Confirmed with Link: Andrew Miller (Yale) Signs 1-Year ELC

[Seachd]

I can't speak for anyone else, but the optics of this signing blows.

I would suggest there are no optics whatsoever. This is identical to the Fedun signing.

 

[Seachd]

Here's a novel idea..How about our management find players that have both..size and skill..and actually do what they're being paid to do...

They're signing young free agents... not drafting superstars.

Throw out an example of who you have in mind.

 

[Oilfan2]

Let's see...

Missed out on DeKeyser--top signing...Playing 17 minutes for Detroit.
Missed out on Laganiere (6' 4" C)...signed by Ana.
Missed out on 6'4" goalie Hartzell...signed by Pitts.

But we signed another 5'9" forward...Yep, sounds like the Oilers alright..

They're signing young free agents... not drafting superstars.

Throw out an example of who you have in mind.

Already did..albiet small examples..As I said, not worried about this particular signing but more worried that they can't, or won't, do the work required to get the right mix of players....Whether Miller plays or not is really inconsequential..Which is probably part of my point.

 

[CorpseFX]

Young Toby Peterson?

hahhah why did you have to bring up Toby this quickly after Mac-T took over?

Marty Reasoner and Toby jokes are going to be coming out of the woodwork again and again

 

[Aequitas]

I agree with BBO....My biggest complaint here has little to do with this particular player. I just see a pattern again and the fact that we couldn't sign any high end FA's with size and skill but, again, got another small player.

Here's a novel idea..How about our management find players that have both..size and skill..and actually do what they're being paid to do...

The reason you see a pattern is because large skilled guys are wanted by every team. If it was as easy as just doing it every team would be filled with guys who are 6'4' and 220lbs. Just because a certain player doesn't fill the description you want in a signing doesn't mean its a bad signing. In the past year the oil have been adding size repeatedly even trading some skill away for size. Adding another decent prospect for nothing is never a bad idea. As far as I am concerned the negativity to this signing stems from a desire for our NHL team to address needs but this is not an NHL signing it is a depth/prospect signing. Big difference.

 

[Seachd]

Already did..albiet small examples..As I said, not worried about this particular signing but more worried that they can't, or won't, do the work required to get the right mix of players....Whether Miller plays or not is really inconsequential..Which is probably part of my point.

Ok, but I meant guys who are currently available. Free agency involves two sides. They can't just go sign the player they want. That's not how it works.

 

[Gord]

who cares about size for all we know he could be the next M.St.Louis, or he could be L.Reddox v.2014..Reddox was small but hit like a freight train.

IF he does turn out to be a player oilers could always move out a soft small player.

when most of the oilers other skilled players are smaller, so it does matter.
many fans have no issue with a small talented player, but when that's all you have, there is a problem.

 

[CornKicker]

we already got justin schultz for free, how often does a superstar calibre talent go undrafted and/or end up an out of college FA?

 

[joestevens29]

we already got justin schultz for free, how often does a superstar calibre talent go undrafted and/or end up an out of college FA?

Why does it have to be a superstar? I'm not exactly someone that gets too high on these signings, but look at Toronto. Bozak, Kotska, Scrivens were College FA. Not exactly bad having both players playing 20+ minutes a night and Scrivens playing 19 games for them.

Not sure how great this link is, but something anyway.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_NHL_players_who_were_not_drafted

 

[dustrock]

There were apparently a bunch of teams chasing this guy so it's not like we were the lone wolf crying to sign him.

This just seems a lot like the Rieder/Kessy deal: meh and move on to the much larger problems with this team.

 

[oiler-dude]

So we trade a small skilled prospect for a bigger, tougher prospect and everyone screams 'WE TRADED ST. LOUIS!!! ENOUGH WITH THE COKE MACHINES!!!!"

...we sign a small skilled forward, and everyone screams "WHAT'S WITH THE SMALL PLAYERS. WE NEED COKE MACHINES!!!"

Ok then.

 

[Meanashell11]

OK, a bit of perspective here. This kids brother plays lacrosse with my son at Connecticut College so I know a bit about him personally and his family.

