All purpose trade / roster building thread part 4: We like our Jerks

[Nikishin Go Boom]

I was always under the impression that it is 10 total games and not season dependent. @Lempo?

Yes it is. On the 10th professional game you start your clock or age met, whichever comes sooner.

 

[Lempo]

I was always under the impression that it is 10 total games and not season dependent. @Lempo?

9.1(d)(ii)

In the event that a Player signs his first SPC at age 18 and has had his SPC extended pursuant to Subsection (i), and such Player does not play at least ten (10) NHL Games in the second season under that SPC, then the term of his SPC and his number of years in the Entry Level System shall be extended for one (1) additional year.


It's season dependent, not aggregate. Necas signed at 18, didn't play 10 and Slided, and thusly is again eligible for a second Slide by the same seasonal 10 Game rule as he was with the first season.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

My trade proposal was rejected by a Leafs stan on CapFriendly, so it must be a pretty even trade

Marleau (NMC waived) and RFA Kapanen for Faulk, LW prospect Kuokkanen and a 3rd

Kapanen signed for 5 years/$4.9M per.

Canes Roster with a Marleau Cap Dump - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

 

[MinJaBen]

My trade proposal was rejected by a Leafs stan on CapFriendly, so it must be a pretty even trade

Marleau (NMC waived) and RFA Kapanen for Faulk, LW prospect Kuokkanen and a 3rd

Kapanen signed for 5 years/$4.9M per.

Canes Roster with a Marleau Cap Dump - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

I'd reject that, too. Too much being given back. I'd think about Marleau and Kapanen for Faulk. Adding in Kuokkanen and the pick is too much.

 

[Tryamw]

9.1(d)(ii)

In the event that a Player signs his first SPC at age 18 and has had his SPC extended pursuant to Subsection (i), and such Player does not play at least ten (10) NHL Games in the second season under that SPC, then the term of his SPC and his number of years in the Entry Level System shall be extended for one (1) additional year.


It's season dependent, not aggregate. Necas signed at 18, didn't play 10 and Slided, and thusly is again eligible for a second Slide by the same seasonal 10 Game rule as he was with the first season.

thanks Lempo!

 

[Chrispy]

I'd reject that, too. Too much being given back. I'd think about Marleau and Kapanen for Faulk. Adding in Kuokkanen and the pick is too much.

I don't see Toronto making a Bickell/Teravainen-like trade to unload Marleau. They will find someone they can unload him on for a pick after July 1, when Marleau is only owed $1.25M but has a $6.25M cap hit.

I think they get better value trading those two separately. Kapanen can return decent value, and they can use a pick or two to unload Marleau. Maybe to Arizona, maybe to Ottawa. But Marleau also has to agree to a deal.

 

[MinJaBen]

I don't see Toronto making a Bickell/Teravainen-like trade to unload Marleau. They will find someone they can unload him on for a pick after July 1, when Marleau is only owed $1.25M but has a $6.25M cap hit.

I think they get better value trading those two separately. Kapanen can return decent value, and they can use a pick or two to unload Marleau. Maybe to Arizona, maybe to Ottawa. But Marleau also has to agree to a deal.

Yeah, I agree with all of that. And I doubt they have many options that Marleau would agree to be traded to. One of the reasons he chose Toronto was he was chasing a cup. Going to LA or Arizona or Ottawa is not likely to give him that opportunity. I could see him maybe coming here or going back to SJ, but there are few teams that could take his cap hit and are in a position to compete for a cup. Not sure SJ is in that position next year.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

Yeah, I agree with all of that. And I doubt they have many options that Marleau would agree to be traded to. One of the reasons he chose Toronto was he was chasing a cup. Going to LA or Arizona or Ottawa is not likely to give him that opportunity. I could see him maybe coming here or going back to SJ, but there are few teams that could take his cap hit and are in a position to compete for a cup. Not sure SJ is in that position next year.

This has been my point the entire time. Marleau wants to stay with a Cup contender. The Canes are the only team in the position to take Marleau's last year, specifically for this reason. SJ is a great team but have a bunch of RFAs and UFAs to sign, including Labanc, Pavelski, EK, and Meier. Therefore the Canes have the leverage IMO to ask for the moon, specifically Johnsson or Kapanen.

