB and never watched either of them would think that. It was even more apparent during their stints here. All you had to do was look how Caps/St.Louis fans were reacting to us signing Brouwer, versus how Jets fans talked about us signing Frolik.

Frolik, while being a complimentary piece, is of impact. If you're paying someone 4+M, you'd want them to be able to play into the top 6, PK, PP, be good on both ends of the ice... Frolik does that, Brouwer doesn't.

 

[Lunatik]

Well. No. Only someone who opened up HockeyDB and never watched either of them would think that. It was even more apparent during their stints here. All you had to do was look how Caps/St.Louis fans were reacting to us signing Brouwer, versus how Jets fans talked about us signing Frolik.

Frolik, while being a complimentary piece, is of impact. If you're paying someone 4+M, you'd want them to be able to play into the top 6, PK, PP, be good on both ends of the ice... Frolik does that, Brouwer doesn't.

on top of similar production, their roles were similar too. Complimentary pieces that also payed solid defense and killed penalties. The only differences were Frolik was an advanced stats darling and Brouwer was more physical and would occasionally drop the gloves. Also, Brouwer was known for PP production prior to joining the Flames, so I don't where the f*** you got he couldn't play the PP before us.

 

[Volica]

on top of similar production, their roles were similar too. Complimentary pieces that also payed solid defense and killed penalties. The only differences were Frolik was an advanced stats darling and Brouwer was more physical and would occasionally drop the gloves. Also, Brouwer was known for PP production prior to joining the Flames, so I don't where the **** you got he couldn't play the PP before us.

He certainly didn't for us. Never said he couldn't before.
Brouwer was never known as a defensive stalwart, or amazing PK'er. In fact, most people warned us with the signing

I'm saying if you're paying that much for a complimentary piece, and you're not picking them up as a scorer, you want them to bring everything else. We were warned right as we signed Brouwer, he was a product of his centres.

 

[Lunatik]

He certainly didn't for us. Never said he couldn't before.
Brouwer was never known as a defensive stalwart, or amazing PK'er. In fact, most people warned us with the signing

I'm saying if you're paying that much for a complimentary piece, and you're not picking them up as a scorer, you want them to bring everything else. We were warned right as we signed Brouwer, he was a product of his centres.

I was talking about before he signed, to get that contract, we all know what happened afterwards.

When Frolik & Brouwer were both signed they were similar players, with similar roles and similar production. It's why they got very similar contracts. The notion that Brouwer only got his contract because of the playoffs as you suggested is laughable.

 

[Anglesmith]

I dunno. I think the only way you could compare Brouwer and Frolik prior to signing with the Flames is by stat-watching. Having watched them play hockey, I really liked Frolik when I watched him in Winnipeg, but I really didn't like Brouwer when I watched him in St. Louis. I actually thought Brouwer was a pretty good player for Chicago and Washington, and I liked him at those points in his career, but clearly I got a bad impression from his time in St. Louis given how vehemently I disliked the signing when it went down.

I think one of the biggest differences from a Flames perspective is that I think Frolik was their target in the year they signed him, whereas I think Brouwer was a back-up option that Treliving signed because he needed to add a right-winger and didn't get his guy. I really think he would have liked Okposo if he could've had him (which isn't his fault, obviously). But most of the other options that year turned out bad anyway.

 

[Volica]

I dunno. I think the only way you could compare Brouwer and Frolik prior to signing with the Flames is by stat-watching. Having watched them play hockey, I really liked Frolik when I watched him in Winnipeg, but I really didn't like Brouwer when I watched him in St. Louis. I actually thought Brouwer was a pretty good player for Chicago and Washington, and I liked him at those points in his career, but clearly I got a bad impression from his time in St. Louis given how vehemently I disliked the signing when it went down.

I think one of the biggest differences from a Flames perspective is that I think Frolik was their target in the year they signed him, whereas I think Brouwer was a back-up option that Treliving signed because he needed to add a right-winger and didn't get his guy. I really think he would have liked Okposo if he could've had him (which isn't his fault, obviously). But most of the other options that year turned out bad anyway.

This, 100%.

 

[InfinityIggy]

To me, a big factor of both those signings was actually their ages at the time of signing. Brouwer was 31 when he started his first season as a Flame. Frolik was only 28.

 

[Volica]

To me, a big factor of both those signings was actually their ages at the time of signing. Brouwer was 31 when he started his first season as a Flame. Frolik was only 28.

I really think Brouwer was a knee jerk signing. To be honest.

Frolik was signed because Calgary had no RW depth. Brouwer was signed because even after picking up Frolik, that RW depth was abysmal. Calgary needed someone to play with Monahan/Gaudreau and Brouwer had played with top 6 guys in the past (he just came from playing the majority of his minutes with Paul Stastny).