This kids is a leader, he is a smart hockey player and has been successful at every level he has played. He has averaged a ppg over his college career and can skate very well. Those who compare him to Feydun are right when talking about professionalism, composure and dedication. Yale is a hell of a program right now and next season they have a kid coming in, John Hayden, who I also know and have mentioned if he falls in the draft this year we should pick him up.

This is a depth signing of a quality individual who has excelled at every level he has played at. He plays much larger than his size, btw, he is at least 5' 10". The downside is totally mitigated, in my business we call this an asymmetrical payoff. Limited downside, nice upside. It's also called optionallity which in case you are wondering, it's a good thing. You always want to be long optionallity.

 

[taunting canadian]

Already did..albiet small examples..As I said, not worried about this particular signing but more worried that they can't, or won't, do the work required to get the right mix of players....Whether Miller plays or not is really inconsequential..Which is probably part of my point.

The goalie is essentially irrelevant to a discussion of the Oilers needs for size/physicality. Dekeyser signed for his home team, basically to no one's surprise. So the Oilers missed out on one college FA who could choose any of 30 teams. That's really not evidence of anything whatsoever - it's a completely meaningless datapoint, especially after the Oilers effectively landed the top "college FA" equivalent just one year ago.

In other words, if you expect your favorite team to land multiple top college FAs every year, then all you're really doing is setting yourself up for consistent disappointment. You're not exposing a flaw in the organization.

 

[Master Lok]

I agree with BBO....My biggest complaint here has little to do with this particular player. I just see a pattern again and the fact that we couldn't sign any high end FA's with size and skill but, again, got another small player.

Here's a novel idea..How about our management find players that have both..size and skill..and actually do what they're being paid to do...

Oh good lord what a ridiculous point.

1) NO ASSETS WERE GIVEN UP.
2) A college Free agent has a very low chance of making the NHL in any case. So its mostly for help in the AHL.
3) If he does become an NHL option, then that means a "no asset" acquisition just became "an asset". Which means we can trade him to another team looking for skilled players for a player with size. See the Rieder for kale Kessey trade. If Rieder never developed, regardless of his size,then he would have been worth nothing. Because he did, we were able to trade him for an equivalent prospect but one who was bigger.
4) Its not like this guy was going to be added to the Oilers lineup tomorrow. So what does it matter?
5) Who knows what the Oiler lineup will look like in three years? Perhaps at that point, we have a lineup full of coke machines and people start demanding more skill. Can't happen? That's exactly what happened in the pre-Pronger era, people were crying that we had too many grinders and coke machines (Horcoff, Reasoner, Grier, Moreau, Marchant) and not enough skilled offense.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

I would suggest there are no optics whatsoever. This is identical to the Fedun signing.

Except that Fedun was a bigger player. If Miller looks as solid in his first camp as Fedun did before the injury I'll be a happy man. This reminds me more of the Arcobello signing TBH. I'm probably flying off the handle a bit too much here and I hope nothing but the best for this guy, I just hope that we won't continue stockpiling players of his size unless they are hard to play against (which I hope that he is).

The reason you see a pattern is because large skilled guys are wanted by every team. If it was as easy as just doing it every team would be filled with guys who are 6'4' and 220lbs. Just because a certain player doesn't fill the description you want in a signing doesn't mean its a bad signing. In the past year the oil have been adding size repeatedly even trading some skill away for size. Adding another decent prospect for nothing is never a bad idea. As far as I am concerned the negativity to this signing stems from a desire for our NHL team to address needs but this is not an NHL signing it is a depth/prospect signing. Big difference.

I understand your point, and if this is in essence a move to replace Rieder's potential spot that he was penciled into next year then I can understand the thought process, or better yet if he is a hard to play against player then I'm just jumping the gun seeing his height/weight. I just worry that MacT's idea of hard to play against is a team full of Reddox' and Petersen's.

when most of the oilers other skilled players are smaller, so it does matter.
many fans have no issue with a small talented player, but when that's all you have, there is a problem.

Bingo, we already have Arcobello down there as well, to be fair if Lander stays up next year our center depth will be pretty lean in OKC.

OK, a bit of perspective here. This kids brother plays lacrosse with my son at Connecticut College so I know a bit about him personally and his family.

This kids is a leader, he is a smart hockey player and has been successful at every level he has played. He has averaged a ppg over his college career and can skate very well. Those who compare him to Feydun are right when talking about professionalism, composure and dedication. Yale is a hell of a program right now and next season they have a kid coming in, John Hayden, who I also know and have mentioned if he falls in the draft this year we should pick him up.