 

[MinJaBen]

This has been my point the entire time. Marleau wants to stay with a Cup contender. The Canes are the only team in the position to take Marleau's last year, specifically for this reason. SJ is a great team but have a bunch of RFAs and UFAs to sign, including Labanc, Pavelski, EK, and Meier. Therefore the Canes have the leverage IMO to ask for the moon, specifically Johnsson or Kapanen.

Agreed. But why do we throw in the pick and Kuokkanen?

 

[NotOpie]

The entire league knows that Toronto is in cap hell. While every team has a different story, a different set of needs, most if not all are going to be reluctant to help out a team that, frankly, has a roster to be a consistent cup contender right now. I've mentioned it elsewhere....I believe the Leafs are going to be surprised what it is going to take to alleviate the cap issues. Personally, I believe there are two significant players that will have to be moved and none of them are named Connor Brown.

 

[TheReelChuckFletcher]

Agreed. But why do we throw in the pick and Kuokkanen?

Because even with Bickell/Teravainen, the Canes had their own draft assets that they needed to give up to get the second team to agree to the cap dump. IOW, Kuokkanen and the pick are a sweetener to get Toronto to agree to send Kapanen to another Eastern team.

 

[MinJaBen]

Because even with Bickell/Teravainen, the Canes had their own draft assets that they needed to give up to get the second team to agree to the cap dump. IOW, Kuokkanen and the pick are a sweetener to get Toronto to agree to send Kapanen to another Eastern team.

The "sweetener" is a top-4 RHD and getting rid of the cap hit for Marleau. No additions necessary. Kapanen is a very good 3rd line player. I wouldn't be giving up Kuokks and the pick in addition to getting Marleau's cap hit and losing Faulk for a 3rd liner.

 

[Lempo]

Agreed. But why do we throw in the pick and Kuokkanen?

Too much Finnman.

 

[Drivebytrucker]

I see a lot of leafs fans wanting Pesce and Slavin. They have quite possibly the best contracts in the NHL for defenseman signed through 24-25.

It's a ridiculous steal and they will never be traded.

Ever....

 

[tarheelhockey]

I see a lot of leafs fans wanting Pesce and Slavin. They have quite possibly the best contracts in the NHL for defenseman signed through 24-25.

It's a ridiculous steal and they will never be traded.

Ever....

Think they'd give us Nylander for Pesce?

 

[raynman]

These playoffs are a coming out party for Slavin and Pesce. I don’t venture out to any of the other parts of the site but I imagine you’re going to be seeing a metric shit tonne of bad proposals this summer.

 

[MinJaBen]

Think they'd give us Nylander for Pesce?

No. Maybe Brown, a second, and Zaitsev. We'll need a D back...

 

[tarheelhockey]

These playoffs are a coming out party for Slavin and Pesce. I don’t venture out to any of the other parts of the site but I imagine you’re going to be seeing a metric **** tonne of bad proposals this summer.

This is one of those little side effects of making the playoffs, other than it being super fun and stabilizing the future of the franchise and whatnot.

People genuinely don't know players until they get featured in playoff games. You're dealing with spreadsheet warriors, or worse, people who base their entire opinions off a highlight reel or random comment they see somewhere. It's not till this time of year that these guys actually draw attention in real-time.

Slavin and Pesce in particular are going to take a HUGE leap up the prestige rankings because of this run.

 

[Incubajerks]

I see a lot of leafs fans wanting Pesce and Slavin. They have quite possibly the best contracts in the NHL for defenseman signed through 24-25.

It's a ridiculous steal and they will never be traded.

Ever....

As untouchable as the video guys...

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Time will tell, but that may turn out to be a whiff by Dubas. Pesce was and still is a perfect fit for the Leafs stylistically, positionally, and contractually. There's a reason why you still see Leafs fans put him in their 19-20 mock lineups on a daily basis to this day. Not only did he become available, purportedly, but the Leafs had the asset needed to go and get him. That's a rare opportunity that may not present itself again. Hockey trades can take a long time to develop.