That summer had some fringe top 6 guys available. Treliving had to improve the team.

 

[CamPopplestone]

I really think Brouwer was a knee jerk signing. To be honest.

Frolik was signed because Calgary had no RW depth. Brouwer was signed because even after picking up Frolik, that RW depth was abysmal. Calgary needed someone to play with Monahan/Gaudreau and Brouwer had played with top 6 guys in the past (he just came from playing the majority of his minutes with Paul Stastny).

That summer had some fringe top 6 guys available. Treliving had to improve the team.

I think the 4 year term also appealed to Brad, over the options like Okposo who were looking for 6-7 years. Say what you will about Brad, but even going back to his first year, with Raymond, Engelland etc, he seems far more hesitant to go long term, and goes more medium term on UFAs

 

[Lunatik]

Nate Schmidt from Vegas has been suspended 20 games for PEDs

 

[Kipper933]

Sounds like he tested positive for a very trace amount. Even the NHL's statement indicates they don't think he was doping. Sucks for him to lose a quarter of his take-home pay for what seems like a chance occurrence.

 

[Lunatik]

Sounds like he tested positive for a very trace amount. Even the NHL's statement indicates they don't think he was doping. Sucks for him to lose a quarter of his take-home pay for what seems like a chance occurrence.

He also blamed the team apparently. So we'll see how that plays out.

 

[FlamerForLife]

Here's Schmidt's statement on the matter.

 

[Lunatik]

Reading the main board on this subject is hilarious. You get the "NHL's policy is a joke, it doesn't catch anyone" posts. Followed by the "NHL's policy is a joke, it's too strict" posts. With a little, "the NHL's policy should be like the Olympics" mixed in.

But I have to ask, how can it be both too strict and not strict enough at the same time? Also, if the IOC policy is so much better, why are there never any NHLers getting caught doping at the Olympics?

 

[Mobiandi]

The IOC is far from strict let's be honest

They might have made an example out of the Russians but there've been many accounts by former athletes and doctors that say that PED use is rife within the Olympics.

As far as I'm aware, the only sport that has actually cracked down on doping is cycling to try to fix its image. Everywhere else it's pretty lax.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

Interesting.

 

[Lunatik]

The IOC is far from strict let's be honest

They might have made an example out of the Russians but there've been many accounts by former athletes and doctors that say that PED use is rife within the Olympics.

As far as I'm aware, the only sport that has actually cracked down on doping is cycling to try to fix its image. Everywhere else it's pretty lax.

It's not that the IOC is not strict, their issue is more they can't keep up with the designer drugs and HGH and such because you can't test for something until you know what you're looking for.

 

[InfinityIggy]

I’d bet dollars that this will be rescinded or reduced.

 

[Lunatik]

I’d bet dollars that this will be rescinded or reduced.

I'll take that bet, because if you read his statement, he's already lost his appeal.

 

[InfinityIggy]

I'll take that bet, because if you read his statement, he's already lost his appeal.

Perhaps, but his statement also reads like someone who is still intent on fighting it. Wouldn’t be surprised if he pursues options made available through the NHLPA. That 20 games will constitute serious money so at the very least I could see a suit, even if he ends up not playing the games.

 

[Anglesmith]

Perhaps, but his statement also reads like someone who is still intent on fighting it. Wouldn’t be surprised if he pursues options made available through the NHLPA. That 20 games will constitute serious money so at the very least I could see a suit, even if he ends up not playing the games.

Yeah, I could see a suit possibly, although I think his intent with the statement is just to make sure his reputation takes as little a hit as possible.

 

[Lunatik]

Perhaps, but his statement also reads like someone who is still intent on fighting it. Wouldn’t be surprised if he pursues options made available through the NHLPA. That 20 games will constitute serious money so at the very least I could see a suit, even if he ends up not playing the games.

I read it the same as AS.

Also, this isn't like the Wideman situation,where you have to determine intent. They have defined limits for each and every banned substance, if you exceed, you're suspended. He got an appeal to try and prove it was "environmental" but lost.

 

[Volica]

Dougie with a nice little jab for his old team (and himself I guess?)

Hurricanes' Dougie Hamilton: Flames defence 'didn't turn out so good' - Sportsnet.ca

“When I went to Calgary, it was kind of the same thing, where on paper maybe we were the best [defence] corps in the league, and we actually didn’t turn out so good,” Hamilton told reporters Tuesday at a team media availability. “So, hopefully in Carolina we can do a little better of getting chemistry with everybody and really being a force back there as a unit.”