This is a depth signing of a quality individual who has excelled at every level he has played at. He plays much larger than his size, btw, he is at least 5' 10". The downside is totally mitigated, in my business we call this an asymmetrical payoff. Limited downside, nice upside. It's also called optionallity which in case you are wondering, it's a good thing. You always want to be long optionallity.

Thanks a lot for giving us some actual information that goes beyond his bio. Is he strong on the puck and/or physical seeing as you said that he plays bigger than he is?

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Oh good lord what a ridiculous point.

1) NO ASSETS WERE GIVEN UP.
2) A college Free agent has a very low chance of making the NHL in any case. So its mostly for help in the AHL.
3) If he does become an NHL option, then that means a "no asset" acquisition just became "an asset". Which means we can trade him to another team looking for skilled players for a player with size. See the Rieder for kale Kessey trade. If Rieder never developed, regardless of his size,then he would have been worth nothing. Because he did, we were able to trade him for an equivalent prospect but one who was bigger.
4) Its not like this guy was going to be added to the Oilers lineup tomorrow. So what does it matter?
5) Who knows what the Oiler lineup will look like in three years? Perhaps at that point, we have a lineup full of coke machines and people start demanding more skill. Can't happen? That's exactly what happened in the pre-Pronger era, people were crying that we had too many grinders and coke machines (Horcoff, Reasoner, Grier, Moreau, Marchant) and not enough skilled offense.

The difference being of course that outside of Hemsky we had very limited skill up front. At the moment we have a very high number of skilled players in our top 6, barring injuries or trades there really won't be a spot for another smallish top 6 player for at least 3-5 years, maybe more unless they are better than the guys that we have now. As a matter of opinion I see at least Hemsky and possibly Gagner getting moved out to change the dynamic of the team. We are as deep in skill as we were grinders back then, you need a balance of both, and continuing to add small/skilled players unless they have tremendous trade value simply doesn't fix that.

 

[tiger_80]

I would suggest there are no optics whatsoever. This is identical to the Fedun signing.

Yes, this is an AHL signing, which has little to no bearing on the size of the top 6 on the OIlers.

 

[The Big Unit]

The difference being of course that outside of Hemsky we had very limited skill up front. At the moment we have a very high number of skilled players in our top 6, barring injuries or trades there really won't be a spot for another smallish top 6 player for at least 3-5 years, maybe more unless they are better than the guys that we have now. As a matter of opinion I see at least Hemsky and possibly Gagner getting moved out to change the dynamic of the team. We are as deep in skill as we were grinders back then, you need a balance of both, and continuing to add small/skilled players unless they have tremendous trade value simply doesn't fix that.

Sometimes skill players who aren't skilled enough to play a regular top 6 role in the NHL develop a 2 way game that make them effective in a bottom 6 role thus saving their job in the NHL. It's possible that Miller turns into one of those guys.

 

[joestevens29]

Sometimes skill players who aren't skilled enough to play a regular top 6 role in the NHL develop a 2 way game that make them effective in a bottom 6 role thus saving their job in the NHL. It's possible that Miller turns into one of those guys.

At 24 wouldn't he have some sort of two-way game by now? Maybe he does, it's just this isn't a 17 year old that you are drafting. This is a guy that is getting close to being a finished product. He doesn't have the 2 or 3 year to try his style out and if it doesn't work convert to that two-way game.

Either way I don't mind the signing. It's a player for free under a new GM and 14 other teams wanted him. Not all moves are about the Oilers either.

 

[The Big Unit]

At 24 wouldn't he have some sort of two-way game by now? Maybe he does, it's just this isn't a 17 year old that you are drafting. This is a guy that is getting close to being a finished product. He doesn't have the 2 or 3 year to try his style out and if it doesn't work convert to that two-way game.

Either way I don't mind the signing. It's a player for free under a new GM and 14 other teams wanted him. Not all moves are about the Oilers either.

There are quite a few examples of players who didn't enter the NHL till their mid to late 20s who just worked hard and kept the dream alive. Or guys who bounced up and down before finding a niche. That's what the AHL is all about and he's likely staying there for a while anyway. I don't know that he doesn't have a two way game but I really don't think it's too late for him to develop one.