 

[Svechnicanes]

On the other hand, I am very happy we didn't trade him. And I still (maybe delusionally) wish to think that Don Waddell also didn't make him available, but rather than Dubas asked for him.

 

[NotOpie]

Because even with Bickell/Teravainen, the Canes had their own draft assets that they needed to give up to get the second team to agree to the cap dump. IOW, Kuokkanen and the pick are a sweetener to get Toronto to agree to send Kapanen to another Eastern team.

Kapanen is coming off of a 44 point season....to take on the dump of Marleau, you're not going to give up anything other than a Faulk and that might be too much. In the Teravainen scenario we only gave up draft picks. Add to the fact that the two players had different pedigrees (Teravainen was highly touted by many scouts) and the difference is even more stark.

Think they'd give us Nylander for Pesce?

"....not without a significant +" said every Leafs fan on the main trade board.

Time will tell, but that may turn out to be a whiff by Dubas. Pesce was and still is a perfect fit for the Leafs stylistically, positionally, and contractually. There's a reason why you still see Leafs fans put him in their 19-20 mock lineups on a daily basis to this day. Not only did he become available, purportedly, but the Leafs had the asset needed to go and get him. That's a rare opportunity that may not present itself again. Hockey trades can take a long time to develop.

On the other hand, I am very happy we didn't trade him. And I still (maybe delusionally) wish to think that Don Waddell also didn't make him available, but rather than Dubas asked for him.

Personally, I believe that the deal never was close, that Waddell was the one asking for the "significant add", and that all the smoke was wishful speculation from the TSN Maple Leaf homers.

Waddell was on record saying he wasn't interested in talking trade for Nylander until he had a contract. While you never know what to believe, I'm not sure he wasn't being pretty straight forward on this one.

 

[Drivebytrucker]

Kapanen is coming off of a 44 point season....to take on the dump of Marleau, you're not going to give up anything other than a Faulk and that might be too much. In the Teravainen scenario we only gave up draft picks. Add to the fact that the two players had different pedigrees (Teravainen was highly touted by many scouts) and the difference is even more stark.



"....not without a significant +" said every Leafs fan on the main trade board.





Personally, I believe that the deal never was close, that Waddell was the one asking for the "significant add", and that all the smoke was wishful speculation from the TSN Maple Leaf homers.

Waddell was on record saying he wasn't interested in talking trade for Nylander until he had a contract. While you never know what to believe, I'm not sure he wasn't being pretty straight forward on this one.

Yeah.... he wasn't interested in Nylander until he had a contract.

Then he saw the contract and realized he wasn't interested in it either way

 

[BladeRunner66]

Just out of curiosity, would you trade with the Pens?
From NHL.com

Will there be big names moved in the offseason as a result of early playoff exits? -- @MrBen551
The team to look at is Pittsburgh Penguins. They were swept by the New York Islanders in the Eastern Conference First Round and never really had the chemistry and consistency they were hoping for all season. Center Sidney Crosby isn't going anywhere and I highly doubt the Penguins will trade center Evgeni Malkin because the return won't match what he can do for the Penguins. However, I wouldn't rule out either forward Phil Kessel or defenseman Kris Letang being traded. Kessel, who is 31 and has three years remaining on his contract, has 174 points (61 goals, 113 assists) in 164 games the past two seasons. Production is not the issue. Getting younger and faster on the wing is, especially with Malkin turning 33 and Crosby 32 this offseason. Letang turned 32 on April 24 and missed 17 games this season because of injury.

Which Jerk is most likely to be traded in the off-season?

 

[A Star is Burns]

Seems unlikely if moved that Malkin would be traded here for a number of reasons. I think most of us would agree that Kessel doesn't seem like a match for us and likely our coach, even with the tantalizing skill. And the last thing we need at the moment is another RD, and one that is aging and paid highly. Considering that one of the most speculated pieces from us that the Pens are always said to be interested in is Jordan, and he's having the end of season and playoffs he's having, I can't imagine him being moved short of a request. Not sure I really see any great fits that are realistic.