 

[Aequitas]

Except that Fedun was a bigger player. If Miller looks as solid in his first camp as Fedun did before the injury I'll be a happy man. This reminds me more of the Arcobello signing TBH. I'm probably flying off the handle a bit too much here and I hope nothing but the best for this guy, I just hope that we won't continue stockpiling players of his size unless they are hard to play against (which I hope that he is).



I understand your point, and if this is in essence a move to replace Rieder's potential spot that he was penciled into next year then I can understand the thought process, or better yet if he is a hard to play against player then I'm just jumping the gun seeing his height/weight. I just worry that MacT's idea of hard to play against is a team full of Reddox' and Petersen's.



Bingo, we already have Arcobello down there as well, to be fair if Lander stays up next year our center depth will be pretty lean in OKC.



Thanks a lot for giving us some actual information that goes beyond his bio. Is he strong on the puck and/or physical seeing as you said that he plays bigger than he is?

I understand concerns like that but personally I feel like those concerns would be more appropriate for a signing of a person say kostitsyn. Small skilled forward for the nhl roster right now. If this guy becomes an NHL player it won't be for a year or 2 at least and a roster can change alot in 2 years. I think oiler fans just forget that because of the slow moving blob known as tambo.

 

[Meanashell11]

Thanks a lot for giving us some actual information that goes beyond his bio. Is he strong on the puck and/or physical seeing as you said that he plays bigger than he is?

I would not say physical, one of those pound-for-pound kind of guys. He can strip the puck, he can come out of the corner with the puck. Not sure how familiar you are with lacrosse but the way D is played in lax, wrap checks, etc, that's how he plays. I guess strong on the puck describes it well.

 

[oilers2k10]

At worst, absolute worst he gives oilers a chance to trade him for a 4th round draft pick in the future since half the teams in the NHL were really after him (now they'll definitely trade with our roster lol)..
Its all about asset management, but I say he resigns to a two year extention by this time next year..
Sure oilers are full of small skilled players, but remember this; most of our teams talented players are under 25 yrs old..physically you often dont peak till you hit 26-28 yrs old (I'm talking pure raw strength like grip strength, explosive leg power, grit+aggression high test. stuff not puffed up creatine & weight gainer used to gain 20 lbs in two monthsgarbage)..

Size does matter..and soon enough Moroz, Kessy, Ewanyk, Musil, Marincin and mauybe Teubert will all graduate to the next level...
In the meantime theres nothin wrong with loading up on pure talent for the future, its how detroit made the playoffs for over 20 years straight, you can never have enough talent in the system..Veteran grinders can be found via free agency (brandon prust wouldve been great)

 

[Kipper933]

I caught quite a few Yale games since the Flames picked up Agostino. But Miller really caught my eye, great vision, good playmaking, the comparisons to Arcobello are pretty close, Miller is maybe a bit better. But more likely a player for OKC or a trade asset down the road.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

I understand concerns like that but personally I feel like those concerns would be more appropriate for a signing of a person say kostitsyn. Small skilled forward for the nhl roster right now. If this guy becomes an NHL player it won't be for a year or 2 at least and a roster can change alot in 2 years. I think oiler fans just forget that because of the slow moving blob known as tambo.

I really don't think that we will see any of RNH, Hall, Eberle, or Yakupov moved in the next 2 years so I still don't see a match for our top 6 and our bottom 6 has to be among the softest in the NHL if not the very softest.

I would not say physical, one of those pound-for-pound kind of guys. He can strip the puck, he can come out of the corner with the puck. Not sure how familiar you are with lacrosse but the way D is played in lax, wrap checks, etc, that's how he plays. I guess strong on the puck describes it well.

Not familiar with Lacrosse at all TBH. Strong on the puck works for me though, IMO that is a desirable attribute in any player.

I caught quite a few Yale games since the Flames picked up Agostino. But Miller really caught my eye, great vision, good playmaking, the comparisons to Arcobello are pretty close, Miller is maybe a bit better. But more likely a player for OKC or a trade asset down the road.

Thanks a lot for chiming in, Arco has been huge for OKC, if Miller can mirror that or better it, he'd be a solid addition.